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Guest iwantmydc3

Wilco/Feelthere broken promises

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Guest Len

>again and again and again ... stay away from that company.>there are enough threads on the forums showing that they are>only ripping people off. their products are rubbish and their>service non-existent. >>==Marten:Weber==>P-D920 oc3.64MHz 2GB RAM WinXP ATI X1900+1024MB 2xSATA250>2xVIEWSONIC 19">Need AI? Check www.world-of-ai.com!I have to agree. This goes back to the PIC A320 where Wilco screwed the developers of the product by releasing it prematurely. When it was a problem to fly I wanted my money back. They did not respond to my emails first and then told me to wait. For what? I never did get my money back from this bunch and didn't want to get into a *&ssing contest with them so I let it go.

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If you're talking about feelthere I'd have to respectfully disagree. The 737 and the Citation X are very well done at least in my opinion, not perfect, but very well done.One of the complaints many have is Wilco's infamous bug collection form. To me it makes good sense to collect bugs through one input so they can be pooled and analyzed with all the pertinent system and user info instead of a forum which seems a haphazard/inconsistent way of collecting the same information. The one negative I have is the manuals for the 737 and X. They do a good job of getting you flying but don't delve too deep in to the more complex features of the products, especially the citationX. I will note that the forums have been very helpful in resolving that shortfall in information.Edit: Please note that I'm new to there products so at this point I haven't been burned as Len has. So far so good, fingers crossed.Ian.

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The PIC A320 was developed by Anticyclone, not FeelThere. While I have to agree that the A320 was complete and utter rubbish (however maybe 5 years ahead of its time in terms of CPU load), FeelThere is an entirely different league.While their products are not whoa-yay-awesome and their support and QA is questionable, they do keep on working on it and after the 2nd or 3rd service pack they are actually enjoyable.I do enjoy their classic 737, the CRJ and the A320 and Wilco/FT are still extremely active and don't just abandon their projects, like other 1-man garage developers. It ain't Flight1, but...oh well.Pat

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Guest QFA001

Fact time boys and girls:Feelthere products vs. FSX compatibility:PIC Legacy released for fs9 FREE update for fsXPIC Citation released for BOTH fs9 and fsXAirbus series released for BOTH fs9 and fsXPIC 737 released for fs9 FREE fsX update is availablePIC ERJ released for fs9 FREE fsX update is available777 was released for fs9 FREE fsX update is availableCRJ was released for fs2002 was patched for fs9 and promised a free fsX updateCaravan a $15 product is not officially fsX ready while it can be ported to this version tooThe A380, A400 is NOT a feelThere product.So I don't really see any broken promises instead of (even after the flaming) a company who will not doublecharge their customers for fs versions. It became hip to flame feelThere but can you show me another company with similar productivity and free updates? Time to think...This topic is not about Wilco and their customer service but reliability of a developer.QFAEdited for more accuracy

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Guest dwaohio

I wrote Wilco a email on their customer service address yesterday and want to see what happened to it.Your message To: Info - Wilco Publishing Subject: Customer complaints Sent: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 15:43:21 +0200was deleted without being read on Fri, 6 Jul 2007 09:52:51 +020Great customer serviceDave

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Guest QFA001

Thank you for hijacking your own thread. This topic is about feelthere and the fsX updates.Your intention is pretty clear. After making fool of yourself with an invalid statement you needed to find another way to make bad reputation for feelThere.Now going back to your new topic. Wilco and feelThere asked probabbly a million times to use their form instead of their email. I have no doubt you've received the email above but let me point that out anyone could make such as especially watching your trend. So resend them your complains using their form and let's see.And for the sake of clear picture; Wilco is WILCO PUBLISHING and feelthere is a development company. While they have contracts to bind them together on certain projects they are a different company run by different people. Marc Anthony (or whoever) is not Wal Mart because you bought his last CD overthereQFA

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QFA? Quintessential Fanboy Association, maybe?My personal experience is that many of the complaints sent via the Wilco support form never make it to the known bugs section nor are later corrected, and no explanation is ever given. All the customer gets in the form of feedback is an autoresponse e-mail acknowledging receipt of the form, and a series of service packs that fail to address many (most) of the problems.What's worse, is that the potential customer never sees that there are a rash of big legitimate complaints with the software in its current form.Wilco and Feelthere have contracts that bind them together, true, and for that I hold FeelThere accountable. It's a crappy customer service arrangement that, after all the negative experiences many of us have had, FeelThere has chosen to continue making. It's not reasonable to let FeelThere push the blame onto a partner they chose to stay in bed with and then act like none of it is their responsibility.RegardsBob ScottATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-VSantiago de Chile


