60Hz monitor refresh rate questions

[Deltaair1212 53]

So I’m back with another question. I run Version 4.5 at 1080p with Vsync on and unlimited frames with triple buffering. My monitor is locked at 60hz. So this means that naturally, the frames in my sim are 60fps at its peak. I can usually achieve 60fps at a handful of airports, and at cruising altitude depending on the weather below, but I rarely see anything under 35. The thing is, I just don’t like how notchy my sim gets if the frames are less than 60fps if I pan around, or anything like that. Even if my frames drop to 50fps I still get stutters and notchy-ness. I understand that I can choose half refresh rate, and run 30fps, but even if I did that, my sim looks HORRIBLE. People claim they have a smooth experience at 30fps like silky smooth and I want to know how people are achieving this? Do I need to go buy a true 30hz monitor?? If my sim never drops below 35 at my current settings, plus add-ons, then I know if I figured out a way to drop my frames to 30fps and still have a smooth experience like at 60fps, then I’d be golden. And just to answer some questions, I am running a AffinityMask, and FFTF dynamic application. Not to get into a AF debate we’ve had enough of those. I wanted to know if there is a way I can get my frame rate down and still have a smooth sim experience. 

[TurboKen 221]

As I just recently found out V5 works very well at 30hz, and along with upgrading to V5 you will get a nice performance boost (as long as EA is turned off). Something to consider.

[Deltaair1212 53]

Just now, TurboKen said:

As I just recently found out V5 works very well at 30hz, and along with upgrading to V5 you will get a nice performance boost (as long as EA is turned off). Something to consider.

I would if the aftermarket companies would catch up! How long has v5 been out? And many companies have still yet to port over their products. A big one being REX. They haven’t even attempted to make their products compatible. So as much as I’d like to make the move, I’m stuck with v4.5 until my stuff is compatible 

[TurboKen 221]

Just now, Deltaair1212 said:

I would if the aftermarket companies would catch up! How long has v5 been out? And many companies have still yet to port over their products. A big one being REX. They haven’t even attempted to make their products compatible. So as much as I’d like to make the move, I’m stuck with v4.5 until my stuff is compatible 

Actually REX skyforce is compatible, I am using it. You have to get there latest installer. And most of the other stuff has dedicated installers or will simply work by changing the directory to V5.

[Deltaair1212 53]

Just now, TurboKen said:

Actually REX skyforce is compatible, I am using it. You have to get there latest installer. And most of the other stuff has dedicated installers or will simply work by changing the directory to V5.

Interesting. I think AIG AI manager isnt compatible…

[TurboKen 221]

1 minute ago, Deltaair1212 said:

Interesting. I think AIG AI manager isnt compatible…

That one I'm not sure about.

[kevinfirth 1,392]

8 minutes ago, Deltaair1212 said:

Interesting. I think AIG AI manager isnt compatible…

I have AIG AI working quite happily in 5.2HF1 🙂

Edited October 11, 2021 by kevinfirth

[Ray Proudfoot 8,903]

4 hours ago, Deltaair1212 said:

I understand that I can choose half refresh rate, and run 30fps, but even if I did that, my sim looks HORRIBLE. People claim they have a smooth experience at 30fps like silky smooth and I want to know how people are achieving this?

I have a BenQ monitor with a native 30Hz refresh rate. In a stationary left seat view the smoothness is without equal. No stutters as I’m only demanding around 60% of what the 1080Ti is capable of.

Panning though is jerky - the downside of only refreshing 30 times a second. But do we really spend our time panning around the cockpit? I don’t. I have ChasePlane views and that quickly switches views albeit with some jerkiness but it doesn’t bother me.

If you demand something your graphics card is unable to deliver - namely more frames than can be delivered - the result will still be a stuttery mess. The best compromise is to limit fps to 30 and with a 30Hz monitor that is achieved with no manipulation.

[Deltaair1212 53]

Hello all I think I found my solution… hopefully. What I did was customized a refresh rate on my monitor through Nvidia inspector. Since my sim never really drops below 45fps I chose 45Hz. Once I did this I kept my vsync enabled with triple buffering and unlimited frames in P3D. This all made a world of a difference! My sim is literally silky smooth as if I’m at 60fps. I can’t even tell the difference I swear! Airports that used to look kinda bad are now smooth as can be. I don’t know why my computer and sim love 45fps but that is my sweet spot. I still have some work to do though, I notice when I take off I see a little bit of the ground kinda tearing below me but only for a couple of seconds then once I get a little higher it goes away. I can probably tweak some things and get it just right. I have a i7-8700K @5ghz, RTX2070 8GB, and 32 gigs of RAM. 

