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PMDG 777-200ER Released

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31 minutes ago, Noel said:

Can you tell me how to find it per chance?  I looked on the PMDG website and could not find it for registered users of the prior version 777.  Thanks in advance

You have to uninstall your current aircraft, Download the new installers again. Or via PMDG Ops center update.

Edited by RW1
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2 hours ago, RW1 said:

You have to uninstall your current aircraft, Download the new installers again. Or via PMDG Ops center update.

In my understanding the new installer must be used first.

The PMDG Ops center in a second step for micro-updates.

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1 hour ago, Simicro said:

In my understanding the new installer must be used first.

The PMDG Ops center in a second step for micro-updates.

That is the correct procedure with this update.


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4 hours ago, honanhal said:

the conventional wisdom in places like Avsim seems to have more or less crystallized that they’ve lost the “most sophisticated high-end developer” title to FSL. 

James

Is that because Lefteris left PMDG to start FSL ?

On another note, I really think PMDG has lost some sales over previous releases with the 737 NGXu and the 777-200ER expansion.  I realize I am only one data point, however, I would buy everything from them in the past and has skipped these two updates.  I will probably be back for their MSFS releases but definitely taking a pass for now.

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4 minutes ago, MarkW said:

Is that because Lefteris left PMDG to start FSL ?

On another note, I really think PMDG has lost some sales over previous releases with the 737 NGXu and the 777-200ER expansion.  I realize I am only one data point, however, I would buy everything from them in the past and has skipped these two updates.  I will probably be back for their MSFS releases but definitely taking a pass for now.

I think NGXu was a massive seller, despite some negativity that you'll read on Avsim (which tends to be quite anti-PMDG these days). I understand, as I resented purchasing it at the time, but the cost per hour spent flying has been miniscule for me - so in hindsight I'm very happy that I bought this plane. Like a lot of people, I find the 737 to be very usable in-sim, so having a good version for P3D v5 is highly valued.

The 777-200ER is more of a niche release, just like the BBJ and 737 freighter expansions.  


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4 hours ago, honanhal said:

Maybe so. Not sure a thread full of prior PMDG customers saying they’ve lost them with this new addon’s pricing is the most persuasive place to make that argument, though!

PMDG can and do make business mistakes. And I’ll be blunt: it took a few years, but the conventional wisdom in places like Avsim seems to have more or less crystallized that they’ve lost the “most sophisticated high-end developer” title to FSL. If I were PMDG, I’d be taking time to take stock and reorient to reestablish the brand as top dog.

James

Avsim is not a very good place to judge PMDG sentiment. It used to be an over-the-top PMDG fan club around here, then most of the heavy jet fliers left for the PMDG forums after the great schism. Now the tone of discussions about PMDG products tends to be very negative on this site.

FSL is a sophisticated high-end developer, but so is PMDG. I suspect PMDG has sold a lot more copies of their 737s than FSL has of the A320, but of course I can't back this up with hard data. Both devs have done a good job of replicating complex machinery.

I can say personally, as someone who owns both PMDG and FSL products, my PMDG planes spend a lot more time actually flying in Prepar3d than my FSL bus does.

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Rob

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16 minutes ago, MarkW said:

On another note, I really think PMDG has lost some sales over previous releases with the 737 NGXu and the 777-200ER expansion.  I realize I am only one data point, however, I would buy everything from them in the past and has skipped these two updates.

I am much in the same boat. PMDG releases used to be instant buying decisions for me and I usually struck on release day. I think they got the pricing wrong and would imagine that they would generate more revenue overall if they dialled the price point back to that of previous releases (~$40 mark), but that’s just wild speculation on my part. They probably have a solid idea how to price their product and decided they can do just fine without my cash or yours. 


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2 hours ago, OzWhitey said:

some negativity that you'll read on Avsim (which tends to be quite anti-PMDG these days).

And there is a very good reason for that.
 
On the PMDG forum if God forbid you to complain or potentially find a bug a high number of people, certain beta tester and including RSR will jump on you or even ban you from posting because you dared to point out discrepancies about the software. They cannot take criticism.
 
They are their own enemy, actually, they don't need much outside help.
 
To be honest, both (FSL, Majestic, and PMDG) have certain bugs (bigger or smaller) but when you constantly fight with the customer and ban people left and right, show an arrogant attitude, constantly releasing software with bugs becomes very difficult to have a positive discussion or attitude towards any developer.
 
Many of us have different views or opinions and that doesn't make one wrong or right, actually many developers will take into consideration complaints and improve their product, not shutting down opinions or possible bugs.
 
And we should take into consideration a very good and true statement of @fluffyflops about having unfinished and buggy products released and sold to the public.
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3 minutes ago, killthespam said:
And there is a very good reason for that.
 
