Just now, fogboundturtle said:

there is no secret SDK

And you can evidence this definitive statement how?  We know that Asobo have released promotional material that wasn't in the actual SIM (case in point, shorelines..). Is it that much of a mental leap to suppose that some developers have access to more advanced development builds as well as tools and knowledge, than that publicly available? 

My observation was based purely on the evidence, being neither positive or negative in nature.  Unless you can substantiate your black and white claim, your analysis seems to be more biased.

Just now, kevinfirth said:

And you can evidence this definitive statement how?  We know that Asobo have released promotional material that wasn't in the actual SIM (case in point, shorelines..). Is it that much of a mental leap to suppose that some developers have access to more advanced development builds as well as tools and knowledge, than that publicly available? 

My observation was based purely on the evidence, being neither positive or negative in nature.  Unless you can substantiate your black and white claim, your analysis seems to be more biased.

Using alpha/beta code is not secret or hidden stuff. Do PMDG have access to Beta SDK prior to the regular population ? I don't know but there is a SDK Q&A  on May 26th. You are welcome to ask Sebastian if this is the case.

16 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

The inexorable conclusion is that not all developers have access to the same SDK and support from Asobo.  That explains all the evidence available, both Aerosoft/PMDG development achievements, AND the inability for other Devs to produce anything similar with the publicly available less than complete SDK version.  Always go for the hypothesis that explains all the evidence, not just that you want to see....

So you think there are different versions of the SDK out there? Are you for real?

Different level of support I think you are right about though. But when you look at companies like Working Title, FBW, Aerosoft and PMDG they have always talked about the opportunities they have with this sim instead of the obstacles. On the other side you have RXP and Sim Horizon who have written countless posts to lobby on how good everything was before and how difficult things are now.

If I were Asobo and coming in to check my full mailbox on Monday morning I know who I would reply to first...

1 minute ago, fogboundturtle said:

Using alpha/beta code is not secret or hidden stuff. Do PMDG have access to Beta SDK prior to the regular population ? I don't know but there is a SDK Q&A  on May 26th. You are welcome to ask Sebastian if this is the case.

Aha, so now you're rolling back on your position.  Before, the possibility of different SDKs was "pure BS".  Now you don't know?

I appreciate your willingness to change your mind in the face of weight of evidence.

I dont need to ask Sebastian anything, I'm not self important enough to believe that would achieve anything for anyone.  When MSFS meets my needs, I'll move to it.  If it never does, I won't.  If it meets your needs now, that's great and I'm happy for you 🙂

1 minute ago, espent said:

So you think there are different versions of the SDK out there? Are you for real?

I'm happy to review your definitive and conclusive evidence that there is only the publicly available version.  Please dont get defensive and over emotional about it. 🙂

I really do hope, they would come out with the JS41. That would be perfect for the short flights to fully enjoy the sceneries of the MSFS.

35 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

The inexorable conclusion is that not all developers have access to the same SDK and support from Asobo.  That explains all the evidence available, both Aerosoft/PMDG development achievements, AND the inability for other Devs to produce anything similar with the publicly available less than complete SDK version.  Always go for the hypothesis that explains all the evidence, not just that you want to see....

 

The real question is why? And I think the answer is that while Asobo genuinely do want to make MSFS as good as it could be, they themselves recognise it's going to be a 10 year journey.  MS of course holds the pursestrings and controls the strategy, and their interest is little less than $$$.  In that context, the prioritisation of Xbox release and top tier showcaseability  makes perfect sense to me.

 

Doesn't matter what I think about it...  MSFS clearly meets some people's needs.now and that's ok.  When it meets mine, I'll use it.  PMDG producing a complex realistic aircraft in the sim is just one of multiple requirements for me to transition.

I think Kevin is very close spot on with this post. 

I don't see a PMDG 737 this year in MSFS.

There are 2 things important for PMDG 1} doable technically spoken (SDK and Willingness MS Asobo) AND 2} profit. Means decent SDK and toolkit is needed....otherwise less or even no profit possible.

If one of those 2 elements  doesn't match....they won't deliver the 737.

Ask yourself why the DC6 is done prior 737 all though the market would rather buy the 737 much more than DC6.

 Marcus

Edited May 23, 20215 yr by mpo910

4 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

I'm happy to review your definitive and conclusive evidence that there is only the publicly available version.  Please dont get defensive and over emotional about it. 🙂

There are 2 versions at least.

The 2nd one is a beta SDK with limited access to max 300 Devs (lots of DLC devs.....airports and scenery)

 

7 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

Clean,elegant, cost effective, and a time saver.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200305-why-your-internet-habits-are-not-as-clean-as-you-think

 

Just now, mpo910 said:

There are 2 versions at least.

The 2nd one is a beta SDK with limited access to max 300 Devs (lots of DLC devs.....airports and scenery)

 

And if this is the case, it isnt "good" or "bad", it just is. Speculation here won't change it, but it may aid understanding of the direction of travel for the SIM.  On topic, PMDG producing a top tier product in MSFS will be a major milestone, and a positive one, no doubt about it.  It won't be the only one though....

 

 

Just now, kevinfirth said:

And if this is the case, it isnt "good" or "bad", it just is. Speculation here won't change it, but it may aid understanding of the direction of travel for the SIM.  On topic, PMDG producing a top tier product in MSFS will be a major milestone, and a positive one, no doubt about it.  It won't be the only one though....

 

 

Again spot on Kevin. XBOX prior SDK (SDK is effort for ASOBO and though costs for MS and on the opposite no income). Xbox is a money Maschine. 

737 is EXPECTED this year.....but not promissed. We know how PMDG does his marketing. Users should just be aware of this. 

3 minutes ago, mpo910 said:

Again spot on Kevin. XBOX prior SDK (SDK is effort for ASOBO and though costs for MS and on the opposite no income). Xbox is a money Maschine

Follow the money...  That approach explains just about everything for every sim.  MSFS chases Xbox and marketplace revenue...   LM chases lucrative military and training revenue..  though the analysis fall down when considering xplane - I can't see what money LR is chasing there!

Edited May 23, 20215 yr by kevinfirth

7 hours ago, DJJose said:

WOW only 100GB. I have over 700GB of add-ons both freeware and payware.

For a sim you so detest and find so bugged and lacking? Odd.

MSFS has great potential. But if it ever will meet my expectations and match my needs for flying complex Airliners I can't know. It is all depending on what MS Asobo will do. MS is leading and holds the budget. Asobo just the engine. I always said that MS is a profit organization and will prioritize the profitable things. Like XBOX. So I do understand them. But this brings lots of devs who are not DLC developers in trouble. Because this is the SDK part which is lacking the most.

I find it a hidden info that PMDG prioritized the DC6 before the 737. It just tells me the SDK isn't that far and DL6 isn't that complex so they can make money with DC6 and have to wait what MS does with the SDK. 

 

So to summarize; I am at P3D and fly what I like.

Edited May 23, 20215 yr by mpo910

Just now, mpo910 said:

MSFS has great potential. But if it ever will meet my expectations and match my needs for flying complex Airliners I can't know. It is all depending on what MS Asobo will do. MS is leading and holds the budget. Asobo just the engine. I always said that MS is a profit organization and will prioritize the profitable things. Like XBOX. So I do understand them. But this brings lots of devs who are not DLC developers in trouble. Because this is the SDK part which is lacking the most.

I find it a hidden info that PMDG prioritized the DC6 before the 737. It just tells me the SDK isn't that far and DL6 isn't that complex so they can make money with DC6 and have to wait what MS does with the SDK. 

The DC-6 is probably more complex than the 737 in many many ways.