Time For A New Version

[tup61 1,562]

5 hours ago, andyjohnston.net said:

Come on Asobo, MSFS is two years old now, surely it's time for v2022 to come out 😉😉 

v2022 has already been released, it's called SU8, and it already got an update called SU9, and in a month or so you'll get another free update called SU10. That's three 'versions' in one year. Life is great. What are you moaning about!? 😎

Yeah, I know it was meant to be a joke but since we actually receive new versions a few times a year it's a really bad joke imho. 😉 The current version of MSFS is way better than the initial release of MSFS imho: other companies would have charged us big bucks for these updates (selling them as new versions). MS is practically giving MSFS away for free if you consider they could have easily asked 10 bucks a month for it. (If you don't agree with the latter: take Navigraph for example.) Just consider the free access we get to the online servers with all the scenery data...! MSFS is a steal and MSFS is utterly awesome. You won't hear me moan about anything MS and Asobo are doing for the flight sim community.

Edited July 26, 2022 by tup61

[turbomax 3,285]

17 minutes ago, tup61 said:

You won't hear me moan about anything MS and Asobo are doing for the flight sim community.

συμφωνώ - je suis d'accord - I agree

I could fly this very version SU10 for years, I haven't even been to 20% of the places in the MSFS world, and even if I was,  I am looking forward to many happy returns. I can not imagine any other "game" that has the potential to entertain me for another ten years.

the world is not enough? - for me it certainly is.

Edited July 26, 2022 by turbomax

[Sceadu 117]

4 hours ago, Odepane said:

prime example of why discord with mods work and old forums don't.  Go necro a thread from 2001 like the cool kids are doing...

What?, if this had been in the Discord there would have been 3 pages of trolling memes, gifs and emojis mostly with zero connection to the original post and the mods would have joined in the 'fun' ....thats better?

Edited July 26, 2022 by Sceadu

[himmelhorse 1,276]

5 hours ago, jbdbow1970 said:

 

 

Not gong to say what the Latin term means.

Mate, the latin version (again age related) was my first and only thought, and that did not make a lot of sense to me.  

I get so confused with the "modern" form (read .. corruption/destruction) of the English language, as she is spoke, including the antonyms and laziness of authors in the modern written form of English which is now almost as unreadable (as opposed to legible) as ye olde English. Age related again I know, but I get so tired of trying to interpret what people are trying to say lately, that I simply give up or respond with gibberish of my own.

I guess what upsets me most is that there is not dictionary, to my knowledge, which defines words like AFAIK, IDK WTH, and my absolute favourite, IRDKWTHIGO (I really don't know what the hell is going on) 

Anyway, this is all a wee bit off topic so I shall leave it at that.

Regards

Tony

 

 

 

[n4gix 4,947]

1 hour ago, himmelhorse said:

I guess what upsets me most is that there is not dictionary, to my knowledge, which defines words like AFAIK, IDK WTH, and my absolute favourite, IRDKWTHIGO (I really don't know what the hell is going on) 

Here you go Tony!  🙃

AFAIK | meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary

[787flyer 633]

and don't forget TL;DR 🤪

 

I originally thought that was a keyboard shortcut for an emoticon and wondered why it didnt work!! ... yes, call me stupid.

Anyway here's what it means:https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/tldr

Amazing what you can find in the dictionary nowadays.

 

[bobcat999 8,482]

It's a tough crowd here Andy!  I wouldn't bother trying to make a joke in future.  

My view anyway is like others have said - just leave it as MSFS without a year in the title.

By the way, the ten year thing is a myth, and they talked about it on a recent Twitch session.
Originally it was a bit of a statement just to show commitment, by they intend to keep just updating it, whether it is for the next 8 years, or another 20.
I can't see the point of starting afresh anymore anyway.  Even MSFS is still built on top of a lot of FSX code.

[abrams_tank 7,417]

9 minutes ago, bobcat999 said:

It's a tough crowd here Andy!  I wouldn't bother trying to make a joke in future.  

My view anyway is like others have said - just leave it as MSFS without a year in the title.

By the way, the ten year thing is a myth, and they talked about it on a recent Twitch session.
Originally it was a bit of a statement just to show commitment, by they intend to keep just updating it, whether it is for the next 8 years, or another 20.
I can't see the point of starting afresh anymore anyway.  Even MSFS is still built on top of a lot of FSX code.

I honestly think in about 8 years time (8 years because we are 2 years into the 10 year cycle), there will be an MSFS 2.  I suspect some of the Asobo team will break off around the 5 year mark (so around 2025), and start work on MSFS 2.

From Microsoft's standpoint, it's another way to make more money.  People said that there would not be another Windows after Windows 10, but so much for that theory.  Microsoft, like any corporation, will not look away if they can make more money.

For the same reason that I think Microsoft won't look away if there is a chance to make more money, I also think they will use the MSFS engine to enter the commercial market - this is not new for Microsoft, they did it before with ESP with FSX. Lots of money to be made in the commercial market, they just have to add some features that commercial customers are looking for (the addition of multiple monitor support in SU 10 is a start in that direction).

Edited July 26, 2022 by abrams_tank

[bobcat999 8,482]

26 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

I honestly think in about 8 years time (8 years because we are 2 years into the 10 year cycle), there will be an MSFS 2.  I suspect some of the Asobo team will break off around the 5 year mark (so around 2025), and start work on MSFS 2.

From Microsoft's standpoint, it's another way to make more money...

True!  I thought this, but then they do make a lot of money out of the expansions and marketplace aircraft they bring out every month, so it is almost like a subscription, and that will only get bigger.

Then again, Microsoft could pull the plug at any time and sack the team anyway, just like with FSX.  It would only take something like Jorg Neumann to leave, and a change at the top of Microsoft.

