36 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

One aspect of this update interests me. This is the first change of a streaming sim to a new version. There will be many 2020 users who are happy with that version where everything works for them and they have no desire to go through the update path.

Have Microsoft / Asobo indicated how long the 2020 streaming service will run for? Will that version be available to buy after November?

The base scenery between the two versions is presumably different given the new features.

Perhaps those in the know could confirm what the situation is regarding 2020 and its lifespan.

MSFS will be supported until 2028, including new Simupdates, World Updates etc. They didn't specifically talked about its availability to be purchased, but even FSX is still being sold on Steam, so I have no reason to think they will be removing MSFS 2020.

Beyond 2028, we don't know. I believe by then that everyone will already be using the new sim.

Edited October 23, 20241 yr by ca_metal

1 hour ago, ca_metal said:

by then that everyone will already be using the new sim

 😄 by that you meant MSFS 2028? 🤣

Edited October 23, 20241 yr by turbomax

17 minutes ago, turbomax said:

by that you meant MSFS 2028?

No, MSFS 2024. I think by the time we get to the date they are planning to stop supporting 2020, everyone will be using 2024 already. 

MSFS 2028, is another beast we will need to wait and see. 😁

Edited October 23, 20241 yr by ca_metal

49 minutes ago, ca_metal said:

Beyond 2028, we don't know. I believe by then that everyone will already be using the new sim.

Well given there are people still using FS9, FSX and multiple versions of P3D there will always be those who prefer to stick with what they’re familiar with and works.

But the big difference of course is with those sims they don’t rely on a remote server to provide scenery.

10 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Well given there are people still using FS9, FSX and multiple versions of P3D there will always be those who prefer to stick with what they’re familiar with and works.

But the big difference of course is with those sims they don’t rely on a remote server to provide scenery.

MSFS 2020 doesn't rely on a remote server to provide scenery. That's a misconception. You can install airports like in any other simulator. You can install any kind of scenery, like any other simulator. You can even store locally the bing imagery (auto and manual caches). 

BUT if you want the super high resolution DEMs, Photogrammetry, Sat imagery for the whole World etc. Sure, it's (almost) impossible to have those without connecting to a server, because not everyone would spend thousands of dollars to have petabytes of storage locally.

That said, anyone will be able to keep using it, with locally stored sceneries, without any issues.

Edited October 23, 20241 yr by ca_metal

24 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Well given there are people still using FS9, FSX and multiple versions of P3D there will always be those who prefer to stick with what they’re familiar with and works.

But the big difference of course is with those sims they don’t rely on a remote server to provide scenery.

Sure,  but if in 2028 or 2030 you’re still using a sim from 2006-2015, you’re not exactly a market that a big company will care much about.

And the stuff that the “cloud” makes possible is simply impossible to do locally - you cannot store hundreds of terabytes or a couple of petabytes locally. 

I’m sure there will still be offline sims like Xplane in active development, or maybe someone new will come around to cater to the small market of customers that want old-school software. 

I love me my Windows 3, doesn't rely on server, streaming, online and all that thingamajig.

@ca_metal, 

I can’t imagine many wanting to fly without the full ground scenery being enabled. So it does mean that when that server is turned off that version effectively becomes useless.

28 minutes ago, JonathanC said:

Sure,  but if in 2028 or 2030 you’re still using a sim from 2006-2015, you’re not exactly a market that a big company will care much about.

There will come a point in people’s lives when they’re happy with what they have and don’t want to jump on the bandwagon of ever improving scenery. That point could have said to have been reached with 20. Yes, they’re a minority of course.

Just now, Ray Proudfoot said:

There will come a point in people’s lives when they’re happy with what they have and don’t want to jump on the bandwagon of ever improving scenery.

Sure, but new users won't be like that.

You're talking about something similar to the adoption curve for tech (or anything). You are likely in the laggards/skeptics group, or perhaps late majority, but most people are on the other side and actually want improvements. Anyway, this is going offtopic. I get your point, and one hopes that there's always good options for all segments of the market. 

