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boez

v1.13.16.0 - screen tearing not a bug but a design change

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Genuine thanks Boez.  I was hoping you would come along and clarify this.

I have a very fast CPU which is hardly used (5.1Ghz), but my 1080Ti struggles a bit.  Should I set pre-rendered to 1 do you think?

Edited by bobcat999
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41 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

Genuine thanks Boez.  I was hoping you would come along and clarify this.

I have a very fast CPU which is hardly used (5.1Ghz), but my 1080Ti struggles a bit.  Should I set pre-rendered to 1 do you think?

I usually don't give advice for the reason stated 🙂 leaving at default is the safest option! A sound approach is to turn all settings to min, thus ensure smooth fps (if not then you've no chance of getting it smooth!) then gradually increase. There are a few guides as to what affects gpu v CPU the most but generally screen resolution, AA, lighting effects, etc are gpu intensive so you need to be careful there. This is laborious but ensures the settings match your system. 

 

Edit: to add that ideally you should do every setting one by one and return that setting to min before moving onto the next. Then based on these findings select the best combination. This is the Six Sigma approach but impractical for so many settings! 

Edited by boez
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Actually I've been thinking about your Q some more and still come to the conclusion that leaving it at default of 3 (BTW that's probably what causes confusion of triple buffering!). Here's why...

In your case with a stronger CPU that GPU, after less than a second of starting MSFS that pre-render queue will be filled up and the CPU will be *forced* to wait on the GPU. Any new frame added will be rendered eventually but the queue will stay at 3 (see later for exceptions so this). If you set the length to 1 then the queue fills up instantly but the CPU is still forced to wait. In other words the CPU % use and fps will be identical (but can you spot why in fast shooter games the latter option has an advantage?). In both cases the GPU slows up the CPU.

However, lets assume the CPU now has to go off and fetch some texture from the disk (or internet) and this takes a long time (longer than 1 single frametime of e.g. 33msecs) - with a full queue of 3 pre-renders the GPU still can continue working (as it has instructions in the queue) and the queue length is reduced by 1 (or more) entries. But NO STUTTER 🙂 (Providing the CPU being busy doesn't last *too* long!). When you only have a pre-render queue of 1 then in the same scenario the GPU is available for work BUT has nothing to do, no instructions, nada, so it stalls and STUTTER. Eventually in both cases the CPU will catchup and re-fill the queue but by using 3 pre-render queue we have smoothed over a potential stutter. 

*Answer to Q: As flight sim enthusiasts we have an advantage that time delay (latency) is not too much of an issue. We are not trying to kill a fast moving enemy! With pre-render queue of 3 then we POTENTIALLY have a time delay of (e.g.)33msecs * 3 seconds since a frame was first requested but before it is seen on the screen. Enough to miss the target...hmmm not so sure but hey I'm no gamer. Hence a lot of the tips we should be careful about implementing come from first person shooter forums and they should be disregarded IF you prefer smoothness over lower time delay (latency).

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Excellent - thanks once again Boez.  This is really useful and I have never seen it explained in such detail before.  Yes, Smoothness over latency definitely for this sim.

When I checked in Nvidia Inspector, my MSFS profile setting for prerendered was actually already set to application controlled, so I will leave it at that now, as I seem to have a very smooth experience now locked at 30 FPS.

Time to stop tweaking and do more flying I think - thanks for your excellent input! :biggrin:

 


I like to fool airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio!

Intel i9 12900k in a ROG Strix Z690 D4 motherboard with water cooling, EVGA RTX 3080Ti Ultra, 32 GB DDR4 RAM 3800 CL15, 4 x Samsung 1 TB NVME M.2, with MSFS on a Samsung 980 pro PCIE4 (7000 gb/s).

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Always good to have someone who knows what that are talking about to clarify what is going in in the inner workings of the pc.

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<p>vrs_supporter.png

 

Paul Sleight

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I can confirm good results with vsync=on and fps=30 in the graphics settings. 🙂

This is a departure for me, since I had been using RTSS before the update.

Great find!

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Bert

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23 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

I can confirm good results with vsync=on and fps=30 in the graphics settings. 🙂

This is a departure for me, since I had been using RTSS before the update.

Great find!

Yes, RTSS was great when we needed it, but it is redundant now.

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I like to fool airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio!

Intel i9 12900k in a ROG Strix Z690 D4 motherboard with water cooling, EVGA RTX 3080Ti Ultra, 32 GB DDR4 RAM 3800 CL15, 4 x Samsung 1 TB NVME M.2, with MSFS on a Samsung 980 pro PCIE4 (7000 gb/s).

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Well I was one of the "wow game changer people" untill today.

I loaded up the TBM and it was horrable.

I then did some testing, with FRAPS on with MSFS VS ON and 30 FPS, FRAPS showing 57 FPS, so i put RTSS on and set FPS to 100 and both couters showed 57 FPS.

So a long story short am back to RTSS but have turned NVCP Low latency Mode to Ultra and RTSS simply locked to 40, no -1 as ive would love to read a manual saying what that -1 does.


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I have a 3080 running at 1440p and even though I can get ~50 in the bus, I feel like it's not smooth at all. I will try to lock at 30fps in game and v-sync on. 

If this gives me smoothness, it would suck to only be able to run this game at 30fps knowing that I have a 3080 ;(

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After some testing with in game vsync and fps locked to 30, I'm not seeing any improvement in the smoothness...

Also, why I am going over 30fps if it's locked at 30fps?

image.png

Edited by Clem116

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36 minutes ago, Clem116 said:

After some testing with in game vsync and fps locked to 30, I'm not seeing any improvement in the smoothness...

Also, why I am going over 30fps if it's locked at 30fps?

Install Nvidia driver 460.89. I switched back to that driver and running perfectly smooth on my 3080. 

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I just did a flight from KLAS to KSAN live weather etc in the CJ4 mod. Not only the best flight I have done in MSFS but the smoothest. 

RTSS FPS set to 40. NVCP setting power = Perfer max. texture filtering Quility= High performance. MSFS setting = Low lattency mode = Ultra.

I use TrackIR, smooth as silk.


David Murden  MSFS  Fenix A320  • PMDG 737 • 

• Fenix A320 Walkthrough PDF •  https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/619277-fenix-a320-pdf-walk-through/  • 

DCS  A10c II  F-16c  F/A-18c • (Others in hanger) • Supercarrier  Terrains • Nevada NTTR  Persian Gulf  Syria 

• 10900K@4.9 All Cores HT ON   32GB DDR4  3200MHz RTX 3080  • TM Warthog HOTAS • TM TPR • Corsair Virtuoso XT with Dolby Atmos®  Samsung G7 32" 1440p 240Hz • TrackIR 5 & ProClip

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18 minutes ago, Donka said:

Install Nvidia driver 460.89. I switched back to that driver and running perfectly smooth on my 3080. 

And you have in sim vsync on and set to 30FPS?


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10 minutes ago, Clem116 said:

And you have in sim vsync on and set to 30FPS?

You said you were running at 1440? I know this will sound weird, but, try and push your render scale to 120-40 range. And set terrain LOD at 100. Then report back... 

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4 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

You said you were running at 1440? I know this will sound weird, but, try and push your render scale to 120-40 range. And set terrain LOD at 100. Then report back... 

That will increase smoothness?


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