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bobcat999

Tail Draggers... Why?..

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Cpt_Piett said:

Just tried some taildragger practice in the XCUB. Good lord it's difficult to land 🥵

Feel more like a kangaroo than a bush pilot. It's embarrasing really. Trying to land on main wheels then sort of let the tail wheel settle. It is very counter-intuitive 😨

Any pro tip?

Yep, part of the fun and/or frustration 🙂 Welcome to the X-Cub, and other taildraggers! Still my favorite aircraft! Most people including myself, apply the brakes, while it is basically still on the 2 front wheels, causing the Flip Over! And also don't pull back on the stick, to settle the back wheel!

Edited by in2tech
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21 minutes ago, crimplene said:

When braking, pull the yoke back further and further to firmly press the tail wheel on the ground.

And this is what I forget at times! Still a boat load of fun! Like I said especially in a Group flight when new and not new pilots forget, or just screw up. I can tell you one way to stop a taildragger. Run into one of those solid buildings 🙂


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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Try it, you will see why. 

I under stand that this must be and ego trip for you. I don't have and a2a nor PA3D never have never will, that you thing not mine.🙂

Edited by jpc55

J. R. :ph34r:

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5 hours ago, snglecoil said:

Interesting question. If it truly is the same airframe with the only difference being conventional vs tricycle gear, the angle of incidence (angle between the longitudinal axis of the plane and the chordline of the wing) should be the same. Angle of attack might tend to be slightly higher in a tailwheel if the pilot doesn't raise the tail during the takeoff roll. Either way, the pilot is able to control much of that. I would venture to guess that the most significant difference would come from the decreased weight and the center of gravity being more aft in the tailwheel plane.

Yes -- angle of attack is what I meant to say.


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3 hours ago, Cpt_Piett said:

I seem to be improving. Had several successful landings with a slightly nose down to level attitude. Low speed certainly is not a disadvantage 😉 Have to remember to not "stand on the brakes" until the plane stops - or I get a prop strike. At least in the X-Cub.

ummh yeah ... or worse ...

 

 

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1 minute ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

ummh yeah ... or worse ...

Dang, you filmed that one?! 🤣

To be honest I’ve ended up upside down more than once in a taildragger. Thank goodness it’s a sim..


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3 minutes ago, Cpt_Piett said:

Dang, you filmed that one?! 🤣

To be honest I’ve ended up upside down more than once in a taildragger. Thank goodness it’s a sim..

More common in real life than you would think:

 

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Shirley-flipped-plane-2-1.jpg?fit=900,60

 

p1ai49e8db6lip5d1ffd19ls1ck26.jpg

 

MDIplaneflip.jpg?fit=538,453&ssl=1

 

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14 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

More common in real life than you would think:

 

Oh my, I don’t know if I would be brave enough to fly a taildragger IRL 😬


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Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

 

 

 

Heels on the floor!  

This guy appears to have the brakes locked on touch down.  You're taught to keep your heels on the floor to keep your toes off the brakes to avoid this situation.

Of the 7 sim planes I've flown the most, all but one were tail draggers.  The other was the A2A Connie.

The A2A T-6 has been called a "landing simulator".

If you read the real world checklists, even for tricycle gear aircraft, they often have a line in the after-landing checklist:  "Braking - minimum required."

In sim flying the Dodo 206, I noticed that my rudder pedals were almost never on the center detent, unlike flying fixed wing aircraft.  Real aircraft do not have a center detent. 😄 

Hook

Edited by LHookins

Larry Hookins

 

Oh! I have slipped the surly bonds of Earth
And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings;

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Posted (edited)

A good article about a three-point landing.

https://www.avweb.com/flight-safety/technique/tailwheel-landing-battle-three-point-or-wheel/

In the sim (no real life experience) landing a tailwheel aircraft is maybe more intimidating than difficult as you do not see well the runway in the ultimate moments before hitting the ground.

 The key is to reduce the aircraft kinetic energy to a minimum (watch your speed !) which means stall on touch down with the two main wheels and the tail wheel hitting the ground at the same time AND continue flying the plane until the stop, specially when there is a whiff of wind (or more). The A2A T6 teaches you this last point the hard way. And as Larry said , brakes are your ennemy. 

I have found easier to hit a three-point in MFS than P3D. But ground loops are also easier to get into 😁. Again not a real pilot but I find MFS better at giving you the feeling of a TPL than P3D.  Referring to the default XCub, the Corsair and the Spit’. Still having a ground loop with the last two from time to time but the Cub is a peach to land. 

And, oh yes, if in doubt go around. If you can.

Edited by Dominique_K
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12 hours ago, LHookins said:

Real aircraft do not have a center detent. 😄

Real aircraft also have control forces to center the controls, which forces (see what I did there?) me to wonder why force feedback is so rare in the flight sim realm. It's almost the opposite in racing sims - yeah non-FF wheels are out there but it's incredibly easy to find a FF wheel for $200 or less, and that comes with pedals. 

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30 minutes ago, eslader said:

Real aircraft also have control forces to center the controls, which forces (see what I did there?) me to wonder why force feedback is so rare in the flight sim realm. It's almost the opposite in racing sims - yeah non-FF wheels are out there but it's incredibly easy to find a FF wheel for $200 or less, and that comes with pedals. 

I am sure someone else could elaborate but I think the lack of FF is a patent issue...search Immersion Corp. 

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Dominique_K said:

A good article about a three-point landing.

https://www.avweb.com/flight-safety/technique/tailwheel-landing-battle-three-point-or-wheel/

In the sim (no real life experience) landing a tailwheel aircraft is maybe more intimidating than difficult as you do not see well the runway in the ultimate moments before hitting the ground.

 The key is to reduce the aircraft kinetic energy to a minimum (watch your speed !) which means stall on touch down with the two main wheels and the tail wheel hitting the ground at the same time AND continue flying the plane until the stop, specially when there is a whiff of wind (or more). The A2A T6 teaches you this last point the hard way. And as Larry said , brakes are your ennemy. 

I have found easier to hit a three-point in MFS than P3D. But ground loops are also easier to get into 😁. Again not a real pilot but I find MFS better at giving you the feeling of a TPL than P3D.  Referring to the default XCub, the Corsair and the Spit’. Still having a ground loop with the last two from time to time but the Cub is a peach to land. 

And, oh yes, if in doubt go around. If you can.

On the A2A  T6 I used to alternate between making wheel landings and three pointers. The wheel landing, you land on the mains, and keep the tail up as long as possible after touchdown, keeping the nose absolutely straight with the rudder.  If the nose starts to move even slightly, "dancing" on the rudder pedals must be immediate to avoid  swerving which can easily turn into a ground loop. Once the tail drops, planting the tail wheel on the ground by back pressure on the joystick will enable the tailwheel to steer you straight. Much better luck with this method in a crosswind landing. 

Edited by Bobsk8
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I don't claim to be an expert.  But taildraggers are often used in remote places with (for example) dirt runways because the angle causes the props to be away from the ground.  They also allow for the stronger gear to be at the front.


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Posted (edited)
On 5/10/2021 at 2:20 AM, bobcat999 said:

Considering the restricted view on take-off and potentially more difficult ground handling, why are these so popular?

Others have given useful answers (more ruggedness, simplicity, lighter weight, greater prop clearance, all things operating in favor of the taildragger for use in less "civilized" locations), but I'll just add that nailing a perfect full-stall three-point landing feels so good that that feeling alone is worth flying taildraggers, at least in the sim.  😄   You can't help but feel like you've mastered the machine in a way that you don't get from much else.   It's one of my favorite things.

 

Edited by kaosfere
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