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Ray Proudfoot

PMDG 737NGX and the Fulcrum yoke

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I loaded a saved scenario from the days when I was using my Saitek yoke. I assumed all would be well but after take-off noticed the aircraft pulling to the left. I had already calibrated the yoke with FSUIPC but did it again just to be on the safe side.

But still the problem persisted. On checking the system display on the centre console the ailerons weren't showing level. I had to turn the yoke to the right to level them up. But they had been calibrated so why was this happening?

After landing I re-selected the aircraft from the Vehicle menu and this time the ailerons were correctly centred. I have no idea why they wouldn't be with the default C&D saved panel. I have saved a new panel state which I will use for future flights.

Just be aware if you fly the PMDG 737NGX (not u) you may have the same problem if you load a flight saved with your old yoke.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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19 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

I loaded a saved scenario from the days when I was using my Saitek yoke. I assumed all would be well but after take-off noticed the aircraft pulling to the left. I had already calibrated the yoke with FSUIPC but did it again just to be on the safe side.

But still the problem persisted. On checking the system display on the centre console the ailerons weren't showing level. I had to turn the yoke to the right to level them up. But they had been calibrated so why was this happening?

After landing I re-selected the aircraft from the Vehicle menu and this time the ailerons were correctly centred. I have no idea why they wouldn't be with the default C&D saved panel. I have saved a new panel state which I will use for future flights.

Just be aware if you fly the PMDG 737NGX (not u) you may have the same problem if you load a flight saved with your old yoke.

Hi Ray

Glad you got it sorted out. This is likely due to the saitek yoke being 10 bit if I remember correctly and the fulcrum being 12 bit. I would never have guessed that the 737 saves controller data!

The difference in resolution means that the saitek would have been off to the left. Saitek has 1000 points vs 4000 so its middle point is off to the left of the fulcrum.

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Hi Chris,

That all makes sense except for where I loaded the default C&D scenario in the CDU. I can only assume those were also saved with a 10-bit yoke attached.

I’m going to delete all my saved scenarios when I had the Saitek.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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Interesting; thanks Ray for the hint. I'll check tomorrow how it works with a Honeycomb Alpha (8-bit) vs my DIY 12-bit yoke. 

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I’ll load a couple of saved scenarios from my World Tour just to confirm it wasn’t a one-off. I could be wrong but I suspect that when you save a flight the relevant PMDG737 data is also saved into a sav file stored in the PMDG737 folder under P3Dv4.

Those sav files contain a lot of data so it seems reasonable it could include this type of info. 


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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I've checked the format of NGX .sav files- it's quite transparent with no reference to controls resolution and/ or reference points...

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7 minutes ago, SergeyPe said:

I've checked the format of NGX .sav files- it's quite transparent with no reference to controls resolution and/ or reference points...

But with correctly calibrated ailerons and elevator why would the 737NGX not show the ailerons centred? Only one thing has changed since those scenarios were saved. The yoke. Maybe the settings are stored in the other saved file which is not readable with NotePad.

And selecting the 737 from the vehicle menu shows them correctly centred. Is that because it’s reading the equipment currently connected as opposed to what was connected when the scenario was saved.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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I use a utility I got off the Leo Bodnar website called DIView to look at the raw data coming in from DirectInput.  If it's close to 50% when centered (raw value of 32768), then the calibration in Windows is OK and there's a problem downstream from that--either FSUIPC calibration or something in the sim or the add-on.  If it's significantly off from that, then I have a Windows calibration issue.

 


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Bob, is that something available to all of us? Got a link?

When calibrating with FSUIPC the range goes from -16384 to +16384 give or take very small variations.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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1 hour ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Maybe the settings are stored in the other saved file which is not readable with NotePad.

Maybe. However it seems strange that the control devices data would be saved in a saved scenario file. I'd say that each controller connected to the sim has a separate ID and should be correctly recognized including its calibration data. I'll dig a bit deeper tomorrow. 

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Thanks for the link and replies. I’ll be back tomorrow with some screenshots showing the disparity between loading a saved “Saitek” scenario and one in real time.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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1 hour ago, SergeyPe said:

Maybe. However it seems strange that the control devices data would be saved in a saved scenario file. I'd say that each controller connected to the sim has a separate ID and should be correctly recognized including its calibration data. I'll dig a bit deeper tomorrow. 

I’ll know for sure tomorrow but thinking about it the scenario file would be the logical place if it was to be saved. When FSUIPC starts one of the first things it does is to list in the log the hardware connected. That data is saved to a file in the Modules folder. I checked it after connecting the Fulcrum and everything was in order.

I assign a letter to each hardware unit in FSUIPC rather than the assigned Windows ID. I gave the Fulcrum the same letter - Y - as the Saitek so maybe Windows is using that ID and hence the Saitek saved data rather than the Fulcrum.

It might explain why there’s no problem when starting a new flight and selecting the PMDG737 from the Vehicle menu. It’s using live data rather than stored.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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Talk about frustrating. I've loaded the 737NGX both directly from the Vehicle menu in the Scenario display and also from a saved scenario saved when I had the Saitek.

In both situations the ailerons are correctly centred. I also loaded the default C&D panel state and once the systems booted up the ailerons were again correctly centred. I can only think the gremlins invaded my PC yesterday. With engines running and hydraulics on the ailerons moved through their entire range. Same for elevator.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v4.5, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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