MSFS-Quest 2 SO FRUSTRATED

[joby33y 152]

Turn down ‘Terrain LOD’ , and please try a link cable if you have one.  Trying to fine tune / optimize MSFS over WiFi is tough.Turn OFF Photogrammetry.  

Since you have good clarity w/ native apps, then something basic isn’t set correctly.  I’m not a believer in trying to push this much data over WiFi.  If the router is blocking or otherwise creating a bottleneck, then you’re facing a tough problem to nail down.  
Also, please assign a key so that you can adjust your position backward or forwrd (ie, closer or farther from the panel) while sitting in the cockpit, and let us know if your ability to see the instruments improves after adjusting your position.  

My rig is very similar to yours - I am using the Quest 2 w/ a link cable - decent results.  But it can always be better.
Best of luck, 

[Puddin 70]

@Rob G  I am surprised the Quest 2 is still being classed as suitable for this sim, it maybe ok on a base level, but that's it,.

The data it receives gets compressed then upscaled I believe for its in-built GPU, this then causes the stutters, black slides etc etc.

It doesn't matter what GPU you have on your PC, it is the headset is choking it up forcing you to dial back the settings in the sim or suffer stutters etc.

.

I have both the Quest 2 with expensive link cable and the Reverb G2 , both are/ have been running on a AMD 5700 XT.

Get the Reverb G2, far superior than the Quest for the visuals and sound and comfort!, otherwise you will have to dial back on the settings for the sim for any chance for the Quest to work satisfactorily .

I have retired the Quest, ok for the games but not DCS or FS2020.

Also recommend installing the Open XR toolkit for the G2.

[Rob G 60]

11 hours ago, JacquesBrel said:

The render time values are normal, depending on how dense the surrounding scenery is. The missed frames count will always be increasing in MSFS as you are unlikely to run at max frame rate anywhere in MSFS even with your hardware, except maybe if you're flying somewhere in the desert in the middle of nowhere.

Please try and bring up the pixel density HUD page and tell me what value you have.

I thought I should say that most of my testing is just done sitting in the cockpit on the end of the runway. I say that because the problem I have mostly initially been trying to solve, unreadability of the cockpit controls, occurs that way. To be honest, I have hardly ever actually flown because I have been frustrated that I can barely read anything in the cockpit. Is that a bad way to test?

I have also, for the purpose of this testing with you, eliminated all overclocking of my CPU and GPU and turned off hyperthreading and virtualization in my BIOS. I am also bringing up MSFS with no addons at all, just native MSFS.

I have tried to set up everything according to the specifications you gave me above.

Using 72Hz and 1.0 render quality in the Oculus as specified by you, I don't have the issue with moving my head fast from side to side in the AirLink home page. When I switch to VR and display the pixel density, it shows 1.00, 1.00.

However, at 72Hz and 1.0 in the Oculus app and in-sim render resolution of 100%, everything is very grainy.

Edited August 14, 2022 by Rob G

[JacquesBrel 639]

I would do all testing for the moment with a cable link connection, as joby33y also recommended. Only start using AirLink when you have established a cause and a solution for the issue with the pixelated image.

As mentioned earlier, pixel density should be set to at least 1.2 - 1.3 in any VR game. 1.0 pixel density is the absolutely lowest you should use, and only as a last resort when a game cannot achieve acceptable frame rates otherwise. There is a noticable difference between the image quality of 1.0 PD and 1.3 and above.  So next try and raise the pixel density to 1.3 and then perhaps 1.5, each time verifying in the debug HUD that the pixel density you have set is also the one displayed in the HUD, to make sure that no other utility or setting is overriding the pixel density you set. 

[Rob G 60]

1 hour ago, JacquesBrel said:

I would do all testing for the moment with a cable link connection, as joby33y also recommended. Only start using AirLink when you have established a cause and a solution for the issue with the pixelated image.

As mentioned earlier, pixel density should be set to at least 1.2 - 1.3 in any VR game. 1.0 pixel density is the absolutely lowest you should use, and only as a last resort when a game cannot achieve acceptable frame rates otherwise. There is a noticable difference between the image quality of 1.0 PD and 1.3 and above.  So next try and raise the pixel density to 1.3 and then perhaps 1.5, each time verifying in the debug HUD that the pixel density you have set is also the one displayed in the HUD, to make sure that no other utility or setting is overriding the pixel density you set. 

OK, to be clear, are we talking about changing the pixel density in the Oculus Tray Tool vs the render scale in the sim?