Bob Scott | President and CEO, AVSIM Inc
ATP Gulfstream II-III-IV-V

System1 (P3Dv5/v4): i9-13900KS @ 6.0GHz, water 2x360mm, ASUS Z790 Hero, 32GB GSkill 7800MHz CAS36, ASUS RTX4090
Samsung 55" JS8500 4K TV@30Hz,
3x 2TB WD SN850X 1x 4TB Crucial P3 M.2 NVME SSD, EVGA 1600T2 PSU, 1.2Gbps internet
Fiber link to Yamaha RX-V467 Home Theater Receiver, Polk/Klipsch 6" bookshelf speakers, Polk 12" subwoofer, 12.9" iPad Pro
PFC yoke/throttle quad/pedals with custom Hall sensor retrofit, Thermaltake View 71 case, Stream Deck XL button box

Sys2 (MSFS/XPlane): i9-10900K @ 5.1GHz, 32GB 3600/15, nVidia RTX4090FE, Alienware AW3821DW 38" 21:9 GSync, EVGA 1000P2
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Portable Sys3 (P3Dv4/FSX/DCS): i9-9900K @ 5.0 Ghz, Noctua NH-D15, 32GB 3200/16, EVGA RTX3090, Dell S2417DG 24" GSync
Corsair RM850x PSU, TM TCA Officer Pack, Saitek combat pedals, TM Warthog HOTAS, Coolermaster HAF XB case

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Guest QFA001

Once again, the topic is about feelthere and the fsX updates. Bob, you will not loose an opportunity to bass feelthere even in this case they are in fact one of the most positive companies in the industry aren't you. I'm sure if I would take (waste) the time to make fun of your name I could come up with something fun. Going back to the original topic; do you believe FT lied or broke any promise in regard of fsX updates os possible the most active developer to crank out free updates? A yes or no would do the job.QFA

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Forum threads morph in the course of the discussion, and since nobody made you the thread police, I'll feel free to discuss the unhappy direction FeelThere has taken as a developer, and Wilco as a publisher.I think if you can manage to work a search engine you'll find that my initial position was very much in support of FeelThere until they started doing stupid things like moving their Citation X support to Wilco's black hole, and releasing a series of SPs that miss solving problems despite knowing they have the solutions in their hands. They are, in fact, going the way of CaptainSim in their support, which makes them anything but one of the most positive companies in the industry. Quite the opposite, in fact.I call 'em as I see 'em. If you want to call it bashing, so be it, I can live with the criticism of just another nameless chattering voice from the cacophonous thunder of internet background noise.RegardsBob ScottATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-VSantiago de Chile


Bob Scott | President and CEO, AVSIM Inc
ATP Gulfstream II-III-IV-V

System1 (P3Dv5/v4): i9-13900KS @ 6.0GHz, water 2x360mm, ASUS Z790 Hero, 32GB GSkill 7800MHz CAS36, ASUS RTX4090
Samsung 55" JS8500 4K TV@30Hz,
3x 2TB WD SN850X 1x 4TB Crucial P3 M.2 NVME SSD, EVGA 1600T2 PSU, 1.2Gbps internet
Fiber link to Yamaha RX-V467 Home Theater Receiver, Polk/Klipsch 6" bookshelf speakers, Polk 12" subwoofer, 12.9" iPad Pro
PFC yoke/throttle quad/pedals with custom Hall sensor retrofit, Thermaltake View 71 case, Stream Deck XL button box

Sys2 (MSFS/XPlane): i9-10900K @ 5.1GHz, 32GB 3600/15, nVidia RTX4090FE, Alienware AW3821DW 38" 21:9 GSync, EVGA 1000P2
Thrustmaster TCA Boeing Yoke, TCA Airbus Sidestick, 2x TCA Airbus Throttle quads, PFC Cirrus Pedals, Coolermaster HAF932 case

Portable Sys3 (P3Dv4/FSX/DCS): i9-9900K @ 5.0 Ghz, Noctua NH-D15, 32GB 3200/16, EVGA RTX3090, Dell S2417DG 24" GSync
Corsair RM850x PSU, TM TCA Officer Pack, Saitek combat pedals, TM Warthog HOTAS, Coolermaster HAF XB case

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>I can live with the criticism of just another nameless>chattering voice from the cacophonous thunder of internet>background noise.>>Regards>>Bob Scott>ATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-V>Santiago de Chile:-lol :-lol :-lol :-lolAndr


 

