Have been waiting to purchase as I was hoping they'd keep the pricing near to PMDGs $75, or even their own existing pricing in the same $70-ish bracket.

I'd really like to support them (and have with the 757 all-options version, as well as their A320 from back in the day).

But at this point I have trouble understanding why it's 20% better than PMDG's offering.

Anyone...?

1 hour ago, UrgentSiesta said:

why it's 20% better than PMDG's offering.

FF might believe the XPlane platform is superior ..... to PMDG's MSFS.

some users are more discerning you might "guess"

Edited September 2, 20241 yr by vadriver

Forget the nonsense with one platform/product better than the other... I would say simple maths... less copies sold in contrast meaning a higher price needed. We are talking about a business here with actual life and families behind.

Cheers T.

6 hours ago, vadriver said:

FF might believe the XPlane platform is superior ..... to PMDG's MSFS.

some users are more discerning you might "guess"

I have several Flight Factor products, several PMDG, spread across three simulators.

They're all great, but there's nothing in them that makes me value any of them over their competition. In fact the only reason I bought any of them was that, at the time of purchase, there wasn't any competition to each respective addon.

Nowadays it seems like there's nothing BUT competition.

Please do explain to me what "discerning" users see as differentiating features of FF's vs PMDG's 777s?

6 hours ago, Torsen said:

Forget the nonsense with one platform/product better than the other... I would say simple maths... less copies sold in contrast meaning a higher price needed. We are talking about a business here with actual life and families behind.

Cheers T.

Did you sleep through Econ 101?

You don't get to charge what you think your work is worth, you only get to charge what people are willing to pay you for your work.

7 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

Tengo varios productos Flight Factor, varios PMDG, distribuidos en tres simuladores.

Son todos geniales, pero no hay nada en ellos que me haga valorarlos por encima de la competencia. De hecho, la única razón por la que los compré fue que, en el momento de la compra, no había competencia para cada complemento respectivo.

Hoy en día parece que no hay nada más que competencia.

¿Podría explicarme qué ven los usuarios "expertos" como características diferenciadoras de los FF frente a los 777 de PMDG?

¿Dormiste durante la clase de Economía 101?

No puedes cobrar lo que crees que vale tu trabajo, sólo puedes cobrar lo que la gente está dispuesta a pagarte por tu trabajo.

FF is not finished so there is still a long way to go to see where it will be, but in principle if we look at the supposed final characteristics that one and the other FF will have  it is much more complex than PMDG.

Edited September 3, 20241 yr by Aglos77

I would love to support x-plane too but its just to much for me they really need to fix these prices if they want to win over people it looks great and Im happy people on x-plane can enjoy the 777 but for me I just cant now I do like to have both sims around since they offer different things. I can only imagine how many sales they and other developer's lost to the price.

2 hours ago, Aglos77 said:

FF is not finished so there is still a long way to go to see where it will be, but in principle if we look at the supposed final characteristics that one and the other FF will have  it is much more complex than PMDG.

I am genuinely interested to see how differentiated the two add-ons are, and in what ways.

PMDGs add-ons have a very good reputation built over decades of work. And I've never heard anyone say there's a better Boeing addon available.

This is part of the reason I decided to wait until FF released before making a decision.

But with the rather steep price difference, there would have to be notable improvements across the board for me to spend with FF.

Do you happen to have any info other than what's published in the features list that I could check out?

4 hours ago, Silverbird said:

would love to support x-plane too but its just to much for me they really need to fix these prices

That would only work if people would demand less, but people want more, more cost time and money by professionals, the more accurate you want it the more pretty you want it, your going to pay, and the cost of living has gone up everywhere for every one, So unless you want little blocks buzzing around your screen with a blocky landscape and runways, than you must pay. If you want all the fancy stuff, new tech, you will have to pay, and when you stop supporting them and they all pull out due to lack of customers, than you will be happy as you will have no products to spend your money on.

I will add that XPlane is more a niche than MSFS which has far more younger people on it and a lot more money behind it.

Edited September 3, 20241 yr by mjrhealth

4 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

I am genuinely interested to see how differentiated the two add-ons are, and in what ways.

PMDGs add-ons have a very good reputation built over decades of work. And I've never heard anyone say there's a better Boeing addon available.

