Navigraph 2021 survey is out

[jarmstro 2,402]

9 hours ago, Sims Smith said:

On a different point, if theoretically XP shuts down today, I wouldn't be able to satisfy my flight sim needs with MSFS in its current state. I will have to move to P3D.  I am curious for those users who migrated from XP to MSFS, what actually they are doing in MSFS.

Tonywob summed it up below your post. I use MSFS because of the stunning visuals. For me it's  the visuals of everything including the UI and planes. And
thats about it. (I would add that that performance of MSFS is outstanding as well.) If I want to geek out on a study level airliner I use XP.  I would say my usage ratio is about 6 to 1 in favour of MFS.
 

Why anyone would choose to fly, say, the JustFlight P28 in XP rather than MSF is beyond me if I'm honest although I accept that the current GTN750 offering in MSF is not as comprehensive as the payware XP instrument should you wish to use it (That's about to change though.)

Edited January 1, 2022 by jarmstro

[mjrhealth 820]

3 hours ago, jarmstro said:

the JustFlight P28 in XP rather than MSF is beyond me

Because we can... Really that simple.

[mSparks 2,086]

15 hours ago, Sims Smith said:

what actually they are doing in MSFS.

My remaining interest in MSFS (after it became blatantly obvious all the "realistic flight" stuff was pure hyperbole) was similar to the reason I often fire up Ace Combat 7 freeflight or missions in VR - even though you can't even land in freeflight and I've done the three missions a thousand times.

Its "easy", looks absolutely phenomenal, and doesn't require much if any thought.

Xbox MSFS in VR would have completely supplanted that, I may even have used it as much as I do for more serious/involved flights in XP, where anything off the real world POH is bug report material - replacing my CSGO time.

Right now, afaict Xbox MSFS in VR is a pipe dream, and no way I am putting that windows garbage anywhere near my desktop, its been bad enough having to listen to the other half go crazy that she got a €2000 windows laptop instead of the 2020 M1 Macbook Air I bought later for "OOO, it will do", that ended up being far, far far superior and cheaper.

On the one hand, it makes a lot of sense that more people are interested in  "easy", looks phenomenal, and doesn't require much if any thought.

On the other, I feel quite sorry for those sold on it ever being anything more than that, and still hold desperately on to the illusion that specialists in kids games and the kids it attracted can ever do the job of the highly trained aviation specialists that all choose XPlane.

Edited January 1, 2022 by mSparks

[jarmstro 2,402]

11 minutes ago, Bjoern said:

According to the operating system section on page 66, I'm finally part of the 1%!  🥳

When XP12 comes out I may have another fight with Linux. I read of some distro that automatically installs the Nvidia drivers which is where I struggled when I tried it before. Secure Boot is the issue though... I'm thinking that maybe I can just unplug the windows SSD and disable Secure Boot and install Linux. Then reverse the process when I want to use Windows again?

Edited January 3, 2022 by jarmstro

[uwespeed 497]

9 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

When XP12 comes out I may have another fight with Linux. I read of some distro that automatically installs the Nvidia drivers which is where I struggled when I tried it before. Secure Boot is the issue though... I'm thinking that maybe I can just unplug the windows SSD and disable Secure Boot and install Linux. Then reverse the process when I want to use Windows again?

It's not THIS hard. If one claims to be able to handle a complex aircraft, he could do that as well - easily.

[jarmstro 2,402]

28 minutes ago, uwespeed said:

It's not THIS hard. If one claims to be able to handle a complex aircraft, he could do that as well - easily.

So how do I circumvent the fact that I have Secure Boot enabled in order to install Win 11? It's now hard coded into the bios. As far as I know it's not possible for me to dual boot anymore? And installing the NVidia drivers in Ubuntu was indeed an utter illegitimate child.  I await your advice...

I did try disabling secure boot before Christmas but the PC would not even boot into the bios setup! I had to take the battery out to reset it to square one.

Edited January 3, 2022 by jarmstro

[Pascal_LSGC 298]

10 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

So how do I circumvent the fact I have Secure Boot enabled in order to install Win 11? It's now hard coded into the bios. As far as I know it's not possible for me to dual boot anymore? 

FYi, Ubuntu and some other distros support secure boot. No need to deactivate it.
https://itsfoss.com/install-ubuntu-1404-dual-boot-mode-windows-8-81-uefi/
 

But we are OT now.  😉

[jarmstro 2,402]

16 minutes ago, Pascal_LSGC said:

FYi, Ubuntu and some other distros support secure boot. No need to deactivate it.
https://itsfoss.com/install-ubuntu-1404-dual-boot-mode-windows-8-81-uefi/
 

But we are OT now.  😉

Well thanks for the link but it refers to Win10. As far as I understand it turning on the TPM chip stuffs any chance of dual booting? I would love this to be wrong.

