MSFS has never been RELIABLE

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

6 hours ago, Doug47 said:

You’re missing the point.  They want it to run on x box for the games. And apply the same poor arcade style flight dynamics to both. 

Some yokes don’t even cut it, as far as ‘feeling’ the same. So I’m not sure how a x box controller with its baby joysticks and push buttons can. 
 

No wonder some say MSFS is nothing more then an arcade game for the gamers. Sad times for the true simulator users here. 
 

Yea, so sad. Im about to cry actually. Over a video game....

Ive been simming for most of my life, using all kinds of hardware. im now develloping airplanes. Since launch, ive been using the Xbox Gamepad to fly, tried to my joystick once, and decided the controller felt way better. The gamepad in MSFS DOES AN AMAZING JOB. You wouldnt know obviously, and i suspect you wouldn't even listen to those who do know. 

 

"Sad times for the true simulator users here." Theres never been a "true" simulator on PC, ever. Hell even the true simulators arent even that.

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

11 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

 "other serious sims"

 

When you get down to it here are no "other serious sims" the study level thing is just elitist nonsense. You are sitting at a desk on a PC, that is it, full stop.  The only aspect of operating an aircraft you can possibly simulate sitting in an office chair is the button pressing, the flows and the procedures.

People just like to call it "study level" for epeen or possibly so they can justify the horrendous cost to their parents or wife/husband.

[Ricardo41 5,949]

1 minute ago, Dominique_K said:

The post was unnecessarily excessive or rather inflammatory in its wording

...and obviously the moderator tolerated this while calling out folks who commented.

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

2 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

 

The post was unnecessarily excessive or rather inflammatory in its wording but raises some real issues. Maybe discussing them as some of us has tried to do, instead of yawning or dismissing them as trolling, may improve it instead keeping the flames alive ? 

I agree, but these "issues" have been raised about a million times, so whats the point of "yet another one"?

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

1 minute ago, Ricardo41 said:

...and obviously the moderator tolerated this while calling out folks who commented.

There is a trend here 😛

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

23 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Yep 100% agree with that. The devs wont know unless the community speaks up.

Im pretty sure the devs make a point of NOT listening to anything avsim has to say LOL

[Dominique_K 10,138]

8 minutes ago, leprechaunlive said:

I agree, but these "issues" have been raised about a million times, so whats the point of "yet another one"?

Hammer pedagogy. You hammer the nail until it is well into the wood 🤣.

We have a major update or what touted as a major update, YMMV, a mandatory update to the boot. What do we do ? Stay quiet or say our piece ?

Can't we appreciate this sim and be critical ?

 

6 minutes ago, leprechaunlive said:

Im pretty sure the devs make a point of NOT listening to anything avsim has to say LOL

You say that Neuman lies as he said so many times they were reading and listening to forums to get feedback from the user base ?  Neuman a liar, I can't believe it.

Edited July 29, 2021 by Dominique_K

[Ixoye 1,821]

There is nothing wrong with Xbox controller, the game has helping aids that make it easy to control with a controller like that, like auto rudder and auto trim etc, and it is good for beginners, as well as for those who do not take it so seriously and want lie in the sofa and play in front of their TV, if you like to learn and take the game to another level you can turn off all aids and connect the same gadgets that we PC users are familiar with.

[GCBraun 2,392]

6 minutes ago, Ixoye said:

There is nothing wrong with Xbox controller, the game has helping aids that make it easy to control with a controller like that, like auto rudder and auto trim etc, and it is good for beginners, as well as for those who do not take it so seriously and want lie in the sofa and play in front of their TV, if you like to learn and take the game to another level you can turn off all aids and connect the same gadgets that we PC users are familiar with.

Exactly. This will bring many, many new users to the genre and we as flight-simmers can only benefit from that. Thank you MS/Asobo for putting this TOY GAME in a GAME TOY like Xbox (as you correctly wrote, it is called Xbox, not X Box, X-Box or the like btw).

Flight-sim is now something for the masses, not just for some elitist boomers pandering themselves for using an outdated platform produced by some military contractor...

Edited July 29, 2021 by GCBraun

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

9 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

Hammer pedagogy. You hammer the nail until it is well into the wood 🤣.

We have a major update or what touted as a major update, YMMV, a mandatory update to the boot. What do we do ? Stay quiet or say our piece ?

Can't we appreciate this sim and be critical ?

 

You say that Neuman lies as he said so many times they were reading and listening to forums to get feedback from the user base ?  Neuman a liar, I can't believe it.

Neumann is a god amongst men, so no, hes not lying. He just ommited to specify "All forums except avsim" LOL.

