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Kuragiman

Back on P3Dv5 with VoxATC - Solutions?

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I have not used P3D since v3.  I have been buzzing around XP11 now for a while but someone talked me into giving P3Dv5 a try and I have to say I am enjoying it so now I fly both sims.   I use Pilot2ATC on XP11 but I have liked VoxATC on P3D in the past and I have been using the demo to see how the new version is.   Below are some of my observations of problems I have seen while trying out the demo.   Those of you who have been using VoxATC for a while now may know the fixes and work arounds.  I have done some reading up in here as it has been a while since I've been the AVSIM forums but the answers are scattered.  I'd like fresher responses then some of the old stuff in here if possible.  Thanks everyone for your comments, help and possible solutions.

  1. Airports are overly packed even with 70 percent setting -  I have Traffic Global installed for my AI aircraft which VoxATC seems to be using just fine but I find it likes to stuff airports full, a little too full.   I did do some tweaking around in the VAsettings.xml file for parked aircraft but can't seem to find a nice middle ground.     Setting the parked aircraft value to 2 was too low at many airports and I tried setting it to 15 but that seems to have all the gates stuffed full again.   What are people doing around the VoxATC verse to get realistic traffic levels?  VoxATC just can't handle that much traffic.  It generates all kinds of stuck craft and traffic jams I have noticed.
  2. Stuttering Pushbacks - VoxATC has done this FOREVER.   I read it is 'KNOWN BUG'.    A known bug for years and not addressed?    Did it ever push planes back smoothly for anyone?  I remember it always being janky on this.  If I do just normal Traffic Global they push super smooth.
  3. Traffic Jams - This is partially coming from the massive amount of traffic  I think.   P3D/VoxATC can only talk so fast.  I have seen some pretty gnarly back ups.  LativVFR KMIA was hilarious when I finally got underway.  There was a 32 plane back up for runway 8R.  It appeared a 747 was in the A lane and the others in the B and I think the 747 was blocking the flow but ATC wasn't moving him.   I have seen other crazed taxing even at smaller airports like LIPZ.    I did some quick AFCAD checks (can't believe I remembered how to use that program still) and I think they 'look' fine in the AFCAD so I don't know why traffic is having such a hard time smoothly flowing around.    Any tips on what to look for in an AFCAD that might be causing VoxATC to go dumb on taxi instructions?
  4. AI getting stuck waiting for me at parking - I have notice that the collision avoidance scan range of VoxATC AI is a bit to large I think.   I have seen many times traffic jams form on the Ramp because planes push and then get stuck in the push because they think my plane is in their way.    Is there any way to tone down or even turn OFF player collision avoidance so planes won't pile up while I spend 15-30 minutes prepping the plane?   KLAX is a great example of planes getting stuck because of the narrow alleyways.
  5. Fatal Errors even with updated Indexes - This is random and I don't know what triggers it.    I will tune into ATIS, get the data then tune to the next channel and sometimes VoxATC will throw up the FATAL ERROR message but the program keeps on trucking.   The only thing I have figured out thus far is liveries that use quotes in their name is a BIG no no for VoxATC.  It cannot recognize the plane if someone uses quotes such as   A320 Allegiant "Make A Wish" as a livery name.   What are some tips for reducing or eliminating Fatal Errors and forced restarts of the VoxATC interface?

That's about it.  When it works, its amazing.  When it doesn't it just makes me sigh and drink more beer.    Some of this is borderline deal breaking for me.   VoxATC is the only ATC solution that spawns its own traffic to control which is one of the reasons I like it.   The other solutions seem to only monitor the built in P3D traffic system which in the case of Traffic Global is not good because even setting traffic at 100% in the options in P3D generates only a small amount of traffic with Traffic Global (known issue).  I'd like to keep VoxATC but I may have to switch over to Pilot2ATC for P3D.  Its solid has given me very little trouble it is just not capable of handling the ground traffic part apart from being aware of where the planes are and making ME hold short for them.

 

Thanks!