Also, I will start trying to use the link cable, can you give advice as to what settings to use in the Oculus Tray Tool in the "Quest Link" section?

Thanks again ..... Rob

 

P.S. One other thing: What about using the Open XR Toolkit with the Quest 2? Should I skip trhying to use that for now?

Edited August 14, 2022 by Rob G

[JacquesBrel 639]

42 minutes ago, Rob G said:

are we talking about changing the pixel density in the Oculus Tray Tool vs the render scale in the sim?

Pixel density is the value on the rendering resolution slider in the Quest 2 graphics preferences in the Oculus PC app. Same place where you set the Quest 2 refresh rate. Set it to 1.3 there and set it to 1.3 in the Oculus Tray Tool as well. Oculus Tray Tool is one of the applications that can override the pixel density in the Oculus PC app.

You should not run any VR related application besides MSFS and the Oculus Tray Tool (and the Oculus PC app of course). Close/deactivate anything besides those. The goal is to set your pixel density and verify that MSFS is running at the selected value. Do not run anything that might override and interfere with the pixel density setting except Oculus Tray Tool, as you need it to display the debug HUD. 

Verify that you have 1.3 pixel density in MSFS in the debug HUD.

Edited August 14, 2022 by JacquesBrel

[Rob G 60]

What about the Quest Link settings in the Oculus Tray Tool? What settings do you use there?

Also, Nvidia Control Program settings? Do you have modifications or do you use all defaults there?

Edited August 14, 2022 by Rob G

[JacquesBrel 639]

Also, if you aren't already aware, you need to change the pixel density setting before you activate VR in MSFS (or any VR game for that matter). Changing it while VR is running won't have any effect.

[JacquesBrel 639]

3 minutes ago, Rob G said:

What about the Quest Link settings in the Oculus Tray Tool? What settings do you use there?

One thing at a time. We need to test and verify that you can change the pixel density before we try other settings.

[Rob G 60]

When trying to use the Link cable I get this terrible ghosting in the background that blurs everything. If I switch back to AirLink the ghosting goes away. I have the pixel density set to 1.3 in the Oculus app and also in the Oculus Tray Tool. The HUD shows the correct pixel density. I actually think that using a pixel density of 1.3 in the app and the tray tool, I am starting to get a little better imaging (still on the ground; haven't flown anywhere). At 72Hz in the Oculus app I cannot go any higher than 1.3. Assuming that the Oculus app and the tray tool shlould match for pixel density, I would have to change the refresh rate in the Oculus app to 80Hz or 90Hz to get a higher density.

What do you think I should do next? At this point the cockpit of myh Cessna 172 G1000 is better than it's ever been but I would love to make things even better. I am just such a novice with tuning MSFS and the headset that I am afraid to change anything without advice from someone who knows better than me what to do.

The irony is that I am a retired computer specialist from a major corporation :-).

[Rob G 60]

OK, Update: With your help, I have made great strides with my system. The imaging is now better than its ever been before. I can even read displays in the cockpit, not perfectly, but much better than ever before.

I admit I still haven't flown anywhere. Still on the ground and the HUD display is saying I am only getting 27 fps just sitting there in a cessna.

So I guess it's time to think about how top best improve fps without totally killing the visuals I have now.

Presently, photogrammetry is turned off. All in-sim VR options sliders are at 100%.

Oculus app set to 72Hz, 5408x2736 (1.3)

Oculus tray tool set to pixel density 1.3. ASW is Disabled.

And my motherboard is running at default everything (prior to this testing, the CPU was overclocked and the dram was overclocked a little as well. .

I am going to actually take off with the plane before changing anything and fly around a bit (I don't really know how to fly the plane very well LOL),

just to see how things look from the air, now that they look pretty good from the ground. May take a full PC backup too so there's a good baseline to come back to if

I messed anything up.

Your help witjh improving FPS would be greatly appreciated. Is this where the Open XR Tool might help? I don't know how to use it yet. I have watched some YouTube videos by some bloggers but I don't know what kind of settings would work with my setup.

Still a bit baffled about why the Link Cable testing yielded some kind of ghosted background across the whole screen when using it.

[JacquesBrel 639]

Great - so it was apparently low pixel density that was the issue. With your system you should probably be able to run it higher than 1.3, and also run a higher refresh rate than 72 Hz. So try 80 Hz/1.4 next. I'm not sure why the Oculus app limits max pixel density based on refresh rate, but at 80 Hz you will have 1.4 as the max value. Perhaps you can override it with a higher value in Oculus Tray Tool, but it's been ages since I've done any tweaking of pixel density. With my 3080 I've set it to 1.35 and 80 Hz.

