Update on FSLTL AI freeware project

[DylanM 1,069]

2 minutes ago, Kaiii3 said:

That are fixes on the MS Server  nothing FSLTL has fixed, Sofie just shared her observations.

Yes and that's what she stated. Sharing the quote here so that folks don't need to wade through war and peace to get a few nuggets of information...🙃

Edited December 28, 2020 by DylanM

[captain420 3,099]

Can't we all just get along and play nicely together? I believe if true teamwork can be achieved, we would get a better product in the end. Look at what great things that the FBW team did for the A320 and the Working Title team did for the g3000/g1000/g3x.

Unite together and pool resources to become stronger, not divide and stay separate.

Why can't the 2 AI teams join forces to make one outstanding traffic AI package?

[Drumcode 1,892]

10 minutes ago, captain420 said:

Unite together and pool resources to become stronger, not divide and stay separate.

Why can't the 2 AI teams join forces to make one outstanding traffic AI package?

Usually all boils down to the egos and bragging rights as to who releases a better and cooler package I think. I personally don't care at all about any of this nonsense. 

[MaVe64 414]

7 minutes ago, captain420 said:

Why can't the 2 AI teams join forces to make one outstanding traffic AI package?

Because with some teams, it's not about creating something great for the community, but about stroking their own ego's. It's all about themselves.

[Azapata87 173]

6 minutes ago, Drumcode said:

Usually all boils down to the egos and bragging rights as to who releases a better and cooler package I think. I personally don't care at all about any of this nonsense. 

Was going to say this but didn’t want to ruffle any feathers. Fully agree.

Edited December 28, 2020 by Azapata87

[motishow 122]

AWSOME  , can't wait , this will chage the game absolutelly!!!!! Integration with psxseecontraffic will be awsome

Edited December 28, 2020 by motishow

[jlund 380]

I'm sure that whoever comes first will win the race 🙂 Meaning, I would very much like to have AIG's OCI for MSFS, but if FSLTL is the first ones to present a working AI pack, then people will surely go with it, as the sim really needs working AI, since Asobos live ai, is far far far from perfect.

[Silicus 849]

This is my personal opinion. I do not want to diminish any effort that is being put into this freeware endeavor.

I support freeware, if it has innovation and uses what is possible under the current technical status quo. 

Watching the trailer I am underwhelmed. Using ported aircraft with all their flaws like, sinking tires into the tarmac, no proper lighting, no turning front wheels etc - it looks outdated and tired.

This is MSFS 2020 - we need an entirely new AI system. Many AI aircraft, default, do crazy and unrealistic maneuvers. I turned AI completed off and that will not change until someone (free or pay ware) will come along and fixes it.

I will not use any ported stuff from FSX. Again, just my own opinion.  

[atco 161]

1 hour ago, MaVe64 said:

Because with some teams, it's not about creating something great for the community, but about stroking their own ego's. It's all about themselves.

That's right because investing thousands of hours of free time developing, creating and sharing at absolutely no cost thousands of AI aircraft, flightplans, models over the past 12-15 years has always been about ourselves and stroking our ego, nothing more. How selfish of us to do all that sharing with the community!
OCI is a terrible creation for the community. The horror of releasing a piece of software that adds P3D native models, and enables you to install flightplans and paints with just a single click, and the nerve of us doing it without charging! The horror.

I've seen the error of my ways, I'm clearly a selfish ego-maniac that has absolutely no desire to do anything nice for the community. Worst of all, everyone at AIG is all the same!
There's so much that goes on behind the scenes, a right way of doing things (like FLAI and World of AI for instance - in which cases permissions were all granted. But I guess its easy to ignore that when the narrative suits, right?) and there's a wrong way of doing things. One works, one doesn't. Simple as that. Some teams make it easy to work with, others make it impossible.
All you have is one side of the story and some of you may be shocked to hear this but it misses out a lot of somewhat important information and paints everything with a very slanted brush. Instead of talking in private everything with this group gets blasted out in front of the public with the clear intent to paint one side as heroic and the other side as a force of evil in the hope to leverage public opinion for a favoured outcome.

Its quite eye-opening how many of you want to slam a number of people who've provided you with some really high quality stuff for decades, for free based on very limited and biased information on matters that you simply have not been a party to. Its quite depressing the level of contempt some people have for people who work hard to make the community better and have a long track record of doing so. Some of the accusations here are downright shameful. Its no wonder so many freeware authors pack up and go away the way some of you treat people.
If I wanted to massage my ego I can think of much better ways than spending my free time giving away things to you all. Like selling them for profit for one. I get maybe 3 or 4 messages a year saying thanks for your hard work, yet I still keep on doing it and have done so for almost 20 years, so you know maybe that's not why I do it. As ego massaging exercises go this is a terrible one. You really think that our lives are so devoid of meaning that we get kicks from denying permission to a group to use our work, even though we have done it in the past multiple times? The mere fact that permission has been granted to other groups before, really doesn't make you stop and go, hmmmmmm at all?
Its a shame that those who create the content don't get the same level of appreciation that those who make flashy videos and marketing campaigns while doing 5% of the work get.