 


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Captain K-Man FlightBlog Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCulqmz0zmIMuAzJvDAZPkWQ  //  Streaming on YouTube most Wednesdays and Fridays @ 6pm CST

Brian Navy

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4 hours ago, Kuragiman said:

VoxATC is the only ATC solution that spawns its own traffic to control which is one of the reasons I like it. 

Indeed, I often think of Vox as being 2 programs in one, an AI engine & an ATC one (with TTS a further plus).

But to your Q's, I am "surprised" by your comments about high spawning at low parking "xml" figures, that should be the max & even then only if enabled in Advanced Settings. But then again, I can only recommend you consider (as what I suspect most do) to use AIG plans (to compare).

In this, & depending on your "rig", you should be able to match that parking level successfully against what is "real" for that airport (if you have a comprehensive AI inventory for that airport). A better universal setting is not to enable that parameter & let Vox spawn appropriately for hubs as much as smaller provincials.

& to add, Vox is in my opinion better with afcads that have parking codes for expected airlines / planes.

There is also a taxi speed parameter that if increased may declutter.

Lastly, I hope getting on top of your AI concerns may stop FE's, most of which can be traced to scenery glitches including faulty AI files.


for now, cheers

john martin

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5 hours ago, Kuragiman said:
  • Airports are overly packed even with 70 percent setting -  
  • Stuttering Pushbacks -
  • Traffic Jams -
  • AI getting stuck waiting for me at parking -
  • Fatal Errors even with updated Indexes 

Using anything greater than 5 for maximum number of parked aircraft just clogs gates with static aircraft. This eliminates parking locations for enroute traffic.

The stuttering pushback bug has been reported to the developer numerous times.

I suggest using a traffic limiter in either FSUIPC or AI Companion and limit the total active AI aircraft in the user's reality bubble to between 100 to 150. Anything more than that taxes the sim. The default traffic parameters in VASettings.xml yield a maximum number of nearby AI aircraft to approximately 280. That number may be realistic for a few big international airports but it also reduces performance substantially.

As to FATAL ERRORs those were substantially reduced in VOXATC 7.43. They still occur, but primarily because an airport has poorly formed geometry. This means that there are orphaned taxi nodes, orphaned parking spaces and other errors that need to be corrected with ADE. Conflicting approach  and radio frequency information also can cause these errors. Certain 3rd party airports are notorious for emphasizing eye candy at the expense of realism. P3d5 usually just ignores these issues, but VOXATC doesn't. While we are on the subject of ADE, it is also worthwhile to correct gate sizes, types and ICAO codes, so that they match real world values.

The traffic settings are in VASettings.xml which is found here in your APPDATA folder:

C:\Users\<USERNAME>\AppData\Roaming\Internal Workings\VoxATC P3D 4

The settings that I have been using  with 50% VOXATC traffic level and AIG flightplans are:

    <MaxParkedAircraft Value="5" />
    <MaxEnrouteAircraft Value="60" />
    <MaxActiveTerminalAircraft Value="40" />
    <TrafficGeneratedAtAllAirports Value="TRUE" /
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Thanks for the replies.   You would think with many of these airports having been released on P3Dv3 and updated in v4 and v5 that they would have the tightest error free AFCAD taxi network possible but no.    I opened up GMMN today and was just cross-eyed at some of the mistakes in there.  Sadly it doesn't look like VoxATC has any parking space spawn check routines to stop planes from spawning in MARS type parking areas where 3 spaces share one gate.  This made for some really ugly traffic at Casablanca because their gates handle either two Class C or 1 Class D or greater aircraft but VoxATC spawns all 3 at the gate.

 I uinstalled Traffic global and I am attempting to install AIG but its OIC installer is being very annoying and installs are stalling out specially on the bigger airlines like American and Delta.  I can't get them to install because the installer just stops downloading the planes.  Any way around this stalling out behavior in the AI Manager?

I am hoping I can get a grasp also on ADE editing.   I am an expert in WED on X-Plane 11.  In fact I rose to fame over there by pushing Developers to start working on Taxi networks in their products so AI in XP11 can work.  I got so good at it developers started hiring me to do all their airport logic work.  Hopefully I can take that experience and apply it to editing these 3rd party airports that quite frankly we shouldn't have to be editing at all for the price they charge on some of these.