On the PMDG forum if God forbid you to complain or potentially find a bug a high number of people, certain beta tester and including RSR will jump on you or even ban you from posting because you dared to point out discrepancies about the software. They cannot take criticism.
 
They are their own enemy, actually, they don't need much outside help.
 
To be honest, both (FSL, Majestic, and PMDG) have certain bugs (bigger or smaller) but when you constantly fight with the customer and ban people left and right, show an arrogant attitude, constantly releasing software with bugs becomes very difficult to have a positive discussion or attitude towards any developer.
 
Many of us have different views or opinions and that doesn't make one wrong or right, actually many developers will take into consideration complaints and improve their product, not shutting down opinions or possible bugs.
 
And we should take into consideration a very good and true statement of @fluffyflops about having unfinished and buggy products released and sold to the public.

Lol, as I said - the current Avsim crowd tend to be very negative about PMDG! 🙂

 

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Rob

Sim rig: Intel Core i9 9900K @ 5GHz, Asus ROG Maximus XI Code, MSI 2080 Ti, GSkill DDR4 32 GB, NZXT Kraken. 

Current sims: P3D v5, MSFS, X-plane 11, Aerofly FS2 and DCS. 

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12 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

The idea was started 15 years ago by captainsim and has been a cancer on our community ever since. 

That's a little harsh, I did a few flights with the CS757 this past week and it was quite enjoyable, their 757 is much better than the QW and I've had it now for two+ years and paid $25 for it and it has had many updates and a free update to v5.

Bought PMDG 737 + expansion for full price at some $125 near the end of v4.5 and no migration for that version, no free update to v5 not even a discount, now they want another $125.

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4 hours ago, OzWhitey said:

I think NGXu was a massive seller, despite some negativity that you'll read on Avsim (which tends to be quite anti-PMDG these days). I understand, as I resented purchasing it at the time, but the cost per hour spent flying has been miniscule for me - so in hindsight I'm very happy that I bought this plane. Like a lot of people, I find the 737 to be very usable in-sim, so having a good version for P3D v5 is highly valued.

The 777-200ER is more of a niche release, just like the BBJ and 737 freighter expansions.  

I just used the v4 to v5 redirect to install my existing NGX into P3D v5.  Works perfectly fine.  My thinking here was that I would wait until the MSFS release to purchase.  I mainly fly the FSL A320 on shorthaul these days so no major desire to purchase the 737 for v5.


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2 hours ago, FPStewy said:

That's a little harsh, I did a few flights with the CS757 this past week and it was quite enjoyable, their 757 is much better than the QW and I've had it now for two+ years and paid $25 for it and it has had many updates and a free update to v5.

Bought PMDG 737 + expansion for full price at some $125 near the end of v4.5 and no migration for that version, no free update to v5 not even a discount, now they want another $125.

i point i was maklng is (from memory)  they were the first to do "pay to beta"  followed by air simmer and then followed by BBS.

i didnt say if it was any good or not.  but it directly lead to lowering of standards and the normalising of pay to beta, and half finished products that we have witnessed in mass over the last 5 to 10 years.

As I said many times  Aerosoft cant even be bothered to pull up a chart and check an Ils frequency.  A job that would take no less than 2 mins.  "its not our product" ,

Orbx lets developers such as Gayasim release dreadful proformance products  "we will speak to the developer" 

And let us not forget PMDG just released an aircraft without spinning engines.

Its just shoddy workmanship, and no one  ever says anything.  We all work hard, we give them our money, I expect a certain standard off them.  

Its not too much to ask for a spinning engine or a correct ils freqency in an afcad is it,   Its that simple.  thats my beef with it.

 

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3 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

they were the first to do "pay to beta"

Beta is a very good thing, beta means that the product is still being developed and it's not yet completed and the developers acknowledge this and it's showing respect to the user base. When PMDG or MSFS release a finish product, they are borderline consumer misleading when in reality it's obviously very much still an unfinished product or "beta".

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The borderline between a beta (or unfinished product) and a finished product with issues or bugs is not easy to establish.

In the latter case, the developer is (normally) not ***aware*** of the issues when he releases the product.

Also nowadays, no released software is bug free. So maybe a finished product should not feature ***significant*** bugs or issues?

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13 minutes ago, Simicro said:

The borderline between a beta (or unfinished product) and a finished product with issues or bugs is not easy to establish.

In the latter case, the developer is (normally) not ***aware*** of the issues when he releases the product.

Also nowadays, no released software is bug free. So maybe a finished product should not feature ***significant*** bugs or issues?

I ended up paying full price for a beta product MSFS and it had a ton of bugs and still has some.

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