Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
JETPETER2

FSRealistic Pro is out!!

Recommended Posts

6 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

My feelings exactly. So I'm looking at the engine out of the left window. My eye and the engine are aligned and neither move on my monitor by even a pixel. But in between the window frame is moving up and down. I would be grateful if you you could indeed explain this in layman's language to a poor soul who does not realise that 2+2=4. Because to my inadequate mind the engine should also move relative to its distance from my eye compared to the window. Maybe by a small amount but it should still move. My head goes up, the window goes down, but the engine stays exactly where it was.

i made a small recording just for you. look at the cars across the street. do you think i'm waving a window in front of the camera, or am i just moving my head (camera) very slightly from side to side?

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, molleh said:

i made a small recording just for you. look at the cars across the street. do you think i'm waving a window in front of the camera, or am i just moving my head (camera) very slightly from side to side?

 

The distances are completely different. It's not a valid comparison. The cars are 100 yards away. The engine looking out of the left window of the plane is a few feet away.  Try again. Or fly a plane and look out of a side window at the wing or an engine. And in your vid, if you look closely, the nearer post things do move relative to the window frames and camera. 
 

Edited by jarmstro

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

The distances are completely different. It's not a valid comparison. The cars are 100 yards away. The engine looking out of the left window of the plane is a few feet away.  Try again. Or fly a plane and look out of a side window at the wing or an engine. And in your vid, if you look closely, the nearer post things do move relative to the camera image.
 

well, you can lead a flightsimmer to obvious conclusions, but you can't make them accept them, i suppose. best of luck to ya! 🙂

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, molleh said:

well, you can lead a flightsimmer to obvious conclusions, but you can't make them accept them, i suppose. best of luck to ya! 🙂

Thanks for the discussion.👍

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok.  I have the islander - will take a look.


I like to fool airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio!

Intel i9 12900k in a ROG Strix Z690 D4 motherboard with water cooling, EVGA RTX 3080Ti Ultra, 32 GB DDR4 RAM 3800 CL15, 4 x Samsung 1 TB NVME M.2, with MSFS on a Samsung 980 pro PCIE4 (7000 gb/s).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

It's not a valid comparison.

I have read the discussion with some interest.
For me, the key is that it is a simulator.
The simulator cannot get hold of your head and move it, so it must instead simulate the movement of a head by moving the eyepoint or camera if you prefer.
This in turn must move what is framing the eyepoint, in this case, the windscreen or window.
In the case of a real-world moving car the emblem on the bonnet (hood) in front of the windscreen for example, will indeed look static but the windscreen edges will appear to be moving in relation to it, because the viewer's head cannot remain still in a moving vehicle.
 
 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jarmstro said:

So looking left out of the window in the Islander at the engine my eye and the engine are perfectly aligned and neither moves out of alignment even a fraction. But the window moves up and down. No way is this correct or lifelike.

Considering the developer is working within the constraints of a simulator that is starting year 3 of a 10 year development cycle, I think the added realism he has brought to the sim is very welcomed.  Maybe the engine should move a couple of pixels to be 100 percent accurate, but at least the effect IS THERE. Many things in MSFS aren't 100 percent accurate, but being there adds more to the flying experience than not having the effect.

I feel your glass is half empty, rather than half full.

  • Like 3

Intel i9-10900K @ 5.1Ghz,  Nvidia 2080ti 11Gb, 32Gb Ram, Samsung Odyssey G7 HDR 600 27inch Monitor 2560x1440, Windows 11 Home

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can someone just take a video of the PMDG 737 window moving all its own, or the GA aircraft wing fixed but cabin moving?

I really just want to experience what others are seeing, instead of all this text describing it.

  • Like 1

Take-offs are optional, landings are mandatory.
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
To make a small fortune in aviation you must start with a large fortune.

There's nothing less important than the runway behind you and the altitude above you.
It's better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, than in the air wishing you were on the ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, WestAir said:

Can someone just take a video of the PMDG 737 window moving all its own, or the GA aircraft wing fixed but cabin moving?

I really just want to experience what others are seeing, instead of all this text describing it.

Yep, burdon of proof is on the "wiggly window, static wing" claimants! 

  • Like 2

Bill

MLA / LSA flyer, school teacher and personal assistant to one Greyhound pup.

"Teaching children is not a job. It's a privilege"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right.  I tested with the Islander. 
Just to say beforehand that I have a good grasp of physics (decent A-level) and parallax and how it should work, especially as an amateur astronomer, where parallax is used a lot for gauging distances to stars out to a few thousand light years.  After that the movement can be too small to measure.

It is a linear rule, so an object twice as far away as the datum object will appear to move only half as much - 4 times further away will be a quarter of the movement compared to a near object etc.

On the islander, from the default pilot position, I looked 90 degrees to the left.  I had plenty of gusting set in weather to give me turbulence.  The window frame was moving up and down quite a bit, and it appeared the left engine wasn't.
However, when I placed a transparent ruler over my monitor and lined it up with the bottom of the cowling, I found it was moving, but only about a sixth of the movement of the window frame.
So it is moving, but just harder to gauge because of the smaller movement in amongst nearer objects moving around quite a bit.

When viewed from outside, front on, the pilots head is about six times further away from the left engine cowling than from the window frame (maybe even a bit more). 
So my determination is that the camera and the movement is acting as I would expect, and exactly to parallax measurement. 
Any why wouldn't it?  FS Realistic doesn't break the model into parts and move them differently - how could it?