I haven't used Air Link, so I can't say why you get ghosting with the link cable and not in Air Link. With ASW off, which is recommended, you will get some ghosting when panning your view around, particularly if your frame rate drops. You should aim to have your frame rate at half the refresh rate, but in very big airports in large cities it can't always be achieved. In those cases you should try switching temporarily to ASW 30 Hz in the Oculus Tray Tool (30 Hz is a little misleading - it will be one third of your current refresh rate)

MSFS is the most performance intensive VR game and one of the hardest to configure properly. You will have to compromise on most settings and will have to do a fair bit of testing to find out what are acceptable compromises for you, and even after you've done that you will have places in MSFS that will always be very hard on performance.

Next I would recommend that you enable Link Sharpening if you haven't already. The sharpness helps a fair bit with the image quality. In addition, you should enable the OpenXR Toolkit, and also experiment with the sharpening options there. I use AMD FSR sharpening at 50%. Much higher than that will start to give you oversharpening artefacts.

As for the Oculus Link settings I use Distortion Curvature Low, Encode Resolution 3840 and Bitrate Max. The Oculus Tray Tool lets you go to 500 Mbps, but if you use the Oculus Debug Tool in C:\Program Files\Oculus\Support\oculus-diagnostics (default location) you can manually enter a higher bitrate. You will perhaps not see much benefit after 800 - 1000 Mbps. I also can't remember what is the max Encode Resolution you can select in Oculus Tray Tool, so maybe 3840 needs to be input manually in the Oculus Debug Tool as well.

Once you have your pixel density/refresh rate/link settings where you get an OK image, then I would enable FFR in the OpenXR Toolkit and find a setting that works for you. FFR helps quite a bit with performance, with the only downside that also affects the MSFS menu screens in VR and pixelates the text at the edges.

As for most other settings, you've already mentioned the video guides by Pie in the Sky Tours, so I would just follow his guides. Since the Quest 2 doesn't have a completely stellar display resolution, I would only set MSFS render scaling lower than 100 as an absolutely last resort, and also not use upscaling in the OpenXR ToolKit if it can be avoided (for better VR displays it's another matter). I use the AMD upscaler but at 100% upscaling only so I can use the AMD FSR sharpening, as mentioned. I would expect that with a 3090 card you don't need to use MSFS render scaling or OpenXR upscaling.

Edited August 15, 2022 by JacquesBrel

[JacquesBrel 639]

Also worth mentioning is to always use a frame rate counter in VR when doing any configuration testing. I think there is one in the OpenXR Toolkit. I always use the Oculus debug HUD page that displays frame rate and GPU/CPU milisecond timings, to check if my frame rate is mostly limited by the GPU or CPU - though the CPU timings are average across all cores, so it can't always tell you if the MSFS main thread on one of the cores is the limiting factor. For that scenario you will sometimes need to check the MSFS frame counter in the developer tools menu.

[joby33y 152]

20 hours ago, Puddin said:

Get the Reverb G2, far superior than the Quest for the visuals and sound and comfort!, otherwise you will have to dial back on the settings for the sim for any chance for the Quest to work satisfactorily .

Appreciate the post & advice, because last Saturday, I ordered the G2.  I have reached the end of my patience with the Quest (&I’ve been flying in VR for years).   Good for stand alone VR experiences, but I too will move on for MSFS & P3D flights.  Thx, 

[Puddin 70]

3 hours ago, joby33y said:

Appreciate the post & advice, because last Saturday, I ordered the G2.  I have reached the end of my patience with the Quest (&I’ve been flying in VR for years).   Good for stand alone VR experiences, but I too will move on for MSFS & P3D flights.  Thx, 

If I knew how to upload a screen grab for this site I would for the settings in FS2020 in VR, but I don't!

Basically I have everything on Ultra to high, the shadows and reflections at mid range. When using the Open XR tool kit allow the sim to settle for a few seconds when you transfer into VR and then all will be good.

If you still get stuttering dial back on LOD, that is CPU not GPU

Make sure you have a fan nearby though, if your rig pushes out all the graphical goodness your face will eventually cook!

Being a resident of the UK excessive heat is rare, so its a benefit for me, California I guess can be a bit hotter!.

In the Windows MIXED REALITY PORTAL  my settings are-- Resolution = Best Quality, the other upscaling option creates 2 separate panels in the headset for whatever reasons for me.

The frame rate set at LET WINDOWS DECIDE.

 

 

Edited August 15, 2022 by Puddin
amendment