Blackbird…*caugh*…Milviz puts ATR project on hold

[Fiorentoni 4,114]

1 hour ago, abrams_tank said:

Who announced the ATR first? Was it Milviz that announced first, or was it Microsoft/Hans Hartmann that announced the ATR first?

It's unfortunate that there is no collaboration between the top plane developers.  For example, FSimStudios and Roman Design were communicating about who would do CYYJ, as both companies wanted to do CYYJ. In the end, FSimStudio said they had a lot of projects in the queue and they wouldn't get to CYYJ anytime soon, so FSimStudio gave Roman Design their blessing to work on CYYJ first.

Despite being competitors, FSimStudio and Roman Design were communicating.  It's really sad when Mliviz and Microsoft are not communicating, because this is a huge waste of time and money, and the MSFS community stands to lose from all this (ie. if Milviz and Microsoft were communicating, maybe Milviz would have completed another plane by now, with the money & time they invested in the ATR).

Milviz has been working on the ATR since FSX times IIRC. Microsoft announced the ATR from Hans Hartmann very early, so this was definitely communicated. It‘s just that Milviz figured it might still be worthwhile until now; this is what took them so long, not missing communication.

[St Mawgan 1,348]

What is it they say about snoozing and losing. 

[abrams_tank 7,392]

2 hours ago, NZ255 said:

Milviz now Blackbird have been working on this ATR for at least 6 years, announced for FSX and P3D back in 2017. It’s unfortunate timing for them with MSFS coming out mid development forcing them to retarget the sims, but we can’t wait for them forever. 

In this case, I think Microsoft/Hans Hartmann should have asked Milviz if they were going to do the ATR for MSFS, and ask Milviz what was their timeline for doing the ATR for MSFS. If Milviz was many years out from finishing the ATR (ie. 2024 and beyond), then of course, it is within Microsoft/Hans Hartmann's right to do the ATR for MSFS. But if Milviz was going to complete the ATR within the next year or two years, I think Microsoft/Hans Hartmann  should have picked a different plane to work on. Milviz is also a partner of Microsoft (ie. Microsoft paid Milviz do to the Beaver for the 40th anniversary edition of MSFS), so it's unfortunate that they could not work out a solution to this.

With FSimStudios and Roman Design, FSimStudios acknowledged that they had too many projects lined up before they could begin work on CYYJ.  So FSImStudios did what was in the best interests of the Canadian MSFS community, FSImStudios told Roman Design to do CYYJ first, and that perhaps sometime in the future (ie. a few years out from now), FSimStudios would revisit CYYJ.  That is what good communication and good collaboration is like, for the MSFS flight sim community, IMO.

For this, I am very grateful that FSimStudios gave Roman Design their blessing for CYYJ, it was very unselfish of FSimStudios, and the Canadian MSFS community stand to benefit from FSimStudio's unselfishness.

Edited January 10, 2023 by abrams_tank

[Zangoose 1,631]

The ATR by Hans was announced back in early 2021 so it wasn't exactly new news this was coming. I don't quite remember when we first heard Milviz was going to put their ATR into MSFS? Either way, I can understand why they have put the project on hold. 

In the simulator world there is always going to be duplicate products as such - Hell, look at scenery. Some airports have like 2 or even 3 versions of the same airport made by different developers. Sometimes it's hard to know what others are doing if its not announced real early. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Zangoose

[vin747 316]

milviz king air - any update? 

[abrams_tank 7,392]

19 minutes ago, Zangoose said:

The ATR by Hans was announced back in early 2021 so it wasn't exactly new news this was coming. I don't quite remember when we first heard Milviz was going to put their ATR into MSFS? Either way, I can understand why they have put the project on hold. 

In the simulator world there is always going to be duplicate products as such - Hell, look at scenery. Some airports have like 2 or even 3 versions of the same airport made by different developers. Sometimes it's hard to know what others are doing if its not announced real early. 

Yeah, I don't mind if there are duplicate products for the same plane, or for the same airport, eventually.  This is always going to happen when developers run out of airports and planes to make.

