5 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

@Chock, I did think of that but there are two pilots so surely one is capable of talking to ATC. Think back to the AF Concorde crash at Paris and even in their dire situation they did speak to ATC.

How long does it take to declare an emergency? A few seconds.

True, but think of some extreme circumstances. Maybe there's an elevator jammed down and the thing is inverted with -2G as both crew members desperately haul back on the yokes with their feet on the panel trying to overcome the jammed control. If you were straining like that, the last thing you'd be thinking of doing, would be retrieving your David Clarkes off the cabin ceiling, which is now the floor, then popping them back on your head and sorting the mike boom out, then pressing the transmit button on the yoke and letting ATC know about it.

Edited January 18, 20215 yr by Chock

12 minutes ago, Chock said:

True, but think of some extreme circumstances. Maybe there's an elevator jammed down and the thing is inverted with -2G as both crew members desperately haul back on the yokes with their feet on the panel trying to overcome the jammed control.

Can you think of any crashes where that has happened? What would cause an elevator to jam when a couple of minutes earlier it had operated flawlessly in rotation? Unless maintenance had been skipped or neglected I suppose.

I understand that aircraft had flown many times since the lockdown was eased.

I'm not suggesting that exact scenario, I'm just saying that in situations where there are control issues and extreme forces, for example a rudder hard over causing the thing to go inverted (which has occurred with 737s), these are situations which could make comms the very last thing on your mind.

@Chock, fair enough. We’ll know at some point what actually happened.

Yup, hopefully that is true.

56 minutes ago, Chock said:

True, but think of some extreme circumstances. Maybe there's an elevator jammed down and the thing is inverted with -2G as both crew members desperately haul back on the yokes with their feet on the panel trying to overcome the jammed control. If you were straining like that, the last thing you'd be thinking of doing, would be retrieving your David Clarkes off the cabin ceiling, which is now the floor, then popping them back on your head and sorting the mike boom out, then pressing the transmit button on the yoke and letting ATC know about it.

 

14 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Can you think of any crashes where that has happened? What would cause an elevator to jam when a couple of minutes earlier it had operated flawlessly in rotation? Unless maintenance had been skipped or neglected I suppose.

Alaska Airlines 261 and Delta Air Lines 1080.

Also, look how quickly it can go wrong on a flight deck when problem fixing takes precedence over flying the aeroplane: AirAsia 8501

Not to forget that EgyptAir 804 never made a Mayday call either.
 

1 hour ago, F737NG said:

1 hour ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Can you think of any crashes where that has happened? 

 Delta Air Lines 1080. 

In fairness, Delta Air Lines Flight 1080 did not crash. It landed. The issue was adressed and  it`s captain, Jack McMahan, was awarded the FAA's Distinguished Service Award.

7 hours ago, Chock said:

 these are situations which could make comms the very last thing on your mind.

One of the first thing my IP taught me during an emergency situation: aviate, navigate, communicate - in that order. 

Could be what happened here as you suggested. They were so focused on aviating and fixing the problem that they didn’t have time to communicate, which is understandable if they were in a bad situation.

This is from today’s Daily Telegraph...

Crash investigators in Indonesia are probing whether a malfunctioning automatic throttle could have brought down the Sriwijaya Air flight that nosedived into the Java Sea on Jan 9, killing 62 on board.

A person familiar with the inquiry told Bloomberg the autothrottle was producing more thrust in one of the Boeing 737-500’s two engines after the plane took off from Jakarta’s Soekarno-Hatta airport. This can cause a plane to roll on its side and descend abruptly.

The source said there were problems with the device on previous flights.

 

It happenned with TAROM Flight 371.  Nose-down dive after takeoff. But that was an A310.

On 1/22/2021 at 11:30 PM, Ray Proudfoot said:

......a malfunctioning automatic throttle...

.. Would the crew not realise (uncommanded yaw, bank and differing instrument reading perhaps?),disconnect the autothrottle and then recover? I'm sorry, but this would be an obvious question, at least in this layman's armchair pilot way of thinking.  

That is exactly what I was thinking. However, maybe the plane reacts so quickly that there is no time to recover?

8 hours ago, HighBypass said:

.. Would the crew not realise (uncommanded yaw, bank and differing instrument reading perhaps?),disconnect the autothrottle and then recover? I'm sorry, but this would be an obvious question, at least in this layman's armchair pilot way of thinking.  

To be honest Mark I've stopped thinking about the possible causes of this accident. I just posted that report as it was the only info I've seen in recent days. If the problem was reported by earlier crews you'd expect the problem to have been fixed. And yes, disconnecting the auto-throttles should be the obvious thing to do.

8 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

However, maybe the plane reacts so quickly that there is no time to recover?

I would have also thought that airliner engines, although powerful, take a bit of time to spool up, unlike an afterburning turbojet in a fighter (far less spool up time). 

I tend to agree with you, which is why I am keeping an open mind.