Probably a bit harder to do that with MSFS, as it does have a lot of momentum, and must be making money, but the first time the wages of the team and the server costs overtake income, they will look at it.

[Greazer 1,320]

2 hours ago, bobcat999 said:

Even MSFS is still built on top of a lot of FSX code.

Nope. Most of it was gutted.

They kept some API and backend stuff. The world scenery, streaming ortho, graphics engine, flight model, aircraft, UI, physics, sound system, config, dev tools etc were all redeveloped or new.

[bobcat999 8,482]

1 hour ago, Greazer said:

Nope. Most of it was gutted.

They kept some API and backend stuff. The world scenery, streaming ortho, graphics engine, flight model, aircraft, UI, physics, sound system, config, dev tools etc were all redeveloped or new.

OK.  I stand corrected then.  Obviously a lot of it is much better for sure, but I thought it was modified or improved upon rather than gutted. 

With graphics for instance, the reason they can't get rid of the horizon line that shows against the scenery in certain conditions is due to is being deeply buried in the legacy code, or so Asobo say.  I dare say that is just one small part of it though.  There is no doubt they have done a lot of work.

[DeepestRed 214]

6 hours ago, himmelhorse said:

I get so confused with the "modern" form (read .. corruption/destruction) of the English language, as she is spoke, including the antonyms and laziness of authors in the modern written form of English which is now almost as unreadable (as opposed to legible) as ye olde English.

"This part in our maker or Poet must be heedyly looked vnto, that it be naturall, pure, and the most vsuall of all his countrey: and for the same purpose rather that which is spoken in the kings Court, or in the good townes and Cities within the land, then in the marches and frontiers, or in port townes, where straungers haunt for traffike sake, or yet in Vniuersities where Schollers vse much peeuish affectation of words out of the primatiue languages, or finally, in any vplandish village or corner of a Realme, where is no resort but of poore rusticall or vnciuill people: neither shall he follow the speach of a craftes man or carter, or other of the inferiour sort, though he be inhabitant or bred in the best towne and Citie in this Realme, for such persons doe abuse good speaches by strange accents or illshapen soundes, and false ortographie. But he shall follow generally the better brought vp sort, such as the Greekes call men ciuill and graciously behauoured and bred. Our maker therefore at these dayes shall not follow Piers plowman nor Gower nor Lydgate nor yet Chaucer, for their language is now out of vfe with vs: neither shall he take the termes of Northern-men, such as they vse in dayly talke, whether they be noble men or gentlemen, or of their best clarkes all is a matter: nor in effect any speach vsed beyond the riuer of Trent, though no man can deny but that theirs is the purer English Saxon at this day, yet it is not so Courtly nor so currant as our Southerne English is, no more is the far Westerne mans speach: ye shall therfore take the vsuall speach of the Court, and that of London and the shires lying about London within lx. myles, and not much aboue."

Is that hard to read?   It's from The Arte of English Poesie, published by literary critic George Puttenham in 1589, and in short it's the same kind of fretting and stressing and nose-upturning ("no resort but of poor rustic and uncivil people... neither shall he follow the speech of a craftsman or carter or other of the inferior sort") that some are participating in here.   And if it's hard to read now, it's because one of the few constants of language is that it changes.   Puttenham would likely find the language we speak now to be crude and broken, and in turn his own fretting tongue would have seemed corrupt and degenerate to someone who lived not too long before him, and so on, ad infinitum.

Unfortuantely, one of the other constants of language is that people will complain about this change, and this often comes with some heavy element of punching down at "lesser" classes or peoples as you see from Puttenham above.   One needs to be careful when eulogizing the decline of the language to bear in mind two key things:

1) Just because different generations or cultures speak differently doesn't mean they speak incorrectly.

2) A failure to adapt to changing times, and changing language, often represents a flaw in the individual, not in the larger society.

(I say this as one who still cringes every single time someone uses "it begs the question" to mean "it makes you ask" rather than referring to the formal logical fallacy...  but I've accepted that usage is changing and I need to change with it rather than seem hopelessly out-of-date and intransigent to the changing world.  As long as the meaning is clear, that is the matter of key import in any communication.)

 

 

Edited July 26, 2022 by DeepestRed

[snwboardn 87]

In less civilized forums we call this a poop post

 I’ll let you fill in the adjective 

[DeepestRed 214]

Language derail aside, as for a "new version"...  there are a lot of games under long-term development that don't work that way any more.   Things can go on for years, being constantly iterated on, improved, and evolved, without ever seeing a name change.   It's just accepted that changes come and go as part of a general process.   For one extreme example, look at Minecraft, which has changed massively since its first release 13 years ago, but at no point has there been "Minecraft 20XX".

That's not to say there aren't counter-examples.   They exist, and they're particularly notable in sports games.   But even those often come with some degree of mockery:  there's rarely much difference between FIFA 2X and FIFA 2X+1 other than a roster update.  Or, to take a more extreme and commonly derided example, for years Dovetail's Train Simulator released a "new" version every year which wasn't really new -- it was the same game, with a few small changes, published with a different mix of tracks and running stock than the year before.

Both are valid paths.  If anything, the "perpetual" version feels a lot more modern to me, and maybe many people.  I have no idea which way MSFS will go long term, but I think saying that we need a new version, in light of all the changes we see on a nearly monthly basis, is missing the forest for the trees.

Edited July 26, 2022 by DeepestRed

[Sky_Pilot071 580]

4 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

I honestly think in about 8 years time (8 years because we are 2 years into the 10 year cycle

Jorg already discounted the 10 year cycle idea and said it was a bad mistake.  Further he said that MSFS development should go on indefinately.

sp