However, I think at least for planes, MSFS is quite early in its cycle, and there are so many planes still to make, that I think there could be better coordination among developers to avoid overlap. I think after maybe, 2026, or so, we'll start to see more overlap in planes, because maybe in 3 years, the most popular planes will have been covered by MSFS. But we're not quite there yet - there are so many popular planes that still have not been covered by MSFS, so that's why I am amazed that the coordination between Microsoft/Hans Hartmann and Milviz, was so poor, especially because Milviz ended up as a partner of Microsoft.

[bendead 1,085]

It's also quite silent on the SR-71, no new preview for 6 month, last time the cockpit was about to get painted, integration of the aft cockpit was on hold, functions list was not published.

We know it's coming but not much more

[Nuno Pinto 1,394]

5 hours ago, ryanbatc said:

 

Hans Hartmann is no joke.

I....er... uh... Yeah, nevermind (CRJ?).

As for Milviz, although it is sad to see it's nothing i wasn't expecting, they have a REALLY long development cycle (Yeah, B350i, i moved to MSFS a few months after finally being able to fly it).

[Abriael 952]

4 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

Despite being competitors, FSimStudio and Roman Design were communicating.  It's really sad when Mliviz and Microsoft are not communicating, because this is a huge waste of time and money, and the MSFS community stands to lose from all this (ie. if Milviz and Microsoft were communicating, maybe Milviz would have completed another plane by now, with the money & time they invested in the ATR).

How did you get to the conclusion that Microsoft and Milviz are not communicating when Milviz literally sold an aircraft to Microsoft for the 40th anniversary edition? 🤔

Unfortunate, but honestly if this was the route they were gonna take, this is a decision they should have taken ages ago. The ATR by Microsoft was announced in April 2021. Almost 2 years ago.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Abriael

[micstatic 4,313]

Disappointed in this news. I was planning on flying the stock atr and seeing if I liked it as much as the majestic q400. Then was going to move up to the milviz version. 

[Pastaiolo 1,686]

I'll rather have a product delivered from Asobo than another vapourware from Milviz.

I am still burned by the whole King Air 350i experience on FSX. I am never approaching them ever again.

I also still remember at one point they tried to bring the ATR on other sims and then said it wasn't commercially viable. Besides that, who's fault is it they messed up the model and had to do it again? Surely not ours or Asobo's.

[ckyliu 1,749]

2 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

I think Microsoft/Hans Hartmann should have asked Milviz... what was their timeline for doing the ATR for MSFS. If Milviz was many years out from finishing the ATR (ie. 2024 and beyond), then of course, it is within Microsoft/Hans Hartmann's right to do the ATR for MSFS. But if Milviz was going to complete the ATR within the next year or two years, I think Microsoft/Hans Hartmann  should have picked a different plane to work on.

Now come on Abrams, you're an old hand at flight simming you know better than to ask for or rely on a release date estimate from an FS addon developer! If they had said 1 year it would've been at least 3 anyway.

Do we know what sort of complexity level the MS/AS/Hans Hartmann ATR72-600 is likely to be, will it be similar to the CRJ?

Edited January 10, 2023 by ckyliu

[tamsini 278]

I commend Blackbird for their honesty and keeping their valued customers in the loop (count myself as one of them - Milviz has always been one of my top three developers). Whatever they put out next, my credit card will be waiting.

[orchestra_nl 923]

1 hour ago, vin747 said:

milviz king air - any update? 

There is a default King Air 350i that will probably satisfy those that aren't interested in system depth. Those that are probably have purchased the Blacksquare analog King Air addon and although that is "just" a 350, so steam gauges, its system depth is very good. Lots of simmers actually prefer steam gauges so I doubt there would be a huge market for a glass King Air. I would be interested in a good one but the market is already quite saturated.

[Donka 641]

I wonder if the Asobo Porter had any bearing on this. Blackbird took their time to get Phase 2 released and wonder if that was due to an impact on sales.