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Bosco19

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7 hours ago, Bosco19 said:

Oddly, right after purchase and install - before any updates - I flew the SoCal area in the 172 and had a great experience. Night flights were gorgeous. Moon, stars, even smoke from the fires. 40+ fps. No issues at all. Daylight was great too. Small things have been tweaked since then, but the overall experience seems to have lessened since things were "improved.".

SoCal is arguably the best looking area in the game (at least from 500+ feet up), LA to San Diego is so realistic looking, you could almost film it and replace a real flight film.

Edited by SceneryFX
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AMD 5800x | Nvidia 3080 (12gb) | 64gb ram

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I agree (try New Zealand for some great non-urban territory). And my first 2020 flights over the area after installing were truly stunning. The night lighting was really well done - a lot of downward-reflection gave roads and freeways a highly realistic feel. The area was bathed in a soft, colorful glow - very minimal pinpoint lighting. It was so well balanced that it became a toss-up: What looked more impressive? The ground, or the moon reflecting off the ocean, and the stars above? It now looks very artificial and I no longer do night flights. Unfortunate

Edited by Bosco19

Intel i7-11700K@3.60 GHZ. 32 GB RTX 4070 Ti OC
 

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23 hours ago, roi1862 said:

Lots of places in central Europe. Same thing. The inconsistency of this game can break one spirit.

Way off topic course but your comments reminded me despite my 67y I really did not fully appreciate the depth of the human footprint on planet earth until the hours of flying MSFS have unfolded.  Flying around all different areas in Western European countries I'm stunned by the fact of how much development thru and including agriculture is present.  But of course it's been under developmetn for a very long time.  I live in the US west where things are spread out much more in general.  I mean flying all thruout Italy and up to Amsterdam to Copenhagen and then on to Oslo this morning is border to border plastered w/ buildings, concrete, asphalt, crops, more buildings, roads, with a few small patches of undeveloped earth between.  I certainly knew this intellectually, but seeing it made it clear my travels by train and car and foot in Europe exposed me to almost none of....Europe!

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Noel

System:  9900K@5.0gHz@1.23v all cores, MSI MPG Z390M GAMING EDGE AC, Noctua NH-D15S w/ steady supply of 40-60F ambient air intake, Corsair Vengeance 32Gb LPX 3200mHz DDR4, Sabrent NVMe 2Tb x 2, RTX 4090 FE, Corsair RM 850W PSU, Win10 Pro, LG Ultra Curved Gsync Ultimate 3440x1440, TCA Boeing Edition Yoke & TQ, Cessna Trim Wheel, RTSS Framerate Limiter w/ Edge Sync for near zero Frametime Variance achieving ultra-fluid animation at lower frame rates.

Aircraft used in A Pilot's Life V2:  PMDG 738, Aerosoft CRJ700, FBW A320NX, WT 787X

 

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Well, another example of the human footprint - I also fly RC models. I live in New Mexico - still a seemingly vast and open territory. It’s almost impossible to find an open and readily reachable place to fly a 5-7 lb. model here. You can drive a hundred miles through lands that exhibit little or no evidence of Human activity. Yet, every square mile is fenced off and inaccessible. It is all owned by somebody - if not the Feds.

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Intel i7-11700K@3.60 GHZ. 32 GB RTX 4070 Ti OC
 

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23 hours ago, Bosco19 said:

Oddly, right after purchase and install - before any updates - I flew the SoCal area in the 172 and had a great experience. ..............................Small things have been tweaked since then, but the overall experience seems to have lessened since things were "improved.".

Yes absolutely. That's what I call crippling updates.

Too bad: flying around LA was so rewarding, now it's lower frames and stutters. And all this with the impression of a lower scenery radius an some popups that were not there one month ago (the sweet spot for me).

Another problem: my FPS go down at airports, like from 40 to 26 in one second. And if I look away from the airport while on the ground I am back at 40. On the other direction it's like 18.

Now the sim uses less memory (much less), both board memory and GPU memory, but at the price of less detail and more stutters. Too bad.

Hopefully, they are not trying to limit memory usage for some console related reason. That would be a huge mistake.

Also: the rendering thread is more demanding than the main thread, and when the rendering thread spikes we have a stutter. At least, these are my observations.

