I'm angry! I really am...and need to get it off my chest....

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

>If it hadn't been that slow (or ugly with sliders on low) I>would not have bothered to develop Tileproxy ;)>Well then, some 'good' might have come out of my not seeing FSX-Plus on rip-the-wrapper-and-install-day, lol :)Your contribution is a huge one. Thank you for it!Mitch

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Hi Graham!As you know, I was so disgusted with trying to get FSX-RTM to run truly smoothly (pre SP1 and SP2) and until I found GEXn and UTX, could not get past the desert scape and Cartoonville North America-wide.I sold it to a friend down the street. He used it for about six weeks, and then called me up to 'ask' if I would like to buy it back. He was going back to FS9. I certainly felt obligated to buy back FSX and did so. In hindsight, it was perhaps the best thing that has happened to me in a long while (that is how much fun and sheer sense of flight and exploring I am having with FSX-Plus) and gave me the chance to buy and then install GEXn. I did that (GEXn)...and was BLOWN AWAY! I then purchased UTX-USA and did not initially truly take the time to customize it to my liking..and of course I publicly ate crow willingly for that...lol. The FSX-Plus experience has been just simply stellar---AND the sweet part Graham, is that I am getting post Nick's Xpsp2 Tune-up, a most steady 18 LOCKED FPS out of FSX-Plus. At major airports like KMIA or KLAX, I do go down to the occasional 10 to 12, but...STILL MOST USABLE until I decide to upgrade.I'm glad you were inspired to take the plunge once more. BTW, I won't be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. FS9 is staying on my system, and I intend to use them both for different reasons. For now though---I simply can't wait to get home and fire up FSX for another exploration of areas I know in real life. I now see them, via accurate superstructures, and my memories of the locations becomes the greatest graphic generator that can be had.Enjoy...and I'll see you up there in my Volkswagen 172 or hand-glider! (Large SMILE :) )

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

>Actually, I liked it the first day I saw FSX on my newer>computer. The mountain textures/resolution were a lot more>photo like, and had a good sense of "depth", that I hadn't>seen before.>>I suppose this is a case, of where a first flight experience>in FSX takes place. If it's one of the vast desert regions,>then I wouldn't have been impressed. But for me, I took off>out of KSLC, headed up the mountain canyons, and was very>pleased to find a lake that's been missing for the last two>versions, as well as a new reservoir. These lakes, and the>much sharper and better looking textures, made it a hit on day>one.>>L.Adamson------------------------Good personal observations, Larry. Thanks for adding! :)Mitch

[tf51d 284]

One of the big problems with FSX then and now for new comers that turn them off right away is how the Jetways work. When they first load up FSX with full sliders right and 100% traffic at JFK and was/is immediately greeted with a single digit slide show. What they don't realize is the main cause of it is all the jetways are engaging on all the AI aircraft, for a radius of 120 miles. If they wait a few minutes, they would have seen a significant increase in performance. This is one of the main reasons FSX gave such a bad first impression, and you know what they say, first impressions are lasting impressions, and what counts most to alot of people. What made it worse was there really wasn't/isn't a user friendly way of disabling them, once they realized the issue, without taking away additional eye candy they may want, without editing config files, or replacing default AI aircraft, that wasn't setup to use the jetways. This isn't such a problem for us here in the forum, but for a new FSX gamer, they probably wouldn't know what the problem was, and the game would be returned, or go on the shelf. Aces really shot themselves in the foot with these jetways. Not that they had them, but they didn't explain there impact and provide an isolated way through the GUI to disable them.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

>I can certainly understand your frustration. My own personal>story is quite different. I was amazed at FSX right out of the>box. When you compare it to my fully tricked out FS9 with all>the main addons like all UTX, BEV textures (GEX now for FSX),>Active Sky, many airports, Fs Genesis Mesh, and countless>other enhancements, the RTM was better in some cases and worse>in others. If you compare the RTM of FS9 to FSX I believe>there is absolutely no comparison and FSX was an insane>improvement. Now that all these addons are out for FSX. I am>floored every-time I start up the sim. As far as performance>goes I think it is difficult for Microsoft to predict how a>piece of software is going to perform not on thousands of beta>machines but millions of users machines how can anyone expect>that how it going to perform on millions of computers with all>the hardware configurations that are possible. I respect your>opinion and emotion but my experience is different maybe you>should give your computer a shot. ;) Just in good fun,>interesting thread thanks for starting it and your>articulation. ------------------------------------Ahh...(smile :) ) but not to be a Nat on the neck, Mike---but SP1 made FSX (post SP1) MOST flyable on my Dell Pent4 3.4GHz. Most flyable. They COULD HAVE shipped the sim RTM that would carry 15-18 FPS on the high end Pent 4's of the day. They proved it, by writing SP1. It was obtainable, but not coded on the day of release.What I TRULY could not get past--post SP1 and then sold it for, was how the world was (again...my P.O.) so pastel and the land of Cartoonsville. No matter what I did to 'sell myself', it looked like a water-color painting I was flying over. That didn't change until I bought GEXn on another person's rave post, and when I saw what it did to transform FSX---I started raving out of my mind as well, lol! UTX-X (tuned for myself) put me over the edge in the raving department. The rest is history.... FSX-Plus STAYS! :)