Not sure what is gong on with the 737, but I don't have it yet (waiting on the -800 like a lot of other people), but my bet is just that the dash is just close to the pilots eye line (as it should be) and simply appears to move about more due to parallax effect.

I did a few more tests, and it all seems quite natural to me, and as I would expect it to be.  Maybe other people just have to get used to the effect.  Certainly I am glad to have it as it really brings the aircraft to life.

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1

I like to fool airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio!

Intel i9 12900k in a ROG Strix Z690 D4 motherboard with water cooling, EVGA RTX 3080Ti Ultra, 32 GB DDR4 RAM 3800 CL15, 4 x Samsung 1 TB NVME M.2, with MSFS on a Samsung 980 pro PCIE4 (7000 gb/s).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

Right.  I tested with the Islander. 
Just to say beforehand that I have a good grasp of physics (decent A-level) and parallax and how it should work, especially as an amateur astronomer, where parallax is used a lot for gauging distances to stars out to a few thousand light years.  After that the movement can be too small to measure.

It is a linear rule, so object twice as far away as the datum object will appear to move only half as much - 4 times further away will be a quarter of the movement compared to a near object.

On the islander, from the default pilot position, I looked 90 degrees to the left.  I had plenty of gusting set in weather to give me turbulence.  The window frame was moving up and down quite a bit, and it appeared the left engine wasn't.
However, when I placed a transparent ruler over my monitor and lined it up with the bottom of the cowling, I found it was moving, but only about a sixth of the movement of the window frame. It is moving, just harder to gauge because of the smaller movement in amongst nearer objects moving quite a bit.

When viewed from outside, front on, the pilots head is about six times further away from the left engine cowling than from the window frame (maybe even a bit more). 
So my determination is that the camera and the movement is acting as I would expect, and exactly to parallax measurement. 
Any why wouldn't it?  FS Realistic doesn't break the model into parts and move them differently - how could it?

Not sure what is gong on with the 737, but I don't have it yet (waiting on the -800 like a lot of other people), but my bet is just that the dash is just close to the pilots eye line (as it should be) and simply appears to move about more due to parallax effect.

I did a few more tests, and it all seems quite natural to me, and as I would expect it to be.  Maybe other people just have to get used to the effect.  Certainly I am glad to have it as it really brings the aircraft to life.

Some here don't like science.....🙄

  • Like 1

spacer.png

Bob Cardone         MSFS 2020 , Fenix A320, Milviz C 310 , Kodiak , PMDG DC6,   Carenado Seminole,  Mooney, JF Arrow, Simple Traffic  

TrackIR   Avliasoft EFB2    ATC  by PF3    FlyVirtual.net  CLX PC

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

Not sure what is gong on with the 737, but I don't have it yet (waiting on the -800 like a lot of other people), but my bet is just that the dash is just close to the pilots eye line (as it should be) and simply appears to move about more due to parallax effect.

Another reason I wanted a video was so I could put it in photoshop and see if the actual pixels moved or not. I have a feeling a lot of people fly with their zoom level not at 100% (real life) but something closer to 20% (way zoomed out to see both cockpit side windows) which would distort parallax immensely. I have this idea people are doing this, because the majority of MSFS videos I see on youtube are done with very low zoom. Often I can barely read any cockpit instruments, and the view is almost fish-eye.

Edited by WestAir
  • Like 3
  • Upvote 1

Take-offs are optional, landings are mandatory.
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
To make a small fortune in aviation you must start with a large fortune.

There's nothing less important than the runway behind you and the altitude above you.
It's better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, than in the air wishing you were on the ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I suspect that this is what the fuss is about. Apologies that it is not about PMDG.
Using the clever ruler trick mentioned by bobcat999, one can indeed see that the engine is not static, as it appears to be at first sight.

I never lose sight of the fact that I am sitting at my desk watching a screen and not in a real aircraft flying in the sky.
I agree that this effect and all the others introduced by this product greatly enhance the experience.

 

 

Edited by Reader
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For the first time since using Ezdok in P3D, today I felt the intuitive need to grab my (non existing) seatbelt to tighten it. Thanks FSR!

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Reader said:

Thank you!

I put the video into photoshop and took 2 screen shots: One when the eye-point was at its highest, and one at the lowest. While the window frame moved a maximum of 9 pixels up/down on the screen, the very top of the engine nacelle moved only 2 pixels.

Sadly, it's difficult to show this difference to you all clearly because of the tiny amount of movement. While I could tell using the layer tool and ruler, most of you wouldn't be able to tell with just two overlapping pictures. It would just look like a blurry image. So instead, I zoomed into one of the rivets on the nacelle and took two pictures of the exact same spot on the screen, with the pilots head at its highest, and at its lowest. The nacelle moves. This is absolutely parallax.

286129147_361079042620933_19686366133539

Edited by WestAir
  • Like 1

Take-offs are optional, landings are mandatory.
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
To make a small fortune in aviation you must start with a large fortune.

There's nothing less important than the runway behind you and the altitude above you.
It's better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, than in the air wishing you were on the ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Tom Allensworth,
    Founder of AVSIM Online


  • Flight Simulation's Premier Resource!

    AVSIM is a free service to the flight simulation community. AVSIM is staffed completely by volunteers and all funds donated to AVSIM go directly back to supporting the community. Your donation here helps to pay our bandwidth costs, emergency funding, and other general costs that crop up from time to time. Thank you for your support!

    Click here for more information and to see all donations year to date.
×
×
  • Create New...