Andrea

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I think it all boils down to a point I made in other threads; they deal too much with numbers and “realism” and not enough with art - with the experience. But they can’t please everybody. There are those who get a thrill by being able to flip every switch - by being able to implement complex flight plans - by doing an array of things that only lead up to the actual flight.  I flew simple stick-and-rudder tail draggers because I got off by the 3D experience of actually flying. When I drag up memories of flying I remember things I saw and experienced from an open cockpit - the wind roaring past, telegraphing my airspeed, the details of the world only 1000 feet or so below me, the push-back of the air against my control inputs, the thrill of cranking around on a short final, into an extreme side slip and watching the threshold rush up at me, the physical symphony of it all, and the satisfaction of (rarely) getting all perfect. Some guys get off in much the same way by punching a lot of buttons and putting together a complex sequence of procedures well. I’m not sure if it’s possible to satisfy both ends of this spectrum equally.  I’m glad I’m not the one that has to do it. 


Intel i7-11700K@3.60 GHZ. 32 GB RTX 4070 Ti OC
 

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17 hours ago, ADamiani said:

Yes absolutely. That's what I call crippling updates.

Too bad: flying around LA was so rewarding, now it's lower frames and stutters. And all this with the impression of a lower scenery radius an some popups that were not there one month ago (the sweet spot for me).

Another problem: my FPS go down at airports, like from 40 to 26 in one second. And if I look away from the airport while on the ground I am back at 40. On the other direction it's like 18.

Now the sim uses less memory (much less), both board memory and GPU memory, but at the price of less detail and more stutters. Too bad.

Hopefully, they are not trying to limit memory usage for some console related reason. That would be a huge mistake.

Also: the rendering thread is more demanding than the main thread, and when the rendering thread spikes we have a stutter. At least, these are my observations.

Andrea

After reading this I have to go see if it is the case.  When I first loaded MSFS I flew KSBA to KPSP and back and performance was quite good.  It's been 3 months since I did this flight so will do it in a few minutes and see if it's anywhere near the horror you describe.


Noel

System:  9900K@5.0gHz@1.23v all cores, MSI MPG Z390M GAMING EDGE AC, Noctua NH-D15S w/ steady supply of 40-60F ambient air intake, Corsair Vengeance 32Gb LPX 3200mHz DDR4, Sabrent NVMe 2Tb x 2, RTX 4090 FE, Corsair RM 850W PSU, Win10 Pro, LG Ultra Curved Gsync Ultimate 3440x1440, TCA Boeing Edition Yoke & TQ, Cessna Trim Wheel, RTSS Framerate Limiter w/ Edge Sync for near zero Frametime Variance achieving ultra-fluid animation at lower frame rates.

Aircraft used in A Pilot's Life V2:  PMDG 738, Aerosoft CRJ700, FBW A320NX, WT 787X

 

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Noel  I wouldn't say "horror". I am just describing my observations. The whole thing is still enjoyable, all I am saying is that I am finding it less enjoyable today than 3 or 4 weeks ago, I can't remember exactly.

My first impression after buying it in august was an absolute "wow". Then after a few weeks I think we lost some detail in the distance and some popup started to appear, at the same time, water's wow factor was definitely lessened (at least for me). All this can be subjective. At the same time, I observed a reduced use of memory. This is objective. Good sign? Bad sign? Correlated with the above or with the need of optimizing for the console? I don't know, we should ask the guys at Asobo.

Then four weeks ago I had my first crashes, stutters increased, I experienced my first total blackouts (3 or four seconds doing absolutely nothing, just frozen in the air waiting) and with the latest update I noticed that performance was degraded. I also noticed that while main thread used to be responsible for stutters, now this rendering thread was possibly more frequently the culprit (at least looking at the numbers).

I am talking about a totally basic install with no custom scenery and just my faithful 172 with steam gauges.

Rig is a 10900K with 64GB RAM, 2080Ti (11GB). No overclock, everything on SSD. Separate SSD's for OS and MSFS with plenty of free space (msfs ssd is 4TB). Internet is optic fiber @1Gb, actual bandwidth 930Mb DL/ 190Mb DL, ping consistently 2 ms, negligible jitter.

I hope next update brings good news: I really like the sim and I am willing to invest on it. At this time I am not buying the 5 airports I would like to (Florence, Olbia, Saint Marteen, Innsbruck, London, Key West)  because I am under the impression that my performance might worsen, since this is what happens close to stock airports with many buildings right now: more stutters and less fps.

Andrea

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Well, interestingly I only am seeing this issue in select places and some just don't look at all like they should present a processing challenge.  Fly out of EDJA and head 155 degrees towards Fussen at 5K feet.  See how long it takes for serious perf degredation ensues, and it's really not that complex an area at all.  VRAM/RAM use seems exactly as it was on Day 1.  But there are certain areas that always generate the issue of perf degradation despite having lots of VRAM/RAM/CPU/GPU/NET BANDWIDTH headroom like the area just described, which I've attributed to their server performance for lack of a better explanation.  Got wrapped up in something and haven't had a chance to duplicate KSBA>KPSP but now can start!