And yes, we can be critical, thats not the problem. But the arguments must be valid, and preferably not flooded with non sense "arcade" claims.

[Chock 17,769]

2 hours ago, Garys said:

Just can't help yourself hey Chock. Leveling off @ 94% N1 or landing at Karachi with the gear up will end up with the same result but hey, you keep on beating that horse.

Well if we're going to beat on that particular horse, it might help if the point of my - admittedly somewhat esoteric comment - didn't go completely over one's head, this being in response to the ironic luddite-like nature of this thread with regard to controllers and advanced software.

But, for the hard-of-thinking, I'll elaborate: Technological advances have glitches but generally they are overcome in spite of an often difficult birth, which was the case with the A320; a type which had a ton of crashes when it first began service with the airlines, partly owing to pilots not understanding FBW functionality properly, but also the design of the haptics needing some tweaks. A situation which gave rise to 'if it ain't Boeing...' phrase, and the nickname 'Scarebus', with many suggesting at the time that the control methods on the A320 were dangerous. But now, the ironic thing is, the 737 MAX is going through the same thing and it's the same scenario with the boot on the other foot. So what does this tell us? It tells us that it doesn't matter what type of controller is in the cockpit if there is a problem with the plane, or the pilot's understanding of that plane, or both. But one way or another, these things get fixed. The point being the controllers having nothing to do with whether the aeroplanes, either Boeing or Airbus, could have been saved in a number of incidents, it was more to do with cultural objections and training issues than the software, which is why I picked a craft with a conventional yoke to illustrate this point and contrasted it with the more modern and less conventional controller on the A320.

So unlike a number of early service A320 crashes, or the 737 MAX crashes, the crash of the A320 at Karachi has no relevance to this issue, because it was not one beyond the control of the pilots or related to their controls, it was a clear case of pilot error. That was apparent to all before the smoke had cleared from the crash site; so clear in fact that it led to an investigation into the pilot qualifications at that particular airline which revealed a raft of problems endemic in the culture there, with many pilots not actually qualified to fly the aeroplanes, as many as eighty, if memory serves. Thus in that case it would not have mattered if the crew of that thing had yokes, sidesticks, trackballs, mice or were using the W,A,S,and D keys on a qwerty keyboard to land their plane, they'd still have crashed the thing when coming in so hot that the gear won't even deploy because of the ASI inhibitor, then foolishly attempting to go around after they'd completely smashed the generators on the bottom of the engines by scraping along on them for several hundred yards instead of closing the throttles and accepting that they'd be doing the carpet dance in the CFI's office, but at least not in the morgue with their passengers.

Clear now?

Anyway, so much for the pearls before swine of subtle metaphors. I'll stick to the bleedin' obvious in future.

Edited July 29, 2021 by Chock

[Dominique_K 10,138]

37 minutes ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

 

  The only aspect of operating an aircraft you can possibly simulate sitting in an office chair is the button pressing, the flows and the procedures.

 

"only" is too reductive IMO. The core of simming is what I would awkwardly call the continuous imperative to balance a set of parameters (speed, pitch, etc.) to keep the aircraft on a safe trajectory full of transitions, in an unstable environment MFS does not do a bad job compared to the sims I had before, rather better.

Edited July 29, 2021 by Dominique_K

[Isaiah53six 134]

4 hours ago, liamp51 said:

He has no point. He's just a troll. Another user on my ignore list...

You disagree with my opinion makes me a troll?

[Ray Proudfoot 8,945]

1 hour ago, GCBraun said:

I would be willing to bet how long a topic titled "P3D has never been reliable" would remain open in the other forum...

It would remain if there were legitimate complaints about aspects of the program. And you’ll note this topic remains open.

1 hour ago, GCBraun said:

What about having a moderator defending the poster? That is a long, long shot (especially when such bad, if not inflammatory, arguments like criticizing controllers being supported or calling MSFS a "toy game" are being used).

I defended the right of the poster to complain. You seem to have missed that. I don’t understand your logic. People are allowed to criticise a product providing it’s done in a sensible manner. That one short phrase has been picked out as inflammatory but what about the points made in the first four paragraphs?

I won’t be debating this further.

[swiesma 625]

Let me just say: I love this thread. On the one hand I enjoy the whine about nothing. On the other hand it's nice to see that a lot of people here embrace the new Sim.

Sure, MSFS is still work in progress, but even now, with no PMDG, no QW and other high profile addons - I did not touch P3D in 3 months. As soon as PMDG launches the 737 or Fenix launches the A320 (and it lives up to the hype) - I will uninstall P3D and never touch it again.