Just now, Bobsk8 said:

I believe that XP stated that they thought that streaming scenery was not the way to go, when MSFS 2020 came out. So I doubt seriously if they will walk that back, and consider doing what MSFS is doing. There loss, I'm afraid, because their sim by comparison looks really dated now. 

So streaming satellite/photogrammetry data to the simulator client is a project of its own.  I assume that Austin assessed the complexity of streaming satellite/photogrammetry data to the simulator, including the cost of the servers and manpower needed to setup and maintain those servers, plus the software developers needed to code it, plus another company like Black Shark needed to convert the 2D satellite data into 3D houses/buildings, and Austin concluded it's not easy to do and at a price that would be reasonable to the typical X-Plane customer (if such a service were implemented, does it come free with X-Plane or do X-Plane customers need to pay extra for it?).  My guess is, Austin may have figured it would have cost a lot of money, and he wouldn't earn that money back any time soon, especially with X-Plane's dated graphics.

In a weird way, streaming satellite/photogrammetry data to X-Plane is kind of wasted if the graphics engine of X-Plane can't produce high quality graphics in conjunction with the satellite/photogrammetry data.  I imagine it would be more lucrative for X-Plane if the engine can yield better graphics first, and then it makes sense to think of a possible streaming satellite/photogrammetry data service, even if that service requires extra payment by X-Plane customers.

38 minutes ago, Tuskin38 said:

The super tall tower that was in Melbourne at launch was because of a mistake in the OSM data, someone found the source of the error by looking at the OSM edit history of the building.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/21/21395084/microsoft-flight-simulator-melbourne-obelish-openstreetmap-bing-maps-data-glitch

The files that handle the autogen buildings have an OSM parameter for deciding what buildings to spawn. (the .toml files in the 'bf-pgg\PGG' folder and sub folders, can be opened with a text editor)

But as I said it's outdated OSM Data by around 2 years (that's why the tower was there even though it was already fixed in OSM at the time). it's not current OSM Data, which is probably why they're not a 'partner'.

Thanks, than I've learned something new.

Kind regards, Michael

4 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

What would you pay for this satellite & photogrammetry streaming service on a monthly basis, if it were made a separate add on service?  Perhaps $5 USD per month?  Perhaps $10 USD per month?  Perhaps more?

Nothing, zero, nada, niente, rien du tout!. If you want to pay for it, you can always donate to MS via PayPal of buy them a coffee...!

Edited April 28, 20215 yr by edpatino

I would pay $5 a month. Price of a cup of coffee and a biscuit, well worth it. 

13 minutes ago, edpatino said:

Nothing, zero, nada, niente, rien du tout!. If you want to pay for it, you can always donate to MS via PayPal of buy them a coffee...!

Well, I see you have  P3Dv4.5 in your signature.  If such a service were offered for P3D, and it weren't free, there would be a cost associated with it.  I surmise some people in P3D would probably pay $5 USD or $10 USD a month for such a service.

5 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

I would pay $5 a month. Price of a cup of coffee and a biscuit, well worth it. 

Yeah, I think $5 a month is reasonable. Maybe even $10 a month.  The way I look at it, if you purchased MSFS for $60, and you have been playing it for 8 months, you've recuperated $40 of what you paid for MSFS.

Zero. I dont think its costing MS that much. Most of the infrastructure is already there and I bet more people download satellite data on Bing maps each day for free then download via the game.

Plus MS are still selling copies of the game every day, making money from xbox subscriptions partly because this game is in the library and also marketplace fees.

Asobo is hiring a lot of positions for MS development post release and this would only be happening if the game has already made a nice big fat profit.

Edited April 28, 20215 yr by sanh

Not sure, streaming a la MSFS would be a bright future for X-Plane. If being asked, I would vote for an alternative approach not just doubling what's already there. This could be procedural scenery the way Outerra does, but there are certainly alternatives. Now, Outerra still has a way to go, too, but it's got a number of advantages - plus it is lean compared to the streaming data behemoth MSFS is. Exchange the ugly khaki-grey shaders by proper ones (making Xvision redundant) and you may well achieve something which will sell.

The future of the sims may not be copying features from each other but further developing based on their own strengts.

Kind regards, Michael

35 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

Well, I see you have  P3Dv4.5 in your signature

Yeap, I still have it, but I wouldn't pay for it.

10 minutes ago, pmb said:

Not sure, streaming a la MSFS would be a bright future for X-Plane. If being asked, I would vote for an alternative approach not just doubling what's already there. This could be procedural scenery the way Outerra does, but there are certainly alternatives. Now, Outerra still has a way to go, too, but it's got a number of advantages - plus it is lean compared to the streaming data behemoth MSFS is. Exchange the ugly khaki-grey shaders by proper ones (making Xvision redundant) and you may well achieve something which will sell.

The future of the sims may not be copying features from each other but further developing based on their own strengts.

Kind regards, Michael

I haven't used Outerra so I can't comment on what they exactly do.

But streaming satellite data (and of course, that 2D satellite data needs to be converted to 3D objects) is something the other simulators need to do.  The old way of downloading TBs of ortho is simply archaic, outdated, and extremely cumbersome.  People are saying you need to buy a separate hard drive just to store the TBs of ortho data.  I only have to store about 100 GB for MSFS and that's it, so I save money on the extra hard drive that stores the TBs of ortho data.

I don't want to buy an extra hard drive just to store ortho data.  I don't want to download ortho data either and then massage that data into something useable for the simulator.  That's extra time and money I am wasting.

45 minutes ago, sanh said:

Zero. I dont think its costing MS that much. Most of the infrastructure is already there and I bet more people download satellite data on Bing maps each day for free then download via the game.

Plus MS are still selling copies of the game every day, making money from xbox subscriptions partly because this game is in the library and also marketplace fees.

Asobo is hiring a lot of positions for MS development post release and this would only be happening if the game has already made a nice big fat profit.

Extra infrastructure is being used though for streaming.  That's more servers that are needed to stream the data.  Those servers cost money.  And people are needed to maintain those servers.  Black Shark also costs Microsoft/Asobo money to convert the 2D satellite data into 3D houses/buildings.  None of that is free and it costs money.

If such a service were released for X-Plane or P3D, there is a good chance you would have to pay extra for such a service.

If I have to be happy with maps changing colors abruptly, no seasons, generic buildings almost everywhere, approximate mesh, artifacts here and there, then the price is nil, zero nothing, 0.

In some selected places the scenery is beautiful. I paid 130 euros for it. Otherways I wouldn't have bought it. 

Are you try to convince us to organize a pilgrimage to Washington State to thank MS for their kindness?

A.

5 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

That's pretty impressive what Flyinside accomplished for a small developer.

It's the same devs who are making the Bell 47 for MSFS - IIUC they basically ported their flight model from the sim into something that works as a plug-in in MSFS.

3 hours ago, pmb said:

Are you sure Open Streetmap is involved in MSFS at all?

Check e.g. this link:

SDK Documentation (flightsimulator.com)

You can also enter OSM in the search box...

6 hours ago, pmb said:

As a sidenote: There is another simulator streaming satellite imagery in the core engine, It's called Flyinside FlightSimulator and just not well-known.

As another sidenote, the app which I have developped and published in MS store also has global imagery coverage. For free. And even the app is free.

Though it is a groundstation for Ardupilot based UAVs/drones with the look&feel&systems of a 787, it also has an in-built simulation mode, which at least for some seems to be useful as a kind of a flight simulator (as the sim-only version of the app shipped nearly 20 times more).

Also my six-lines-of-code proof of concept of the basic MSFS architecture has free global streaming coverage 😉 (English speakers enable subtitles)