 

Edited by Noel

Noel

System:  9900K@5.0gHz@1.23v all cores, MSI MPG Z390M GAMING EDGE AC, Noctua NH-D15S w/ steady supply of 40-60F ambient air intake, Corsair Vengeance 32Gb LPX 3200mHz DDR4, Sabrent NVMe 2Tb x 2, RTX 4090 FE, Corsair RM 850W PSU, Win10 Pro, LG Ultra Curved Gsync Ultimate 3440x1440, TCA Boeing Edition Yoke & TQ, Cessna Trim Wheel, RTSS Framerate Limiter w/ Edge Sync for near zero Frametime Variance achieving ultra-fluid animation at lower frame rates.

Aircraft used in A Pilot's Life V2:  PMDG 738, Aerosoft CRJ700, FBW A320NX, WT 787X

 

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1 hour ago, Noel said:

Well, interestingly I only am seeing this issue in select places and some just don't look at all like they should present a processing challenge.  Fly out of EDJA and head 155 degrees towards Fussen at 5K feet.  See how long it takes for serious perf degredation ensues, and it's really not that complex an area at all.  VRAM/RAM use seems exactly as it was on Day 1.  But there are certain areas that always generate the issue of perf degradation despite having lots of VRAM/RAM/CPU/GPU/NET BANDWIDTH headroom like the area just described, which I've attributed to their server performance for lack of a better explanation.  Got wrapped up in something and haven't had a chance to duplicate KSBA>KPSP but now can start!

 

I just did it a flight there with no issues. FPS around 60's. No stutters either.

What plane did you fly with? I flew with TBM930.


Gaming Laptop:
MSI GS75 Stealth 5.6GHz Intel Core i9 - 10th gen 16 core CPU  -  32 GB DDR4 SDRAM  - 1TB SSD - RTX 2080 Super - 1920x1080 - 3 fans and cooling pipes.

 

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30 minutes ago, BijanStudio said:

I just did it a flight there with no issues. FPS around 60's. No stutters either.

What plane did you fly with? I flew with TBM930.

As the saying goes, something may have changed.   I did it 3 times over 2 months or so and got the same issue each time, I'll try again.  TBM here too.  The fact this varies suggests it may well be on the server side.

2 hours ago, ADamiani said:

Then four weeks ago I had my first crashes, stutters increased, I experienced my first total blackouts (3 or four seconds doing absolutely nothing, just frozen in the air waiting) and with the latest update I noticed that performance was degraded.

Andrea

I just redid the KSBA>KPSP flight and no stutters, no loss of my LOCKED frame rate at 30 by vsync.  VRAM in use:  about 6800-7800.  GPU use about 84%.  RAM in use about 16000 as it always is around there.  Only a couple of GPU dominant sliders are not set at ULTRA.  I'm guessing you don't lock frame rates?  IMO not using a method to lock frame rates is a net loser most of the time.

These things, the sudden loss of perf when there is beau coup headroom in all departments, suggests it's on the server side at some level.  It may take a certain type of area plus high demand from all users at that moment in time to manifest the issue.  Fortunately, it really hardly happens for me.  In fact yesterday flew from Copenhagen to Oslo and Amsterdam the day before and it's border to border super busy w/ lots of water, cities for miles n miles, no probleme.

Edited by Noel

Noel

System:  9900K@5.0gHz@1.23v all cores, MSI MPG Z390M GAMING EDGE AC, Noctua NH-D15S w/ steady supply of 40-60F ambient air intake, Corsair Vengeance 32Gb LPX 3200mHz DDR4, Sabrent NVMe 2Tb x 2, RTX 4090 FE, Corsair RM 850W PSU, Win10 Pro, LG Ultra Curved Gsync Ultimate 3440x1440, TCA Boeing Edition Yoke & TQ, Cessna Trim Wheel, RTSS Framerate Limiter w/ Edge Sync for near zero Frametime Variance achieving ultra-fluid animation at lower frame rates.

Aircraft used in A Pilot's Life V2:  PMDG 738, Aerosoft CRJ700, FBW A320NX, WT 787X

 

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Just a couple numbers to make things reproducible (hopefully)

I am running the sim at 4K, many sliders except a couple on ultra, I can be more precise later if I take a screenshot of my settings.

For a few weeks I saw about 20 - 21 GB used in busy areas (up to 24 GB once, and I noticed it because I thought my 64GB would come handy in the future with more complex sceneries), now it's 14 - 17.

I'll try your flight Noel

Andrea

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