Phil Taylor has had enough! No Blogging or Posting

[N400QW 205]

Historically we've been in a period of "transition" from one sim to another for as long as most of us were first introduced to FS.This should not be a surprise to those who've been simming since the early days.The transition to FS2000 required a complete hardware upgrade for me personally while my simming buddy was just fine with the exception of a changed video card/driver set.:-)We began developing toward the end of the FS2000 cycle and promptly rebuilt for FS2004 ACOF compat. as it was rolled out. FS9 was considered "best version" after 9.1 Patch while the moaners and groaners called on MS to build a better mousetrap. Well MS heard and did their best to accomodate users requests given the "limitations" of the bean counters. We now have SP2/DX10 Preview and a path for VNext and still the few outmoan the majority even to the point of cutting off dialogue with Aces reps in public settings.Does anyone here actually believe that ranting, moaning, and groaning over their personal situation will change their own personal situation? Give it up guys, the die is really cast and it's your responsibility to make it work to the standard that the majority of users are enjoying.:-)

[boshar 6]

I think that the MS flightsim fans that now use FS-9 are firstmost fans of the brand. Most of those guys posting their miscontent here believe that the series did something wrong. They came to that believe after paying their money trying the new version and somehow they don't feel its an improvement.Where would you post your FS-X misgivings if you had them. They certainly don't belong in the FS-9 forum. Its after all their experience with FS-X they want to talk about. And up till SP2 there was a point in posting problems with FS-X. I happen to believe that some of the response in this forum has been used as input to improve FS-X.Like ot or not FS-X is the forum where we will most likely come to post whats wrong with the series (that includes FS9 obviously) uptil now and what we'd like in the future. Maybe a rethink and stringent moderating coupled with a new structure (only)FS-9 forum, (only)FS-X forum, (free for all)FS caf

[boshar 6]

>Give it up guys, the die is really cast and it's your>responsibility to make it work to the standard that the>majority of users are enjoying.:-)You keep on claiming that majority. Any data to support that majority claim?I do think it would be better for ACES to not listen to much to the FS community for the next version. With all that input we are likely to get a Franken sim with lots of parts to please everybody. Lets face it even this large vocal community is a just fringe group compared to the total sales of the product.

[DadJokeCinema 145]

>I think that the MS flightsim fans that now use FS-9 are>firstmost fans of the brand. Most of those guys posting their>miscontent here believe that the series did something wrong.>They came to that believe after paying their money trying the>new version and somehow they don't feel its an improvement.>>Where would you post your FS-X misgivings if you had them.>They certainly don't belong in the FS-9 forum. Its after all>their experience with FS-X they want to talk about. And up>till SP2 there was a point in posting problems with FS-X. I>happen to believe that some of the response in this forum has>been used as input to improve FS-X.>>Like ot or not FS-X is the forum where we will most likely>come to post whats wrong with the series (that includes FS9>obviously) uptil now and what we'd like in the future. Maybe >a rethink and stringent moderating coupled with a new>structure (only)FS-9 forum, (only)FS-X forum, (free for all)FS>caf

[Mace 1,902]

>>Give it up guys, the die is really cast and it's your>>responsibility to make it work to the standard that the>>majority of users are enjoying.:-)>>You keep on claiming that majority. Any data to support that>majority claim?>They're right here, being silent. You don't think the fella you are talking to *knows*? He's got sales figures at his beck and call every day to look at. That tells all.RhettFS box: E8500 (@ 3.16 ghz), AC Freezer 7 Pro, ASUS P5E3 Premium, BFG 8800GTX 756 (nVidia 169 WHQL), 4gb DDR3 1600 Patriot Cas7 7-7-7-20 (2T), PC Power 750, WD 150gb 10000rpm Raptor, Seagate 500gb, Silverstone TJ09 case, Vista Ultimate 64ASX Client: AMD 3700+ (@ 2.6 ghz), 7800GT

[Guest UlfB]

>>You keep on claiming that majority. Any data to support that>majority claim?>boshar,Please consider the statement:>Give it up guys, the die is really cast and it's your>responsibility to make it work to the standard that the>majority of users are enjoying.:-)This is a wish from Ron that a future release of FS will be enjoyed by a majority. In what sense does Ron need to provide data to support his wish? Who could present evidence that Ron doesn't wish that a majority will enjoy a future FS release? Or do you think that Ron wishes that only a minority will enjoy FS?boshar, It's time to show your cards. What proof do you have that Ron doesn't doesn't want a majority to enjoy FS?Edited: I might be wrong about Rons intention, but any way. Regarding the present FSX release, I agree that the majority enjoys FSX, maybe not the majority of avsim members, but the majority of world wide simmers. What supports this? Well, has FSX sold more copies than FS2004?Ulf B

[boshar 6]

Statements like in his previous message:"In short, the majority of users have completed their OS and Hardware Upgrades and have been enjoying FSX/SP2/DX10 for quite a good while now"Give me the idea that Ron is telling us that the majority has switched to FS-X. But those statements mean nothing without the data that supports them. That data is hard to come by and costs real money to get. (if we are talking MS FS-X sales figures)Of course Rons statement can also mean that the sale of his add-ons is picking up and maybe he is selling more FS-X then FS-9 add-ons.The only data I can easly look at is the download data library from the AVSIM library which is very inconclusieve because a FS2004 download can also be used in FS-X. (never knew that AI packages where that popular though) link gives downloads over the last year -> http://library.avsim.net/hotlist.php?Period=365&Cookie=1

[Guest n99wb]

"But those statements mean nothing without the data that supports them."The number of posters who were negative, in this thread, equals 10.And it's a stretch to call a couple of them negative.However, 5 are confirmed by their multiple posts.Those 5, including yourself, made 26 posts.Do you think you 5 represent the majority?