If you feel so forcefully how horrible we all are, provide us with your IP's and gamertags and we will ensure you never have to suffer the horror of using our work ever again.

Edited December 28, 2020 by atco

[Drumcode 1,892]

Dang. That’s a 3 paragraph long ego! 😝

[Tuskin38 6,452]

5 hours ago, jlund said:

but if FSLTL is the first ones to present a working AI pack, then people will surely go with it, as the sim really needs working AI, since Asobos live ai, is far far far from perfect.

FSLTL isn't touching how the AI works. From what I've gathered, is that the pack will just be files to allow the live traffic to use the models and liveries from the FLAi pack.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Tuskin38

[desbean 357]

AIG is quality that I know from way back and I have no doubt they will have a great package. First isn't always best and I'm more than willing to wait for AIG's non-rushed release, no matter how much longer it takes.

[jlund 380]

5 hours ago, Tuskin38 said:

FSLTL isn't touching how the AI works. From what I've gathered, is that the pack will just be files to allow the live traffic to use the models and liveries from the FLAi pack.

OK, I have no idea of the engine behind it, just pointed out that we need some better AI than what's currently in the sim, AND the first one (pay or freeware) that can do that, will get a head start. 

I have used AIG in P3D and I don't mind waiting for them to give us the same quality for MSFS. 

[MaVe64 414]

11 hours ago, atco said:

That's right because investing thousands of hours of free time developing, creating and sharing at absolutely no cost thousands of AI aircraft, flightplans, models over the past 12-15 years has always been about ourselves and stroking our ego, nothing more. How selfish of us to do all that sharing with the community!
OCI is a terrible creation for the community. The horror of releasing a piece of software that adds P3D native models, and enables you to install flightplans and paints with just a single click, and the nerve of us doing it without charging! The horror.

I've seen the error of my ways, I'm clearly a selfish ego-maniac that has absolutely no desire to do anything nice for the community. Worst of all, everyone at AIG is all the same!
There's so much that goes on behind the scenes, a right way of doing things (like FLAI and World of AI for instance - in which cases permissions were all granted. But I guess its easy to ignore that when the narrative suits, right?) and there's a wrong way of doing things. One works, one doesn't. Simple as that. Some teams make it easy to work with, others make it impossible.
All you have is one side of the story and some of you may be shocked to hear this but it misses out a lot of somewhat important information and paints everything with a very slanted brush. Instead of talking in private everything with this group gets blasted out in front of the public with the clear intent to paint one side as heroic and the other side as a force of evil in the hope to leverage public opinion for a favoured outcome.

Its quite eye-opening how many of you want to slam a number of people who've provided you with some really high quality stuff for decades, for free based on very limited and biased information on matters that you simply have not been a party to. Its quite depressing the level of contempt some people have for people who work hard to make the community better and have a long track record of doing so. Some of the accusations here are downright shameful. Its no wonder so many freeware authors pack up and go away the way some of you treat people.
If I wanted to massage my ego I can think of much better ways than spending my free time giving away things to you all. Like selling them for profit for one. I get maybe 3 or 4 messages a year saying thanks for your hard work, yet I still keep on doing it and have done so for almost 20 years, so you know maybe that's not why I do it. As ego massaging exercises go this is a terrible one. You really think that our lives are so devoid of meaning that we get kicks from denying permission to a group to use our work, even though we have done it in the past multiple times? The mere fact that permission has been granted to other groups before, really doesn't make you stop and go, hmmmmmm at all?
Its a shame that those who create the content don't get the same level of appreciation that those who make flashy videos and marketing campaigns while doing 5% of the work get.

If you feel so forcefully how horrible we all are, provide us with your IP's and gamertags and we will ensure you never have to suffer the horror of using our work ever again.

Cool story, Bro.

Stop playing the victim card and tell us where in this tantrum is FSLTL doing something horrible wrong? Tell us, where is FSLTL modifying your work and hosting it on their own site? Where is FSLTL violating any rights you have as a developer?

You can't, because it's not happening. The only thing FSLTL is doing is making your work available for the users of MSFS, for the users of VATSIM. It seems like you don't want your work to be used.

Also, you're wrong about me only having only one side of the story. What about FSLTL and FLAI sending emails, trying to contact people via social media, etc., with complete silence on your teams side for over 2 months? Asking not only permission but also wanting to join teams? You are blatantly lying about what went on behind the scenes.

And you're giving credit to FLAI for doing the same? While your team now wants to throw FLAI under the bus by the way, great people on your side!

Stop acting like you're so hurt by FSLTL not violating any rights whatsoever, and help the MSFS and VATSIM community by only doing one thing: letting people use your work.... that's all!

Edited December 29, 2020 by MaVe64

[dave belsey 54]

Personally, I would just like to have decent aircraft in the sky.

If there are multiple offerings that is great - I will use whichever seems to be the best.

With this much antagonism it may well be the case that a Payware version comes out first, so be it.

Dave.