[IanHarrison 521]

10 hours ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

You can go with a VRR monitor but that's not going to help with timeframe consistency (which is where "smooth") comes from (per my other post in response).  FYI, VRR is supported in P3D V5.x and some new job scheduler options that might help.  As I pointed out before you can see a list of monitors and their VRR range here.

Native 30Hz support by the monitor is the best approach ... are you HDMI or DP to the monitor?  FYI, TV's tend to support 30Hz because most content is either 24 FPS or 30 FPS and that's why "panning" is kept slow ... there are of course exceptions.

If you are using nVidia, you have NCP option to set "Max Frame Rate".  Alternatively you can us RTSS to cap frame rate.

But if 30 FPS is a problem for you visually on your current monitor, then your only real options would be to turn graphics settings down so you can stay at 60 FPS or higher.

Cheers, Rob.

Strange but I have found that RTSS works well to limit to one half refresh rate whereas NCP 8.1.961.0 when set to 30 fps or one half refresh rate does nothing at all and I see fluctuations all over the place.

[kevinfirth 1,392]

7 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

The best compromise is to limit fps to 30 and with a 30Hz monitor that is achieved with no manipulation.

No, it's the second best.  The best compromise is to splurge and buy the best hardware possible - my q400 flights are much better at 50fps than 30 😉 (Maybe not at today's inflated prices though..)

[Ray Proudfoot 8,903]

1 hour ago, kevinfirth said:

No, it's the second best.  The best compromise is to splurge and buy the best hardware possible - my q400 flights are much better at 50fps than 30 😉 (Maybe not at today's inflated prices though..)

Will a 3090 at a 3rd party Heathrow with 100+ Ai give you 60fps? Not without reducing those sliders I suspect. 😉

Anyway, each to their own.

[kevinfirth 1,392]

12 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Will a 3090 at a 3rd party Heathrow with 100+ Ai give you 60fps? Not without reducing those sliders I suspect. 😉

Anyway, each to their own.

I don't know Ray, my comment was slightly tongue in cheek, but I can say I get 50fps (which my TV does natively) with very consistent timeframes with the Q400 at regional sceneries with lots of AI traffic (I don't fly from superhubs).

Regardless of where and what you fly though, it's unfortunately a trueism that better hardware gets you better results, the only thing that stays the same is the impact on our wallets :p. I absolutely agree though that 30fps vsynced is a sweet spot for acceptable performance and visuals.

[Ray Proudfoot 8,903]

Is the Q400 fairly easy on performance Kev? I’m assuming so. The choice of aircraft is important of course. Staying away from those large airports helps but you still need to be on your toes with smaller ones like Orbx Brisbane. Dreadful stuttering with the PMDG737 was solved by reducing Dynamic Lighting by one notch. And 3D people at FlyTampa ones also have a significant impact.

Keeps us on our toes! 😁

[psolk 3,037]

1 hour ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Is the Q400 fairly easy on performance Kev? I’m assuming so. The choice of aircraft is important of course. Staying away from those large airports helps but you still need to be on your toes with smaller ones like Orbx Brisbane. Dreadful stuttering with the PMDG737 was solved by reducing Dynamic Lighting by one notch. And 3D people at FlyTampa ones also have a significant impact.

Keeps us on our toes! 😁

This is where GSync monitors are becoming so critical.  Butter smooth performance at any FPS because the monitor is dynamically matching FPS to refresh rate.  With a GSync monitor (and some GSync compatible) you can have smooth performance anywhere in the monitors capable range.  

To Ray's point 30FPS on a 30Hz monitor is the best "compromise"  The best non compromise is a GSync monitor where you do not have to limit to your lowest denominator but can rely on VSync for FPS above 60 and GSync to dynamically smooth frames out in the 20-60 range.   In my case my monitor supports GSync from 24-144  but I lock my monitor refresh at 60 as 60FPS on a 60Hz monitor with GSync is a pretty special experience...