16 minutes ago, Keto Ketchup said:

For the ones that say we should see wingtips inside of clouds clear as day, check this:

I've been on enough commercial flights to know that this video is accurate. And I live in a mountainous region, and when we're literally "in the clouds", I often cannot clearly see a wing's length away walking around my own house. The foggy mist is right there in my face, something that I don't get from the current version of MSFS. In MSFS, I never truly feel "in" the clouds.

Thank you for this video it's very obvious how much less "detail" our clouds have now.  Contrast any of this with this image:

What we now have is the cloud-equivalent of this portrait.    From a distance this is going to be 'okay', but up close it is what it is:  low resolution

And I will add that we're not THAT far off from where it needs to go to match the quality in the rest of the sim which is why a slider to improve density incrementally is something I'd love to see, especially if density can be improved without killing other elements of depiction, which is a big if potentially.

Edited August 2, 20223 yr by Noel

1 minute ago, Noel said:

This current rendering model does not seem capable of delivering the kind of density required.  Doesn't matter if it's voxels or pixels it's simply low resolution, very low, and out of character with the rest of the sim.  

I understand that volumetric, variable-density fog is not easy on a GPU, but more diffuse "everywhere" fog is actually "old tech" that is very easy on modern GPUs.

Using this type of fog and varying the intensity based on one's location in a cloud could be a good compromise. It would definitely be better than nothing in my opinion. I don't personally need to see my wing "slicing" volumetric clouds like the video I present (as cool as it would be), but I would like a sense that I'm actually inside a cloud, and simple diffusion fog that "flickers" in intensity based on where I am in that cloud would give me that.

2 minutes ago, Keto Ketchup said:

I understand that volumetric, variable-density fog is not easy on a GPU, but more diffuse "everywhere" fog is actually "old tech" that is very easy on modern GPUs.

I do wonder if the rendering method using voxels can allow for this, or if there is hybrid rendering using polygons/particle and voxels.  From an article about this:

In practice, however, there are no mainstream methods for easily building out complex, high-resolution objects using voxels. There are some promising attempts (like Atomontage, referenced above) -- but all the other modeling methods listed above are still quicker and easier for truly complex designs. 

Furthermore, modern computers are simply not optimized to handle rendering voxels. Most of our hardware is meant to render polygons -- so high-resolution voxel objects can take a serious toll on current hardware. 

41 minutes ago, Noel said:

Here is your screenshot without the voxel grid appearance--to me this is just looks blurry, looks essentially out of focus.

I was comparing to your screenshot and you saying the clouds are "just horrid" because of pixelization. I showed they are not pixelized, nothing like you show on your screenshot. So I wonder why yours look like that.

Of course they don't have the same resolution of real life clouds, otherwise we wouldn't be able to run the sim at decent FPS with current hardware. 

Edited August 2, 20223 yr by Alvega

Just now, Alvega said:

I was comparing to your screenshot and you saying the clouds are "just horrid" because of pixelization.

You continue to miss the point:  not horrid because of pixelation!  Horrid because of low resolution!

3 minutes ago, Alvega said:

I was comparing to your screenshot and you saying the clouds are "just horrid" because of pixelization. I showed they are not pixelized, nothing like you show on your screenshot. So I wonder why yours look like that.

Of course they don't have the same resolution of real life clouds, otherwise we wouldn't be able to run the at decent FPS with current hardware. 

Didn't say, SAME RESOLUTION!  I said, resolution needs improved, with a slider!  I have AMPLE GPU resources, unspent.  I'd like to see these resources accessed.  If you don't like this idea send in a Wishlist to Asobo and tell them whatever they do, don't add a user control that lets one dial up detail in clouds as their hardware permits 🙃.

Edited August 2, 20223 yr by Noel

Just now, Noel said:

You continue to miss the point:  not horrid because of pixelation!  Horrid because of low resolution!

You show a screenshot with a pixelized cloud, not a low resolution one. So what about the pixelization on your screenshot? Why don't I have it? That's what I'd like to know. 

10 minutes ago, Alvega said:

You show a screenshot with a pixelized cloud, not a low resolution one. So what about the pixelization on your screenshot? Why don't I have it? That's what I'd like to know. 

Oh well, I tried.  Best Wishes.

9 minutes ago, Noel said:

Didn't say, SAME RESOLUTION!  I said, resolution needs improved, with a slider!  I have AMPLE GPU resources, unspent.  I'd like to see these resources accessed.  If you don't like this idea send in a Wishlist to Asobo and tell them whatever they do, don't add a user control that lets one dial up detail in clouds as their hardware permits 🙃.

Who said I don't like that idea? You are confusing things and putting words in my mouth that I didn't say. Again, I was just referring to your screenshot with that pixelized cloud and showing there is probably something wrong with your graphics settings. Of course I want them to improve the cloud resolution as much as possible.

1 minute ago, Noel said:

Oh well, I tried.  Best Wishes.

Next time you need to try better. Best wishes.

Just now, Alvega said:

Of course I want them to improve the cloud resolution as much as possible.

Great, then support the concept of adding a slider to allow you when you do the new build you referred to can actually decide to amp up cloud density as desired and as able.

5 minutes ago, Noel said:

Great, then support the concept of adding a slider to allow you when you do the new build you referred to can actually decide to amp up cloud density as desired and as able.

Sure, did you create a thread on the official forum  asking them for that slider where I can vote? No problem with that.

1 hour ago, Alvega said:

You show a screenshot with a pixelized cloud, not a low resolution one. So what about the pixelization on your screenshot? Why don't I have it? That's what I'd like to know. 

Have you really never seen clouds like are shown in Noel's screenshot?  It's just one of many clouds that Asobo's system creates.  Its a high density cloud.  You can see the same using custom weather by increasing the height, coverage, and density of the middle layer.  But it also occurs in live weather and raymarching apparently makes it look worse than it used to.

 

1 hour ago, Noel said:

Great, then support the concept of adding a slider to allow you when you do the new build you referred to can actually decide to amp up cloud density as desired and as able.

Noel - your picture is showing what happens when cloud density is turned up high.  The low density clouds are low contrast, sometimes transparent, and often have a yellow tint (which are all fairly realistic).  As density increases so does the contrast.  The highlights get brighter and the shadows get darker but, thanks to the raymarching in my opinion, the delicate shading that we had when the sim was released has been replaced with more harsh shading with fewer shades in the gradient.

I don't see why they went to raymarching.  What did it bring that was good?

14 minutes ago, sightseer said:

I don't see why they went to raymarching.  What did it bring that was good?

Ray-marching has always been used since launch. Any differences you perceive are something else, as ray-marching is fundamental to the volumetric cloud rendering method.

18 minutes ago, sightseer said:

Have you really never seen clouds like are shown in Noel's screenshot?  It's just one of many clouds that Asobo's system creates.  Its a high density cloud.  You can see the same using custom weather by increasing the height, coverage, and density of the middle layer.  But it also occurs in live weather and raymarching apparently makes it look worse than it used to.

No, never. And believe me, I tried. Increasing and decreasing all the sliders, custom weather or live weather, can't get clouds like that. But perhaps is because I'm not using raymarching, that I don't know. If you see them with raymarching perhaps try disabling it and see if you can still see them.