[Guest]

>What I meant about 'right out of the box'...is that what the>developers of UTX and GEX added to the sim, in my opinion,>should have been (within the base code) already there in the>sim, and to that level of visual quality. That is what I>meant, and not that you would see addon software bundled. I>can't see that in creating the level of detail and immersion>that both GEXn and UTX brings to the sim, would have added a>few (meaning three hundred) bucks.I know what you meant (sorry if that wasn't clear ;) ) but that's exactly my point: you want FSX out of the box looking just as good and detailed as FSX plus UTX and GEX. That IS in fact as if FSX would come with addons bundled, only it wouldn't be called addons because they came right our of the box. ;) But in truth it WOULD be as if FSX was released inlcuding add-ons, because you can't expect FSX to come with this much detail for the same price as you can buy FSX now. UTX and GEX both cost about 30 bucks per region. First of all, that's not for nothing! Making these addons costs time and data has to be obtained and thus it costs money. Now why would you expect MS/Aces to do this for free...? If you want this detail to be in FSX right out of the box, MS/Aces would also have to spend extra time and money. You can't expect them to offer this all without asking more for the final product.Secondly, imagine that GEX and UTX will offer worldwide coverage in the future, I think that will be about 5 or 6 addons for each of them, totalling to some 12 addons * 30 dollars = 360 dollars for the better textures and roads/rivers alone. So you want MS to put 360 dollars worth of extra detail to be in the box right away for the same price as FSX costs now... Now THAT is not what you can expect from MS/Aces. Okay, you COULD expect an extra effort, like making the textures better right away, so the GEX people wouldn't have to do it all over again, but that still would cost something extra. But expecting UTX to be in the box is too much asked, I think.In short: the money you spend now to get what you want, would also have to be spend in order to get it all right out of the box.I FULLY agree we should have gotten FSX plus SP2 right out of the box, but the extra's are extra's and never ever will be part of the 'base pack': you can't expect that and therefore I don't share your anger. ;)BTW I do like your enthousiasm about FSX and I am glad you looked upon my post as indeed being just another opinion and nothing personal! ;) That's indeed the true forum-spirit: wished more people could debate like this without getting nasty! :(

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

>Hey Mitch,>>When your done having Nirvana in your flying volkswagon at>3500 feet AGL, and chugging along at a steady 180 knots, why>not jump in the default 737 and climb to 31,000 feet at 350>knots.>>You might rethink your post.>>Although I have to admit, your enthusiam is refreshing in>light of many negative posts centering around FSX - even>perhaps my own. :)------------------------------Actually, I do fly heavy iron as well as that German Fella you mention. ;)I took a flight from KDEN to KLAS just yesterday at FL260. I saw the GEXn textures at that elevation...and was wow'ed to death!I do fly both, and mostly heavy iron in FS9.Cheers!Mitch

