We need a Better Business Bureau for our FSX purchases ...

[Icon 22 11]

At this point I agree with you. That is by far the best quality control around. In the future I will be buying from companies that offer this advantage.It's too easy to hide poor quality in screen shots. I questioned a retractable gear airplane WITHOUT 3 green lights but thought it was a bad screen shot. I was wrong.Live and learn.

[Icon 22 11]

This is the first I have heard of this forum. I have lurked around these halls for years under different names but have never noticed this forum. I did notice that there were only seven reviews for 2007. I think I'll be waiting a long time for a review on this baby!I really think this is a move by the company to pick up some extra Christmas money, which is fine, as long as it isn't mine!! NOT!

[Icon 22 11]

I can see a review by numbers, say 1 thru 5 with 5 being excellent. I would first state a disclaimer saying blah, blah. blah...Customer Service: 1-5Outside model: 1-5Virtual Cockpit: 1-5 or not includedInstrument Panel 2D: 1-5Would you buy from this company again: 1-5Would you buy this airplane AGAIN: 1-5ETC, ETCDifferent specific questions for scenery, utilities, etc. How can you get sued over numbers?

[doc1956 0]

Gary,I hate using this comparison, but eBay has a similar rating system, 1-5 for rating sellers for different parameters and all opinions would clearly be user's personal opinions. Again, as long as outrageous comments are removed, as per the current forum situation, it would be a fantastic aid to all FS folk.Paul

[Guest DreamFleet]

I just wish we had this in real aviation. Well we do, if you have money to spend on an attorney.If you ever want an education as to that, subscribe to "Aviation Consumer", and have your "bubble" burst about the real thing rather quickly. Read as you learn that your "favorite" plane is described as the maintenance "dog" that it is (example, Beech Duke, Piper Malibu, the list goes on).It often makes FS look great in comparison.Otherwise, it is known as "Caveat Emptor", and despite the real meaning of that, just do your homework first and look for 30-day money back guarantees and such. We don't need a BBB, just educated consumers who buy from trusted developers who provide money-back returns. :)There's enough information out there, and it does not take long to find it either.Otherwise, opinions are like noses; everyone has one, just like me! ;) Regards,http://www.dreamfleet2000.com/gfx/images/F...R_FORUM_LOU.jpg

[scott967 62]

>Geof,>>The reader product review forum doesn't live up to its>billing. There's one review - of a joystick.>That is not true. I did a review of ImagineSim KMSY for FS9. I put quite a lot of time into it too. For me, the only thing I feel competent to review is scenery, and the truth is I don't buy that much payware scenery -- I really like to support the freeware authors and I love their stuff! I could review UT USA or UTX or GEX, or FSG mesh, but I think every one understands what these do and I couldn't add much to the common knowledge.I did add a post to the AVSIM review of Hawaii Dillingham X which I spent some time on a particular aspect (soaring) of that scenery.The problem with the user reviews is you have to host your own screenshots or other graphics and I don't have a good way to do that. without graphics it is hard to do a good review.scott s..

[Guest Toni Rauch]

Although the idea of a 'one-stop review' forum area is excellent, there is one problem that no-one has spotted yet, which may be very difficult to handle.....On this forum I believe that there have been numerous threads started by developers using phoney usernames to try and attract interest in their products anonimously (or their 'plants'). Things like " Has anyone tried the XXXX yet? - It looks really good....." followed by a few suspiciously deleriously happy customers comments, and then dissatisfied user comments etc. These often evolve into flame wars and are eventually locked by the moderators.Although genuine comments/reviews are always helpful to potential buyers, how can you reasonably rely on the integrity of the poster as being truly impartial in all cases?Toni.

[Guest jshyluk]

That's a really good point, I think. It's a lot of work to write a cohesive review, not the least of it is getting permissions to say things on-line as well as doing background research and following the rules of publication, which are there to ensure fairness, both to the reader, but also for the developers and the reviewers. The rules for the main forum threads are more relaxed than some other parts of the forum. While Avsim encourages healthy debate, the speech isn't free. People like Tom have to work hard to make sure that as many people follow the main current of Avsim as possible. Still, I am a little surprised that people will write "mini reviews" in the main FSX forum, but won't add onto the Readers' Reviews forum as much, or that threads based on these "mini reviews" don't go there. Or rather, I was mildly surprised, but reading this thread clarifies things, especially what Tom was saying, and just now what Toni wrote. Jeff ShylukAssistant Managing EditorSenior Staff ReviewerAVSIM

[jmig 100]

I just read the rules for posting to the Review forum and can see why there aren

[Guest fsxmissionguy]

Scott,You are (of course) correct. Sorry for the misinformation. My profile settings at AVSIM were only showing me posts for the last 30 days.Cheers,Kevin

[Guest fsxmissionguy]

"On this forum I believe that there have been numerous threads started by developers using phoney usernames to try and attract interest in their products anonimously (or their 'plants'). Things like " Has anyone tried the XXXX yet? - It looks really good....." followed by a few suspiciously deleriously happy customers comments"This happens very often ... and I believe (my own view) recently with a fairly well-known developer.

[McCrash 3]

'Better Business Bureau' can be extremely helpful.There is a place to most likely do this, it's here http://www.resellerratings.com/If this place is used we can all go there to get scoop.

[byork 2,258]

As a developer, I'm in favor of the idea of an independent Better Business Bureau, but the the practical reality of funding and managing it, etc., makes it totally unrealistic.You can just imagine the poor soul trying to run a Flightsim BBB, and the emails he'd be getting daily:Joe Consumer: "Yeah, I want to file a complaint against XYZ Sim. My uncle is a airline pilot and he told that the VNAV modeling is all wrong, but XYZ Sim said their autopilot was tested by real pilots. This is false advertising, man!..."How would you handle a complaint like that?Frankly, the Flightsim BBB would probably last about day before who ever was running it pulled the plug out of frustration.My opinion: There is just so much info available on the internet for all the various FS Addon products, that consumer research is the only real practical answer.As an example, I just Googled my own product, FS2Crew, and I came up with 32 pages worth of info. So it's not like the info is not out there.Cheers,-Bryan

[Icon 22 11]

As promised I want to let you know that I have received a refund from the company. No harsh language back & forth. I will buy from them again if the opportunity arises and the product has been thoroughly reviewed.Now I need to keep my side of the deal and delete this a/c from my HD. I have received an interesting reply by private email concerning my BBB for FSX addons. I hope we can keep this thought rolling behind the scenes.See ya,

[flyking 0]

I think what we really need is less commercialism and more freeware. The relentless drive for the next buck has taken allot of the fun out of this wonderful hobby.Please don't flame me. I've heard it all before and I really don't care if anyone else agrees with me or not.I do know one thing for sure--I enjoyed this hobby more back in the days when the prevailing motto was "Lets Keep It Free"flykingVirtual AviatorSystem Specs:Used to be Vista (XP Now)AMD Athlon 64 2413MHzNVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT, 256MBMemory: 3071MBSB X-FI Xtreme Gamer