EDIT Google says I'm wrong. I may give it a try.

Edited January 3, 2022 by jarmstro

[Bjoern 1,157]

On 1/3/2022 at 3:21 PM, jarmstro said:

When XP12 comes out I may have another fight with Linux. I read of some distro that automatically installs the Nvidia drivers which is where I struggled when I tried it before. Secure Boot is the issue though... I'm thinking that maybe I can just unplug the windows SSD and disable Secure Boot and install Linux. Then reverse the process when I want to use Windows again?

No need to do any of that. I had to enable Secure Boot in BIOS before the upgrade from 10 to 11 and it did not change anything in terms of booting at all, with both Windows 10/11 and Linux working just fine. The only thing that will mess up booting is a BIOS update, but that's fixed in five minutes by reinstalling the bootloader via chroot with an Arch Linux livedisk.

My boot partition priority in the BIOS is:
1. Partition with rEFInd (bootloader with a GUI). Boots Arch Linux and knows where the Windows bootloader is located. Will trigger the latter if I select it during boot.
2. Parition with Windows 11's bootloader. Boots Windows, but can not boot Linux.

Standard boots go through rEFInd. Should the rEFInd be unavailable after a BIOS update, the Windows bootloader will move to position one and the BIOS will auto-pick that one. My laptop has a similar setup, with position 2 being Ubuntu's GRUB bootloader instead of Windows'. On a general GRUB-based setup, you'd simply have your GRUB boot patition at position 1 and Windows' boot partition at position 2.

This may sound inefficient (running two bootloaders one after another), but that way, I always have a fallback OS to boot to.

It's really simple once you get the hang of it.

 

On 1/3/2022 at 3:48 PM, jarmstro said:

And installing the NVidia drivers in Ubuntu was indeed an utter illegitimate child.

It requires a bit more effort on Ubuntu, yes.

If you want to give Linux another try, go for Manjaro with KDE, which is a more stable edition of Arch Linux, but uses the exact same machanics that are so well documented in Arch's wiki. Ubuntu is falling behind a bit in terms of documentation, which makes troubleshooting some issues harder than necessary. Arch Linux generally treats drivers agnostically, meaning that you don't have to mess with third party repositories as on Ubuntu. On my Arch-powered laptop, installing the proprietary Nvidia driver is a matter of downloading the packages, rebooting and that's it.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Bjoern

[jarmstro 2,402]

9 hours ago, Bjoern said:

No need to do any of that. I had to enable Secure Boot in BIOS before the upgrade from 10 to 11 and it did not change anything in terms of booting at all, with both Windows 10/11 and Linux working just fine. The only thing that will mess up booting is a BIOS update, but that's fixed in five minutes by reinstalling the bootloader via chroot with an Arch Linux livedisk.

My boot partition priority in the BIOS is:
1. Partition with rEFInd (bootloader with a GUI). Boots Arch Linux and knows where the Windows bootloader is located. Will trigger the latter if I select it during boot.
2. Parition with Windows 11's bootloader. Boots Windows, but can not boot Linux.

Standard boots go through rEFInd. Should the rEFInd be unavailable after a BIOS update, the Windows bootloader will move to position one and the BIOS will auto-pick that one. My laptop has a similar setup, with position 2 being Ubuntu's GRUB bootloader instead of Windows'. On a general GRUB-based setup, you'd simply have your GRUB boot patition at position 1 and Windows' boot partition at position 2.

This may sound inefficient (running two bootloaders one after another), but that way, I always have a fallback OS to boot to.

It's really simple once you get the hang of it.

 

It requires a bit more effort on Ubuntu, yes.

If you want to give Linux another try, go for Manjaro with KDE, which is a more stable edition of Arch Linux, but uses the exact same machanics that are so well documented in Arch's wiki. Ubuntu is falling behind a bit in terms of documentation, which makes troubleshooting some issues harder than necessary. Arch Linux generally treats drivers agnostically, meaning that you don't have to mess with third party repositories as on Ubuntu. On my Arch-powered laptop, installing the proprietary Nvidia driver is a matter of downloading the packages, rebooting and that's it.

Thank you so much. That is new and useful information to me. I'll definitely  give a try in due course. Especially if it proves to be the case that XP12 performs better under Linux.

[charliearon 3,024]

Keep all discussion of LINUX in the XPlane /LINUX Topic!

[Bjoern 1,157]

On 1/5/2022 at 5:08 PM, charliearon said:

Keep all discussion of LINUX in the XPlane /LINUX Topic!

You missed a few posts in the move, namely from the one above yours up to, and including, this one.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Bjoern

[charliearon 3,024]

7 minutes ago, Bjoern said:

You missed a few posts in the move, namely from the one above yours up to, and including, this one.

Well-O, Life sucks!  As long as the LINUX talk stops! 🤔

[charliearon 3,024]

EOD= End of discussion!