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Christopher Low

PMDG 737-600 Observations

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Can someone please explain the quirks exhibited by the PMDG Boeing 737-600 in MSFS?

  • Why does it always exhibit a very slight pull to the left (even after I have calibrated my CH Flightstick Pro joystick)?
  • Why does it veer to the side with the slightest twitch of my joystick after touchdown?
  • Why does it take ages for the REV light to appear (and therefore delays activation of the thrust reversers)?

I assume that these are universal problems that affect all users of the -600 (and maybe also the other versions)? The second issue is probably something to do with having the same control inputs for the nosewheel as I do for the ailerons, but the other two are not so easy to dismiss. Does everyone else experience these "features" with the PMDG 737s?


Christopher Low

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I have the -700, and don't have any uncommanded pull to the side.

My guess is your joystick is not centering consistently and/or spiking.  I'd start by using a program like DIView (free utlity from the LeoBodnar website) to inspect the output of the joystick at the hardware level.  A dragging brake from a nonzero brake axis input could explain swerving on the ground as well.

As to the reversers, in real world ops, it takes a few seconds for the reverser sleeves to deploy before you can retard the throttles past the reverse idle stop.  You should see an amber "REV" above the N1 gauges immediately, and then the annunciations will turn green when the reversers are close to fully deployed.  It then takes ~4-11 seconds for the engines to spool to full reverse.  I operate them by pulling them back slightly into the rev range, and when I get a green REV indication, I retard to full reverse.

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1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

I assume that these are universal problems that affect all users of the -600 (and maybe also the other versions)? 

They are not, since there aren't reams of similar complaints.
Most probably, you either have a noisy joystick, like Bob says, or one/some/all of the MSFS Assistance options are turned on, when they should be completely off.

Unlikely, but not outside the range of possibility, is that an add-on in your Community Folder may be interfering.

Also, just to check, are you running the latest version, build 3.00.0087?

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I have adjusted the "trim wheel" (for want of a better term) at the rear of the CH Flightstick Pro, and this has alleviated quite a lot of the left hand drift. The problem is that this wheel is very stiff, so I need to be careful! I have also switched the controls to Tiller + Rudder (from Rudder Only) in the PMDG Setup options, so I will see if this helps with the ground handling immediately after touchdown.

The delay in the amber REV light appearing seems to be related to the throttle wheel. It is quite erratic at times in MSFS, and I noticed that it was not reducing to idle thrust properly after landing at KGYY Chicago Gary Regional airport a few minutes ago. I am not sure what I can do about this.....

EDIT: I am using Build 3.00.087. I will check the Assistance Options.

Edited by Christopher Low

Christopher Low

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On a side note, I noticed during my approach to runway 12 that what should have been circular oil tanks appeared to be buildings of some kind. Is the Blackshark AI not capable of rendering these oil tanks properly? Normal houses/buildings are almost never circular, so I would have thought that the AI should easily be capable of identifying an oil tank :huh:

Edited by Christopher Low

Christopher Low

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1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

Why does it take ages for the REV light to appear (and therefore delays activation of the thrust reversers)?

Check your aircraft settings for the option "high idle in flare". In the real airplane the engines are kept at high/flight idle rather than ground idle, so that in case of a go around they will spool up quickly. If they were in ground idle it would take way too long for them to spool up and reach go around thrust.

In the sim however, a limitation of the engine model means either A. The airplane goes into ground idle more quickly which enables the deployment of reverse thrust at a realistic speed, or B. The engines remain in flight idle as in the real one, but reverse thrust deployment is significantly delayed after touch down.

For proper reverse thrust deployment you'll want the setting to off (preventing high/flight idle). This was true for P3D, but since the setting is also in the MSFS version I'd assume the same limitation exists.

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Don't have any of the issues you refer to. Not sure how you so quickly decided that "I assume that these are universal problems that affect all users of the -600 (and maybe also the other versions)".   What I read are hardware controller issues; which are probably the most individualized issues that users experience.

The delay in the reversers coming is, can seem frustrating.  But as Bob said above, they are far from instantaneous in becoming available on real world aircraft.  There are some pretty heavy mechanicals that need to move into place before the FADEC will permit the N1 to raise again.


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1 hour ago, JYW said:

The delay in the reversers coming is, can seem frustrating.  But as Bob said above, they are far from instantaneous in becoming available on real world aircraft.  There are some pretty heavy mechanicals that need to move into place before the FADEC will permit the N1 to raise again.

What he said though is that it's taking long for the REV indication to appear, not that reverse thrust isn't immediately available. The amber REV indication should be displayed as soon as the reverser mechanism is being actuated. For some reason the whole process is delayed.


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3 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

Why does it take ages for the REV light to appear (and therefore delays activation of the thrust reversers)?

See this short-ish thread to see if it's relevant you you:

PMDG 737-800 Reverser Delay - Is it me? - Page 2 - Microsoft Flight Simulator (2020) - The AVSIM Community


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I also have the 600 and do not have any issues with keeping her centered on take off or landing. I would definitely look at the sensitivity graphs and move the stick slightly left and right and see if there's any spiking as others have mentioned. I have Virpil pedals and just changed my Honeycomb yoke for the Thrustmaster Boeing yoke for reference

Hope you get this sorted 


 

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6 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

I have adjusted the "trim wheel" (for want of a better term) at the rear of the CH Flightstick Pro, and this has alleviated quite a lot of the left hand drift. The problem is that this wheel is very stiff, so I need to be careful! I have also switched the controls to Tiller + Rudder (from Rudder Only) in the PMDG Setup options, so I will see if this helps with the ground handling immediately after touchdown.

The delay in the amber REV light appearing seems to be related to the throttle wheel. It is quite erratic at times in MSFS, and I noticed that it was not reducing to idle thrust properly after landing at KGYY Chicago Gary Regional airport a few minutes ago. I am not sure what I can do about this.....

EDIT: I am using Build 3.00.087. I will check the Assistance Options.

That trim wheel you are talking about sounds like a real trouble spot for erratic controls of aileron and elevator. I would invest in a decent up to date controller, with hall ICs. 

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I too have none of these issues with the 600. I enjoy the 600 very much.


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Some of you guys seem to be forgetting that I have flown the PMDG 737-600 in P3D for years with the CH Flightstick Pro joystick without experiencing any controller issues whatsoever. Now, maybe MSFS is much more sensitive to control input than P3D. I do not know. I am just trying to understand how to compensate for this, and find the correct setup that works for my controller.


Christopher Low

UK2000 Beta Tester

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12 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

Some of you guys seem to be forgetting that I have flown the PMDG 737-600 in P3D for years with the CH Flightstick Pro joystick without experiencing any controller issues whatsoever. Now, maybe MSFS is much more sensitive to control input than P3D. I do not know. I am just trying to understand how to compensate for this, and find the correct setup that works for my controller.

ever  thought  that  it  could  be  your  controller  giving  up  depending  on  how  long  you had  it  for

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9 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

Some of you guys seem to be forgetting that I have flown the PMDG 737-600 in P3D for years with the CH Flightstick Pro joystick without experiencing any controller issues whatsoever. Now, maybe MSFS is much more sensitive to control input than P3D. I do not know. I am just trying to understand how to compensate for this, and find the correct setup that works for my controller.

Yeah, well maybe your controller is dying of old age. It came out in 1987..

 

You know what the farmer said when his horse dropped dead, "  That's the first time he has done that". 😉

Edited by Bobsk8
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