This is part of the reason I decided to wait until FF released before making a decision.

But with the rather steep price difference, there would have to be notable improvements across the board for me to spend with FF.

Do you happen to have any info other than what's published in the features list that I could check out?

That's the big problem with PMDG, they've been going for years without competition and living off their reputation, and I've already left MSFS's DC6 quite chastened.

I am no expert but in principle I insist on going with caution because FF, they also have their black legend but with what is already in beta maintenance, the barbarity of simulated failures that has, textures, immersion with the interaction of crew and ground personnel already point to something very big.

PMDG's 777 the biggest news is the solution of the LNAV problems that have been reported for years without being solved and a fairly limited EFB so while the product will be good it is pretty much the same as what they have offered in other simulators.

To those who complain about the price is understandable in many countries is a powerful investment but I do not see much difference between PMDG and FF and it is clear that sales of one and the other will not be comparable.

From Reddit post:

• Full maintenance including consumables like engine oil
• Training scenarios
• Walkaround inspection with openable hatches
• Circuit breakers (cockpit with possible, not guaranteed, avionics bay in the future)
• entire ground crew ops are fully simulated
• cabin crew ops, a CDU for interacting with crew
• CPDLC - allows both pilots and ATC to send a pre-determined set of messages to one another, similar to text messaging.
• a pushback truck that you can control, drive and push back your own plane
• voice controlled FO

On 9/2/2024 at 7:44 AM, Torsen said:

Forget the nonsense with one platform/product better than the other... I would say simple maths... less copies sold in contrast meaning a higher price needed. We are talking about a business here with actual life and families behind.

Cheers T.

Yeah, this is the most likely explanation. Yes, there are some differences in features, but generally MSFS has a larger audience and thus a larger pool of likely buyers. That's why devs like Fenix and PMDG can drop prices and still be profitable and hit whatever internal targets they have. 

1 hour ago, VeryBumpy said:

From Reddit post:

• Full maintenance including consumables like engine oil
• Training scenarios
• Walkaround inspection with openable hatches
• Circuit breakers (cockpit with possible, not guaranteed, avionics bay in the future)
• entire ground crew ops are fully simulated
• cabin crew ops, a CDU for interacting with crew
• CPDLC - allows both pilots and ATC to send a pre-determined set of messages to one another, similar to text messaging.
• a pushback truck that you can control, drive and push back your own plane
• voice controlled FO

Also a fully interactive checklist that is integrated with the system where during emergent condition like engine out or fire, it will walk you through entire steps the getting aircraft under control. 

Considering the work that went into this aircraft, it's worth it to me.

Edited September 3, 20241 yr by BobFS88

FF had premium prices before. But I don't regret the B767 ($120 for the Global Package) because I enjoy it a lot and it has a unique function (execute checklists).

It sounds they integrated something like that now again with their Co-pilot functions. (I really don't care for their extensive crew and ground functions but that seems to be a trend among aircraft developers and the buyership seems to like it?)

$75 for a buggy X-Crafts E-Jet is hefty, but $90 for a FlightFactor widebody seems reasonable to me.

Personally I don't know yet if I will get it.

11 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

That would only work if people would demand less, but people want more, more cost time and money by professionals, the more accurate you want it the more pretty you want it, your going to pay, and the cost of living has gone up everywhere for every one, So unless you want little blocks buzzing around your screen with a blocky landscape and runways, than you must pay. If you want all the fancy stuff, new tech, you will have to pay, and when you stop supporting them and they all pull out due to lack of customers, than you will be happy as you will have no products to spend your money on.

I will add that XPlane is more a niche than MSFS which has far more younger people on it and a lot more money behind it.

I'm sorry, this just isn't true.

Imagine how much an iPhone would cost if it were actually as you imagine...

2 hours ago, JonathanC said:

Yeah, this is the most likely explanation. Yes, there are some differences in features, but generally MSFS has a larger audience and thus a larger pool of likely buyers. That's why devs like Fenix and PMDG can drop prices and still be profitable and hit whatever internal targets they have. 

Then how can you explain the pricing that existed for such a long time in FSX/Prepar3D...?

You see, the thing here is that the devs are selling an intangible that has extremely low COGS. Better to capture additional market share than try to squeeze more out of a vastly smaller pool of customers.