1 minute ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

@ca_metal, 

I can’t imagine many wanting to fly without the full ground scenery being enabled. So it does mean that when that server is turned off that version effectively becomes useless.

There will come a point in people’s lives when they’re happy with what they have and don’t want to jump on the bandwagon of ever improving scenery. That point could have said to have been reached with 20. Yes, they’re a minority of course.

Well, like I said, you can have the full ground scenery being anabled offline. You will just need a lot of storage space. 

I don't see the difference between MSFS 2020 default offline scenery vs any other sim's default scenery. And like any other sim, you can install any scenery add-ons you want and use it offline. That said, I don't see why you are concerned on what will happen beyond 2028. 

Most people will move, and the others will have the possibility to use it like any other sim. 

5 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

@ca_metal, 

 

There will come a point in people’s lives when they’re happy with what they have and don’t want to jump on the bandwagon of ever improving scenery.

Yes, but also no. I was perfectly happy with FS4, until FS5 came out and showed how nice good graphics can be. Same story for every other version, to the point that FS5, which was so beautiful when it came out, now looks terrible. 

If PC graphics had never improved beyond FS4-level, we'd all be happy using that. It's only when you see the improved graphics that you say, "yeah, I want that."

No one in 1875 wanted any personal transportation better than a good horse. Now, almost no one wants a horse even for fun because they've seen the improvements brought by the car.

 

I'm very happy with 2020's look, but from the previews, 2024 will look much better and so naturally I'd like to experience it. The other improvements are really just a bonus for me, personally.

7 minutes ago, JonathanC said:

Sure, but new users won't be like that.

Of course. New and enthusiastic users are always keen for new and improved features. I was like that until around 5 years ago at which point I became happy with what I had.

6 minutes ago, ca_metal said:

Well, like I said, you can have the full ground scenery being anabled offline. You will just need a lot of storage space. 

I don't see the difference between MSFS 2020 default offline scenery vs any other sim's default scenery. And like any other sim, you can install any scenery add-ons you want and use it offline. That said, I don't see why you are concerned on what will happen beyond 2028. 

Most people will move, and the others will have the possibility to use it like any other sim. 

I’m not concerned in the slightest. I was just curious about how long the 2020 server would remain available. There will be limits as to how much scenery users can store locally. 3.2 Petabytes will be achievable one day but not just yet. 😉

10 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Of course. New and enthusiastic users are always keen for new and improved features. I was like that until around 5 years ago at which point I became happy with what I had.

I’m not concerned in the slightest. I was just curious about how long the 2020 server would remain available. There will be limits as to how much scenery users can store locally. 3.2 Petabytes will be achievable one day but not just yet. 😉

You don't need to store everything to have a functional sim. It's not different from any other simulator. If you are ok to use the other simulators the way they are today, you will be fine using 2020 beyond 2028. Just installing what you need.

And if you want a simulator using a cutting edge tech, you can move to 2024 or the newer version they will be releasing in the future.

34 minutes ago, eslader said:

Yes, but also no. I was perfectly happy with FS4, until FS5 came out and showed how nice good graphics can be. Same story for every other version, to the point that FS5, which was so beautiful when it came out, now looks terrible. 

If PC graphics had never improved beyond FS4-level, we'd all be happy using that. It's only when you see the improved graphics that you say, "yeah, I want that."

I have to comment here to say that I thought that the graphics in FS5 were awful. A shimmering mass of textured garbage is how I described it at the time. With hindsight, I should have kept FS4. In fact, I should have kept it until Flight Unlimited 2 appeared in 1997.

8 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

I have to comment here to say that I thought that the graphics in FS5 were awful. A shimmering mass of textured garbage is how I described it at the time. With hindsight, I should have kept FS4. In fact, I should have kept it until Flight Unlimited 2 appeared in 1997.

I mean, yes but compared to FS4, the cockpits were much improved over the white with pink and green pixels we had for gauges in 4. And FS5 was pushing the graphics capability of my 486, so had they been any better it would have been a slideshow.