[N400QW 205]

>>>Give it up guys, the die is really cast and it's your>>>responsibility to make it work to the standard that the>>>majority of users are enjoying.:-)>>>>You keep on claiming that majority. Any data to support that>>majority claim?>>>They're right here, being silent. >>You don't think the fella you are talking to *knows*? He's>got sales figures at his beck and call every day to look at. >That tells all.>>RhettCorrect Rhett, we do know a few things about this industry and we do have our own private data to support our view.We are not interested in arguing the correctness of our view or in releasing private data to support our view.Our statements go to the fact that compat. for FSX/SP2 and even DX10 Preview is here now and is the set path toward VNext as Phil has stated in his Taxonomy.FSX/SP2 represents current best use in preparation for VNext and a minority of users still have problems. It remains to be seen whether that minority will make the changes required to run both current and future paths now or later:-)Prior to FSX RTM we dropped support for FS2000/FS2002 and you should have heard the screams and moans. Why did we drop it? Because the simulator changed and we can offer so much more now than before.Like it or not, this community will continue to adjust just as it has in the past and MS and 3PDs will continue on the path to progress.We suspect that FS9 will fade in the same manner over time as more folks with issues find and apply solutions to their own personal situations.:-)

[kdfw__ 539]

Without proof, I'm not willing to accept the conclusion that a "majority" of users are now happily using FS10. I suspect a plurality of "GA country aifstrip slow and low" users are happy (if I was one, I would be), but maybe not all market segments are satisfied. "Private data?" Oooh, super secret. Well, some of the more vocal developer's livelyhood depends on promoting FS10. No problem there. Hope it all works out so they can better prepare for FS11.Moans and screams aside, this FS release was a huge bust in my opinion, and I've been doing this stuff since the subLogic days. Good luck,PatAMD Opteron DC 185 @ 3GHz, Zalman7700Cu cooler, Corsair XMS 2GB DDR, 7800GS-OC, Asus A8V MoBo, RaptorHDD, TrackIR4, CH FSYoke+TQ+peds, Eclipse RED KB, WinXP-sp2

[N400QW 205]

If you expect us to "prove the case" to your satisfaction then you'll be disapointed because we ain't goin' there:-)We will continue developing for both sim versions for as long as is practical then drop the older one. There are already quite a few 3PD products built or being built for "FSX only"The handwriting is on the wall folks...in our opinion it won't be very long before 3PDs begin to phase out production/support for FS9 because FSNext will only be back compat. to FSX/SP2.>"this FS release was a huge bust in my opinion, and I've been doing this stuff since the subLogic days." Sorry but how long you've done this has no bearing on where the hobby, and therefore the market, is headed any more than does your personal opinion of it as a bust.What we've attempted to point out is that MS, 3PDs, and users ARE moving forward and enjoying the journey despite the moans and groans of those who are "behind the curve" so to speak.:-)

[kdfw__ 539]

LOL, thanks for being the sunshine-man on behalf of the hobby I'm starting to believe... PatAMD Opteron DC 185 @ 3GHz, Zalman7700Cu cooler, Corsair XMS 2GB DDR, 7800GS-OC, Asus A8V MoBo, RaptorHDD, TrackIR4, CH FSYoke+TQ+peds, Eclipse RED KB, WinXP-sp2

[N400QW 205]

Just keepin' it friendly but I'll be careful not to include a smiley in this response.If you think raining on everyone elses parade while the industry and users move forward then you'll be disapointed in Vnext as well.Solutions ARE available but users must apply them instead of moaning in forums.

[boshar 6]

>We will continue developing for both sim versions for as long>as is practical then drop the older one. >There are already quite a few 3PD products built or being>built for "FSX only">>The handwriting is on the wall folks...in our opinion it won't>be very long before 3PDs begin to phase out production/support>for FS9 because FSNext will only be back compat. to FSX/SP2.But thats the 3PD's following the money. Of course a good FS-X add-on will get you more sales because at them moment there is little competition (per add-on type) there. Those that switched to FS-X generaly had the funds for an up to date computer system so they are bound to have some money to spend on add-ons. The FS9 market by comparisson has little unexplored territory left. Most popular aircraft types have 1, 2 sometimes even 3 add-ons competing for buyers. So yes its commercialy sound to switch to FS-X only add-ons.>Sorry but how long you've done this has no bearing on where>the hobby, and therefore the market, is headed any more than>does your personal opinion of it as a bust.Thats a bit harsh. To me your view of FS-X is add-on market centric. You want (and deserve) income for your hard work so you have an intrest in the market moving forward. I agree with your view that the add-on buyers market is moving toward FS-X and that they wil overtake the FS9 add-on market in the future but that doesn't mean that the FS community at large wil have switched to FS-X. >What we've attempted to point out is that MS, 3PDs, and users>ARE moving forward and enjoying the journey despite the moans>and groans of those who are "behind the curve" so to>speak.:-)I think I'm ahead of the curve. See you at the end of the FS-X journey. I'll be waiting in the FSNext forum.

[N400QW 205]

>"Thats a bit harsh. To me your view of FS-X is add-on market centric."Of course it is since that is the area we participate in.That said, it should be noted that we are users as well. It's doubtful that you even have FS2000/FS2002 on your machine. The reason is that you likely run FS20004 and/or FSX and enjoy both more that the older sim versions.Progress marches on and it's not too difficult to see that the "transition" to newer sim versions is marching on as well.This is not an insult to those who are "behind the curve" but rather a realistic view of where we are headed with Vnext. ESP, etc.On a positive note: We all have better hardware, drivers, simulators, and content, than we've ever had in the past so it's up to users to take advantage of current hardware offerings and educate themselves on best use for their personal situation. :-)