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Captain K-Man FlightBlog Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCulqmz0zmIMuAzJvDAZPkWQ  //  Streaming on YouTube most Wednesdays and Fridays @ 6pm CST

Brian Navy

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21 hours ago, Kuragiman said:

editing these 3rd party airports

Brian

I think you'll find in P3D4/5, that it is (in my opinion) difficult for any afcad writer except oneself to cover all airlines that may be seen from an individual's AI inventory at a particular airport, more so with AIG plans being regularly updated for many reasons.

As Jay wrote above, it is recommended you update afcads regularly / annually (codes / size etc. of parking) after checking with AICompanion's analyser what your AIG inventory will spawn.

You might also set up dedicated parking for your own aircraft.

 

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for now, cheers

john martin

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Will do.

 One other bug I have noticed is with the first officer feature.   They will sometimes get stuck operating the radio and won't ever switch and you can't turn them off to take control.  I have to disable VoxATC and re-enable.  Is this a known issue and is there anyway other than you doing all the talking to stop the FO from getting jammed in radio switching?   It is not realistic for me to have to operate the radio and fly the plane as the PIC in my airline flights.  Need my FO to do her job!


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Captain K-Man FlightBlog Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCulqmz0zmIMuAzJvDAZPkWQ  //  Streaming on YouTube most Wednesdays and Fridays @ 6pm CST

Brian Navy

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52 minutes ago, Kuragiman said:

Need my FO to do her job!

Indeed ....... my only experience is maybe 1:20 at hubs switching center to approach & vox is "catching up" with recent AI spawns of arrivals & forgets your pnf. Yes a quick re-enable is the answer at the moment. But as has been mentioned, TW is developing updates of AI management which hopefully overcomes this.

Are you seeing similar or elsewhere ?


for now, cheers

john martin

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I get the jam at random moments.   My last one was going from ground to tower.   She just couldn't make the change over at PacSim's KCLE tower for some reason so I had to takeoff with my FO blaring in my ear repeatedly that she was switching to the tower but she never did.  Once I got far enough away from the airport I turned off VoxATC and kicked it back on and she was fine the rest of the flight.   If only flight simulation wasn't so complex we might one day have bug free utilities, airports and planes, right?  :D

 


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Captain K-Man FlightBlog Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCulqmz0zmIMuAzJvDAZPkWQ  //  Streaming on YouTube most Wednesdays and Fridays @ 6pm CST

Brian Navy

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Brian

Are you using Vox alongside MCE or similar ..... where saying words / phrases to MCE which might include such as takeoff, departure etc. before reaching Vox's handover to tower can induce this.

You are aware Vox allows the PF to action the PNF by simply saying "call for clearance / pushback / taxi" ?


for now, cheers

john martin

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I have no other programs running that access voice recognition routines in Wnidows.    And no I didn't know you could you keep FO off but still request they help you out.


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Captain K-Man FlightBlog Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCulqmz0zmIMuAzJvDAZPkWQ  //  Streaming on YouTube most Wednesdays and Fridays @ 6pm CST

Brian Navy

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2 hours ago, Kuragiman said:

no other programs running that access voice recognition

try:

PNF on after initialise to hear ATIS

Mic On

Then in turn (hands off, no PTT toggle), say "call for clearance / pushback / taxi" as appropriate"

Mic off before taxi until shutdown (except if PF wishes to request cruise steps) whilst PNF makes TOD call (via menu zero) & approach reports (by PTT push) if required.


for now, cheers

john martin

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On 4/15/2021 at 11:19 PM, vadriver said:

You are aware Vox allows the PF to action the PNF by simply saying "call for clearance / pushback / taxi" ?

Even I didn't know that...

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Kevin Firth - i9 10850K @5.2; Asus Maximus XII Hero; 32Gb Cas14 3200 DDR4; RTX2080Ti

Beta tester for: UK2000; JustFlight; VoxATC; FSReborn; //42

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@kevinfirth.............. line pilots are accustomed to "experimenting intelligently & learning by discovery"

no need to listen during @tegoid's "beta" school.


for now, cheers

john martin

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