André
 

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Guest dwaohio

Scott you are right that QFA has no idea what he is talking about. Right on Wilco support page it tell you to contact Feelthere for support. Funny thing is Feelthere does not field questions on certain aircraft they developed and tells you to contact Wilco. I call it Wilco Feelthere ping pong and the customer are the ball. From Wilco support:COMMON QUESTIONS/ANSWERSAll technical questions to feelThere developments can be issued at feelThere forum : http://www.iemit.com/forum/There you can find questions/answers and also comments from developers and users.Citation X forum on Feelthere is locked for question concerning Citation X. Than you email Wilco for support and your email do this:Your message To: Info - Wilco Publishing Subject: Customer complaints Sent: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 15:43:21 +0200was deleted without being read on Fri, 6 Jul 2007 09:52:51 +0200QFA and others that take up the cause for Wilco and Feelthere what should customers do and think after being the ball. All I want is to get my aircraft updated as promised by Wilco after FSX came out in the time they promised and get support for aircraft with feedback.Without this they broke there promises. Dave

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Dwaohio,I do not agree with Feelthere's policy regarding using the Wilco "bug reporting" system for support, but WHY do you keep insisting that Feelthere has "broken their promise" regarding FSX updates??They -->HAVE<-- released updates for FSX... for the Legacy, the Airbus, the 737 and the Citation X. I have the FSX versions all four aircraft installed and running.Those updates have been available for quite some time, and are clearly announced on the Feelthere forums, and on the Wilco web site.Jim Barrett


Jim Barrett

Licensed Airframe & Powerplant Mechanic, Avionics, Electrical & Air Data Systems Specialist. Qualified on: Falcon 900, CRJ-200, Dornier 328-100, Hawker 850XP and 1000, Lear 35, 45, 55 and 60, Gulfstream IV and 550, Embraer 135, Beech Premiere and 400A, MD-80.

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Guest dwaohio

Because they developed new programs before finishing the once they already had on the market. Once Wilco stated that they would update the programs for free to FSX version Feelthere should have done that before developing anything new. They could have even used the updates as a test platform for there new stuff. They should have used them as a learning curve before developing new stuff that need a lot of work once released. That is why they broke a promise. Feelthere back in March stated while on vaction they would take the time and upgrade programs.

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Guest

>I don't want to get OT, but it was mentioned above, and I did>not know where else to respond...>>"Flightscenery promised an fsx version of the portland 2004>scenery that has never materialized and the guy doesn't even>maintain or read his own forums any more on this issue. I hear>he has moved on to other projects.">>Vauchez hasn't mentioned no future updates that I saw. He has>been intensly involved in the AirlinerXP project, and from>reading the forums, there has been a slight delay in the>release of the Airbus. I am sure he will resume on Flight>Scenery after that. At least that is what I hope. There is>certainly alot of crazy stuff that goes on now a days with>Devs, but I don't think Flgiht Scenery is one to be concerned>about. I myself am not too happy with the Feelthere/Wilco>stuff that has taken place recently, but time will tell I>quess. Anyway, sorry to get OT. I thought this would be the>place to express my feelings on the matter. Honestly I don't really care what he is working on unless it is the Portland fsx scenery upgrade that was promised. He doesn't update the site or let anyone on there know what the ETA is for the fsx update which is my main gripe. I share your hope as well that he will deliver as promised and all he really needs to do is hop on his own website and let people know what his intenstions are and what the ETA is. Not a hard thing to do. The fact that he hasn't done that leads us all to believe that he has washed his hands of the promised fsx update and he is ducking his customers. Not cool.________________________________________________________________________________________________Intel D975XBX2 'Bad Axe 2' | Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 @ 3.20Ghz | 2 GB Super Talent DDR2 800 | Big Typhoon VX | eVGA 8800GTS @ 565/900 | Seagate 2x320GB SATA RAID-0 | OCZ GameXStream 700W | Creative X-Fi | Silverstone TJ-09BW | Matrox Triplehead Setup

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FT/Wilco doesn't act like any other developer out there.There are still patches for current products from a wide range of developers who concurrently release new products while maintaining previously released products. You make it sound like FT/Wilco just releases their products and run away with your money, which is not the case, because they do release updates and *free* FSX upgrades, which is something that is uncommon (and IMHO very generous).Sure, there are existing support problems and some (really unnecessary) quality issues, which are, as far as I am concerned, valid, but this thread is about release schedules and "broken promises". That is an entirely different topic.Without Wilco/FT we would have no B737-3/4/5 and no Airbus for FSX. And I for myself find all of the recent releases highly entertaining.Pat

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