17 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

It is absurd to try to claim that default X-Plane can compare to MS2020? With regard to the trees turn on shadows and look up close.

Im not claiming anything, @Pastaiolo said that xplane almost default screenshot would require [purchasing?] custom scenery in msfs.

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by mSparks

1 hour ago, mSparks said:

really?

wow, even that XP11.11 video flying around it was was basically default scenery, all i really did was add some trees and a default hanger to default with WED. How bad is it? Completely missing?

 

I don't see the point of this exactly, i can send you the screen in PM if you want 🙂

It looks like nothing special because the location is exactly like that. There is a generic building and the usual orthophoto. What i meant is that there won't be what you added, 3d trees in the vicinity, helicopters and little objects etc etc

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by Pastaiolo

25 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

3d trees in the vicinity, helicopters and little objects etc etc

Apart from a few of the trees that's virtually default XP11.51 scenery with orthophoto. XP11+1 default will be miles better to, because it shouldn't need the trees tidying up. You can actually fly those helicopters, cos, you know, its a flight simulator......

The S76 is even a default heli (although you can download my fixes for it here):

https://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/files/file/50881-updated-sikorsky-s-76-for-xp-1130/

And John Brays Gazelle is ready for startup on the helipad.

https://github.com/John-Bray/GAZL-1132-BETA

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by mSparks

30 minutes ago, mSparks said:

Im not claiming anything, @Pastaiolo said that xplane almost default screenshot would require [purchasing?] custom scenery in msfs.

I only said that you can't pick a location, which you have improved with objects, orthos etc etc and compare it with a default scenery.

This woudn't work for a famous location, let alone for a location only you probably know about.

Ps: i fly helicopters often, i am aware of it and i'll eagerly wait to fly more of them in XP12 with the new lighting and clouds. Those two things will make everything better.

So to keep things more in topic, that's what i expect from XP12 (and what we know in some way devs are working on): lighting and clouds. Flight dynamics wise i am pretty happy with what i have in XP.

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by Pastaiolo

10 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

I only said that you can't pick a location, which you have improved with objects, orthos etc etc and compare it with a default scenery.

So all the claims of "I can see my house" in MSFS are worthless hyperbole..... unsurprising..

Or are you still missing the point that it is "as good as" default XP scenery", XP12 default scenery will be better than that during its cycle tho, because its an actual heliport using default scenery objects it can be added to the default scenery via gateway. At which point.....

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by mSparks

8 minutes ago, mSparks said:

So all the claims of "I can see my house" in MSFS are worthless hyperbole..... unsurprising..

I found my house in MFS... it was a 5 storey office block instead of a 2-storey family home, but it was there.. Most of the buildings are where they should be, but the types and height aren't accurate. It bothers me in areas and countries I know, but anywhere else I don't care as I wouldn't know the difference.

N.B. I have very accurate scenery of my home country in X-Plane, but only because I made it myself and put some effort in to it. The default scenery is pretty awful and nothing like the real thing. I'll give credit to MFS in that at least the default scenery looks decent here, but it's by no means particularly accurate or convincing as it is in the US etc...

 

7 minutes ago, mSparks said:

So all the claims of "I can see my house" in MSFS are worthless hyperbole..... unsurprising..

What are you even talking about? What does this have to do with the topic?

Everybody knows by now that such claim is only truthful for locations covered with photogrammetry.

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by Pastaiolo

3 minutes ago, Pastaiolo said:

What are you even talking about? What does this have to do with the topic?

Everybody knows by now that such claim is only truthful for locations covered with photogrammetry.

We were talking about VFR support, you know, how great (and better) MSFS is at VFR because

On 1/26/2021 at 7:23 PM, VFXSimmer said:

g - my old house in Rockville, MD was my house, not just a generic box. 

And how in the future LR needs to be better just to be as good.

Then it turns out to be hyperbole and XP11 is already better and about to be much much better.

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by mSparks

1 hour ago, Pastaiolo said:

What are you even talking about? What does this have to do with the topic?

Everybody knows by now that such claim is only truthful for locations covered with photogrammetry.

That's not exactly true.  In places with photogrammetry you will get a true representation of your house (or other building for that matter) that looks pretty great up until the last 100' or so. 