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

>>What I meant about 'right out of the box'...is that what>the>>developers of UTX and GEX added to the sim, in my opinion,>>should have been (within the base code) already there in the>>sim, and to that level of visual quality. That is what I>>meant, and not that you would see addon software bundled. I>>can't see that in creating the level of detail and immersion>>that both GEXn and UTX brings to the sim, would have added a>>few (meaning three hundred) bucks.>>I know what you meant (sorry if that wasn't clear ;) ) but>that's exactly my point: you want FSX out of the box looking>just as good and detailed as FSX plus UTX and GEX. That IS in>fact as if FSX would come with addons bundled, only it>wouldn't be called addons because they came right our of the>box. ;) But in truth it WOULD be as if FSX was released>inlcuding add-ons, because you can't expect FSX to come with>this much detail for the same price as you can buy FSX now. >>UTX and GEX both cost about 30 bucks per region. First of all,>that's not for nothing! Making these addons costs time and>data has to be obtained and thus it costs money. Now why would>you expect MS/Aces to do this for free...? If you want this>detail to be in FSX right out of the box, MS/Aces would also>have to spend extra time and money. You can't expect them to>offer this all without asking more for the final product.>Secondly, imagine that GEX and UTX will offer worldwide>coverage in the future, I think that will be about 5 or 6>addons for each of them, totalling to some 12 addons * 30>dollars = 360 dollars for the better textures and roads/rivers>alone. So you want MS to put 360 dollars worth of extra detail>to be in the box right away for the same price as FSX costs>now... Now THAT is not what you can expect from MS/Aces. Okay,>you COULD expect an extra effort, like making the textures>better right away, so the GEX people wouldn't have to do it>all over again, but that still would cost something extra. But>expecting UTX to be in the box is too much asked, I think.>>In short: the money you spend now to get what you want, would>also have to be spend in order to get it all right out of the>box.>>I FULLY agree we should have gotten FSX plus SP2 right out of>the box, but the extra's are extra's and never ever will be>part of the 'base pack': you can't expect that and therefore I>don't share your anger. ;)>>BTW I do like your enthousiasm about FSX and I am glad you>looked upon my post as indeed being just another opinion and>nothing personal! ;) That's indeed the true forum-spirit:>wished more people could debate like this without getting>nasty! :(------------------Oh my gawd, who would want people to be merely yes-men/yes-women in forums? :) Not I!!!! I relish this repartee. In response to your points, I would say, that in a small/custom publishing house that has to earn its income from a few titles, your point on 'not to expect the level of detail that UTX and GEXn brought to FSX's plate' is solid and valid, End of statement! I openly suggest that with a financial compensation base that the likes of FSX's developers have ie: Microsoft---that it would have been financially a drip off of the hide of a horse---to have offered us that level of detail. Their sales (compensation) would be in the hundred-to-one of let's say the developers of GEXn or UTX in units sold. Based upon that, I absolutely feel that it should have been offered---beaches, interchanges, greater plotting of freeway traffic as UTX brings to FSX, etc. With the financial base of M.S., this would have been a drop-in-the-bucket for/to them. If my viewpoint on the financial aspect of my personal opinion is skewed, I honestly can't see where? Volume grants leeway to produce more, for less expense per unit sold. :) On that viewpoint, I feel we were cheated of features, for to get the product out on a time line, and RTM. I'm hoping that they have reviewed all the negative forum traffic and will bring out a BLOCKBUSTER in the form of FSXI---and most excitedly---out of the wrapper!!

[Chuck_Jodry-VJPL 663]

While the addition road traffic was fun i never found FSX immersive when looking around during a flight because of the similarity of the scene being rendered with the same set of textures for a given land class.Then came the latest V7 beta of tile proxy and at last i have a photoreal representation of the world that actually allows sight seeingto become an activity , the load times and the frame rates both improved as did my willingness to just buzz around knowing what i see is what i would if i were actually there .. Tile Proxy saved FSX for me , i spend the day designing Aircraftfor FSX and for the longest time would only look over the productionin FSX like a display window with an occasional "flight" for systemschecks ( bug hunting ), now i enjoy a tour of some new spot, last timeit was above the hills surrounding LA, in study of the architecture of the mansions , the other thing is the now complete road networkdown to the smallest trail is in place , i love using the sim again.thanks Christian . CJ

[Geofa 108]

Well I'd do some compares but my setup is so good right now I don't want to do anything to screw it up.Again-the add ins do improve it-but a good deal was already there.http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/1b5baf...b9f427f694g.jpgMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

[Mace 1,902]

>Hi Rhett. >>The reason that I did not mention that, is because we (at date>of release) did not have those systems...and hence, NOBODY>could have a great or even 'usable' experience. Everybody was>telling of FPS in the toilet. Not flyable on any body's system>by the numbers. My angst was that it was ON THE DAY OF ITS>RELEASE, a crude piece of software--that could not deliver>what people paid 70-100 dollars for. We certainly, as the>simulation community, deserved better from Microsoft right>from the get-go!>>Cheers!>>MitchWell yes, but in your original post, your overall emphasis was toward things that have happened *since* release. Not at the time of release.Or maybe I missed the emphasis of your post...??RhettAMD 3700+ (@2585 mhz), eVGA 7800GT 256 (Guru3D 93.71), ASUS A8N-E, PC Power 510 SLI, 2gb Corsair XMS 3-3-3-8 (1T), WD 150 gig 10000rpm Raptor, WD 250gig 7200rpm SATA2, Seagate 120gb 5400 rpm external HD, CoolerMaster Praetorian