For the next time the "sim or game" debate is raised :)

[MrFuzzy 2,118]

 

[Lange_666 167]

Now turn it around and take off again...

[MarcG 2,977]

Like a glove

[versus 61]

This is what puts me off from playing FS in general. If a person that has never touched a plane can land without crashing on the fiirst attmpt than there is no point in discussing how realistic  flight model or weather is.

I wouldn't know why but simulators are just too easy. Once I have tried approaching a runaway in RL the plane was all over the place I would have smashed it to the ground if it were not for the instructor. The feel of inertia and heaviness of the aircraft + effects of the turbulent air are just not there.  There is unrealistic twitching and oscillations as if the aircraft was made of cardboard but no flutter of the atmosfhere and erratic movements that require subtle yoke inputs and  numerous tiny adjustments to survive. How much I would like to just  try the accurate physics model of flight regardless of all other sim aspects. This is simply lacking all over the flightsim genre. Difficulty. You do something wrong and the plane crashes. Plane simple.

. 

Edited January 4, 2022 by versus

[Rudiii 257]

I much prefer the above Serious Simulators which are specifically designed to be Serious Simulators where no one has ever done anything that isn't in the realm of a Serious Simulator.

Remind me, was it MSFS that had an entire years long youtube series from Airforceproud called "Idiots of FSX online"?

Edited January 4, 2022 by Rudiii

[leprechaunlive 1,852]

MIC DROP

Edited January 4, 2022 by Bob Scott
removed excessively large quote

[Steve Dra 7,588]

A piece of software that attempts to replicate real world activities can be as realistic as the person operating it desires.  I'm working on an app that comes with a helmet with explosives in it linked to the game.  Its activated when all the realism settings are turned to MAX, with crash detection on.

When the sim crashes well, you know. 😉

I bet all those "simmers" out there who claim they can land a 747 at St. Barts or something crazy like that, had this "addon" and had the choice to either prove they could do it or not, would probably decline. 🙂   

Such is the problem will ALL sims and games.  There is not a person on this planet that can take 5-10 AK-47 rounds and still fight back....however just about every shoot-em up lets you...and again, if you take those 10 rounds and perish in the game...respawn is just a few moments away.  Love to have that feature in real life. LOL.  Sadly, some kids we read about in the news who grew up on these games, seem to think they can get shot dead in the real world and just wait for the respawn. 😞 

[Dominique_K 10,141]

1 hour ago, versus said:

  a person that has never touched a plane can land without crashing on the fiirst attmpt than there is no point in discussing how realistic  flight model or weather is.

I had the same thought recently when landing the Gina mil jet. I like this aircraft and I think that the developer did a great job but the fact that I can land her without much difficulty after a little practice and readings shows that something is basically wrong. Same for the Dc-6 or Porter. 

We all had the hope watching the Asobo EP videos early after the MSFS announcement that they were striving to reach a more faithful flying simulation. That was a bit idiotic of course, wishful thinking at least, and we see it more by the day. The MS marketing dept was breathing on their necks.  And maybe that is unattainable anyway in the present state of interfacing  computer with human mind and body.

On the other hand, that doesn't put me off. First it is no different in the other simulators. I even tend to think that MSFS is better. YMMV.  Then I do not have any alternative anyway and there is still an intellectual exercice in simming which is balancing several parameters to reach the goal, put several hundreds of kilos of metal on the ground in a manner that I feel convincing. That is why I always put the crash option on.

[sd_flyer 6,042]

Actually it's common thing with many small airports. Big jet can land but unable to take off!

[WestAir 2,522]

1 hour ago, versus said:

This is what puts me off from playing FS in general. If a person that has never touched a plane can land without crashing on the fiirst attmpt than there is no point in discussing how realistic  flight model or weather is.

I wouldn't know why but simulators are just too easy. Once I have tried approaching a runaway in RL the plane was all over the place I would have smashed it to the ground if it were not for the instructor. The feel of inertia and heaviness of the aircraft + effects of the turbulent air are just not there.  There is unrealistic twitching and oscillations as if the aircraft was made of cardboard but no flutter of the atmosfhere and erratic movements that require subtle yoke inputs and  numerous tiny adjustments to survive. How much I would like to just  try the accurate physics model of flight regardless of all other sim aspects. This is simply lacking all over the flightsim genre. Difficulty. You do something wrong and the plane crashes. Plane simple.

. 

When I was a CFI my coworker had a 14 year old student who landed the plane without his input on the second touch n go. She needed a booster seat to see over the panel.

My old company worked with a local middle school and let 4 classes of kids mess around in the Level D A320 Family sim. A few of these pre teens landed in PHX just fine.

Flying is easy.

[sd_flyer 6,042]

1 hour ago, versus said:

This is what puts me off from playing FS in general. If a person that has never touched a plane can land without crashing on the fiirst attmpt than there is no point in discussing how realistic  flight model or weather is.

I wouldn't know why but simulators are just too easy. Once I have tried approaching a runaway in RL the plane was all over the place I would have smashed it to the ground if it were not for the instructor. The feel of inertia and heaviness of the aircraft + effects of the turbulent air are just not there.  There is unrealistic twitching and oscillations as if the aircraft was made of cardboard but no flutter of the atmosfhere and erratic movements that require subtle yoke inputs and  numerous tiny adjustments to survive. How much I would like to just  try the accurate physics model of flight regardless of all other sim aspects. This is simply lacking all over the flightsim genre. Difficulty. You do something wrong and the plane crashes. Plane simple.

. 

Actually I notice will different look at the sim after experiencing real world flying. In fact, I  felt more realism and value of the sim when being I get my first pilot certificate. The irony is that I thought after real world flying I will never use sims again. Boy was I wrong. 20 years later since I got my private I still flying sims but now as CFI and airplane owner. That is the only difference LOL

[Steve Dra 7,588]

Just now, sd_flyer said:

The irony is that I thought after real world flying I will never use sims again. Boy was I wrong.

Just can't compete with the gas prices in the sim. 🙂  I think that alone keeps most of us away from real flying. 😲

[177B 730]

Some people see life as a game😃.

 

Doing dark night landings in real life always struck me a s a video game, with big consequences. Especially at small rural airports w/o   vasi or papi's. You have very little feeling of where you are, you just judge by the angle of the 2 rows of lights, the rest of your field of view is just black on a moonless night with no other lights than the beacon and runway lights, and then your landing light the last hundred feet or so before touchdown. You scan for eyeballs reflecting from deer, or bigger game on the runway.

 

I always feel I am in a game landing like that. Not too different from early pong games. So far I have always walked away...

 

 

[Krakin 5,760]

17 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

I like this aircraft and I think that the developer did a great job but the fact that I can land her without much difficulty after a little practice and readings shows that something is basically wrong. Same for the Dc-6 or Porter. 

So you're knocking the sim because you have some skill? Have you visited the Kodiak threads recently? Because I see a lot of folks in there asking for help with flying the thing since it's characteristics are so realistic.

 

[greggerm 312]

27 minutes ago, sd_flyer said:

Actually it's common thing with many small airports. Big jet can land but unable to take off!

A famous example of a "tight fit" (C-17 at Peter O. Knight Field after its mistaken landing nine years ago...)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=805M1svwp_8