(Its funny how some of the same people who dont want to waste cpu power on 'eye candy' will also complain that PG looks bad at street level .. parking your zibo737 on residential streets now are ya?  Thats not exactly following standard operating procedures now is it?... /snark over)

However, even if a building isnt covered by PG, there is almost always some building that has been correctly placed and estimated by the Blackshark A.I.  Its not perfect - its not really possible for any A.I. system like this to ever be, but it does a pretty decent job.  Think of this as a more spiffed up World2Xplane... (which btw, since Tony is in this thread I want to formally tip my hat to! Amazing tool! I really had a good time with it in Xplane and pushed it as hard as i could with OSM's limitations).  One of the advantages that the MSFS system has, however, is that its system uses satellite imagery in addition to databases like Bing & OSM to make an even "better guess" - often getting a match on roof color, slope, etc. and will match the shape even if the street map sources aren't very detailed in that regard (which is often the case in OSM)

But just like Tony said, we all are individually interested in our own specific things.  He fixed up his own house.  I fixed up my childhood home as well in xplane and will probably do the same in msfs sometime soon. I also suspect mSparks has some personal attachment to a helicopter pad in the middle of nowhere?  The great thing is that both sims allow you to go in add your own scenery to augment whats there.  I've been doing a lot of that in MSFS lately and its scenery editor is pretty awesome since you can do it "in game", allowing you to fly around all angles to get things blended in well.  WED would do well to add such a capability.

.. so again back to the point of the thread and to be constructive..  I would add a request in XP12 to improve WED and give scenery designers the ability to edit in Xplane's game engine.  Will only improve the things they are able to do.

 

1 hour ago, VFXSimmer said:

I also suspect mSparks has some personal attachment to a helicopter pad in the middle of nowhere?

is the gateway to

without the 5 hour minibus (see my profile photo)

But the weather can be a bit dicey, so I like to practice whenever I can.

MS promised me a better flight simulator

Delivery so far.... Laminar making them look like fools.... And they haven't even shown us what they think "next gen" looks like yet....

Edited January 28, 20215 yr by mSparks

2 hours ago, mSparks said:

Im not claiming anything, @Pastaiolo said that xplane almost default screenshot would require [purchasing?] custom scenery in msfs.

It is my opinion that in terms of visual fidelity MS2020 has moved the genre forward. Certainly with regard to performance. And I very much fear that LR cannot now catch up.

13 minutes ago, mSparks said:

is the gateway to

without the 5 hour minibus (see my profile photo)

But the weather can be a bit dicey, so I like to practice whenever I can.

MS promised me a better flight simulator

Delivery so far.... Laminar making them look like fools.... And they haven't even shown us what they think "next gen" looks like yet....

Wow, nice shots of xplane scenery... oh wait...

videos are lovely.. your conclusions.. not so much

 

3 hours ago, tonywob said:

You can see an example of MFS scenery taken outside the context of the sim here (i.e. No fancy lighting etc):

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/bgldec-a-resample-bgl-decompressor.433789/post-871288

 😲 Eye opening... As many of us suspect, lighting and other visual effects are possibly even more important than the scenery itself. The supposedly advantage of having streamed scenery, might not be as important as most people think...

9 minutes ago, Murmur said:

 😲 Eye opening... As many of us suspect, lighting and other visual effects are possibly even more important than the scenery itself. The supposedly advantage of having streamed scenery, might not be as important as most people think...

A modern lighting model will certainly help xplane - i would be shocked if that wasnt being planned.  That isnt really the point of the streamed scenery, however.  The streamed data allows the sim to show the actual buildings and orthographic imagery as opposed to generic autogen and landclass tiles.  Currently the only way to do this in xplane is to do it yourself and dedicate a lot of hard disk space.   But we all know this already as its been beaten to death.

Its a pretty simple discussion.  If you like generic then xplane doesnt need to do much.  If you want a realistic representation of the earth, the tasks for LR to take have been spelled out pretty clearly - would personally love to see them implemented in XP12.

22 minutes ago, VFXSimmer said:

A modern lighting model will certainly help xplane - i would be shocked if that wasnt being planned.  That isnt really the point of the streamed scenery, however.  The streamed data allows the sim to show the actual buildings and orthographic imagery as opposed to generic autogen and landclass tiles.  Currently the only way to do this in xplane is to do it yourself and dedicate a lot of hard disk space.   But we all know this already as its been beaten to death.

Its a pretty simple discussion.  If you like generic then xplane doesnt need to do much.  If you want a realistic representation of the earth, the tasks for LR to take have been spelled out pretty clearly - would personally love to see them implemented in XP12.

If you mean improved lighting, atmosphere, weather, clouds, etc., the "unofficial" rumor is that they're all being targeted for the next release of XP. I'm also optimistic about the performance that LR will manage to squeeze out after the switch to Vulkan.

That image is unmistakable though: lighting and other rendering effect make for 90% of the final visual result.