8 hours ago, kholt said:

Because they don’t care,  as it’s “just a game?”

Honestly, you just answered your own question!

Contrary to the belief it is anything more it is marketed to the masses on a gaming platform.

If some think it's some high level simulator so be it!

This thread now has become a raging XP12 vs MSFS thread.

They both offer different flavors of flight simulation!

Edited September 5, 2025Sep 5 by tpete61

4 minutes ago, tpete61 said:

They both offer different flavors of flight simulation!

Yes, they do, but again, regardless of what the competition is doing, we’ve had one significant change since MSFS2020 was launched, in SU5, and that was NOT a change for the better. Since then, nothing.

31 minutes ago, scotchegg said:

Sure, crosswind effects on takeoff / landing might have improved, but I can still slam any plane into massive dense storm clouds (well, massive collections of puffballs, I guess they’re supposed to be storm clouds) in 2024 with absolutely no change to the still, calm air I flew miles through to get there. The weather might look imposing as you fly into it (as imposing as yet more puffballs can be), but once inside, it’s utterly inconsequential.

From what I read and also the streams/videos I have watched, crosswind, stalling, and spinning has improved in MSFS 2024.  There is also wake turbulence modeled now in MSFS 2024.  The lack of turbulence when flying through clouds has always been an issue, for both MSFS 2024 and MSFS 2020.  But I think the flight dynamics have made significant improvements.

MSFS cannot even depict a proper thunderstorm visually using Live WX (ie, CB clouds, anvil etc) so maybe that would be a good start?  Also, still zero turbulence in "storms" so it really doesn't matter anyway.  The last flight I did in MSFS 2024 had lightning coming out of fair-WX cumulus cloud on final to KMCO.....

Xplane 12 has now really good weather and atmosphere; the only downside is its default scenery. Gap is closing...

I love both sims. Each has their own strengths. We are lucky to have both, as we are the final beneficiaries of competition. 

I'm sure Asobo will eventually improve weather (and the wx radar) derived from community pressure... same as LR is doing with their scenery.

Great times ahead!

4 hours ago, Seth2021 said:

not to mention the ground scenery, which speaks for itself)

Yes, the default scenery is pretty bad, but I don't use it.  I prefer  satellite imagery using the Map Enhancement tool.

 

4 hours ago, Seth2021 said:

There are also noticeable issues with antialiasing that detract from the experience, in my opinion

AIUI, the biggest problem is the new lighting model interacting with ground features, rather than anti-aliasing.  Laminar are moving towards motion vectors and TAA to improve this.

In any case, I was referring to the weather.  MSFS before SU5 was a joy to behold and despite updates the weather has not regained its majesty from the early days.  It can look stunning at times, but not up to the early standards.

2 hours ago, spitzer45 said:

the only downside is its default scenery.

Then don't use it - use satellite imagery like MSFS.

4 hours ago, Krakin said:

To be fair to him, he was speaking specifically about the weather. I also much prefer how clouds look and are lit in XP12 but the drawback is really low resolution so they look very blurry, especially up close. One of the LR devs actually acknowledged this to me and indicated it was a compromise made to preserve performance. 

I have seen references to blurry clouds but I don't feel that is much of an issue because the range of clouds and lighting is even better than MSFS pre SU5.  MSFS clouds and atmosphere are not bad at all, but this is an area where Laminar have spent a lot of development time on and it really shows.

Good to have the choice to zoom in on the sim that ticks the most boxes for each simmer.

5 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

Then don't use it - use satellite imagery like MSFS.

Yes I have already used Map Enhancement and Ortho4xp.

57 minutes ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

I have seen references to blurry clouds but I don't feel that is much of an issue

Yeah not everyone will see it as an issue but I was watching blackbox's stream earlier and the blurriness was very obvious and I can't abide that. If we can get the cloud shapes of XP12 with the resolution of the ones in 2024, that would be great.

The Black Square Starship has the best radar I've used in FS2020.  It can be tilted up and down by 14 degrees, has adjustable gain and can be used to scan terrain.  Also, 2 channels can be displayed at once.

The OP posted that XP has weather radar but MSFS doesn't? I'm confused. I don't fly default planes in msfs so maybe thats the reason? Fenix, Avro, 777, Dukes..... 

I know its fairly basic but to say/imply it doesn't have any weather radar is incorrect. Its just basic. It needs work, of course. But not at all? Thats not true. Maybes its because I use activesky and have the tdi gtn? 

I should also mention that the basic radar in the TBM, CJ4 and Longitude work fine, though they don't have the advanced capabilities of the Starship.

Good old AI (seems accurate):

I don't believe any flight simulator weather depiction has sufficient data to simulate all the particles necessary to make a radio wave based system represent accurately on a 2D display ... that would be A LOT of data to generate and process while also trying to keep an acceptable level of performance (FPS).  I think what they try to achieve is some level of interpolation with far less data points and get to "good enough" under the constraints of today's hardware.

Aircraft weather radars work by emitting radio waves and analyzing the echoes that bounce back from precipitation in the atmosphere. The radar determines the distance to the weather, the intensity of the precipitation (which is mapped onto a display using different colors like green, yellow, and red), and even detects turbulence by measuring the Doppler shift of the returning waves. This information allows pilots to identify and avoid severe weather, ensuring a safer and more comfortable flight. 

How it Works

1. Emission:

The radar system sends out pulses of radio waves from an antenna, typically located on the aircraft's nose or wings. 

2. Interaction with Precipitation:

When these radio waves hit precipitation particles like raindrops, snowflakes, or ice crystals, they are scattered. 

3. Echo Detection:

The radar's receiver detects these scattered radio waves, which serve as echoes. 

4. Signal Processing:

The system processes these echoes to extract information: 

Distance: By measuring the time it takes for the echo to return, the system calculates the distance to the precipitation. 

Intensity: The strength of the returned signal indicates the intensity of the precipitation, which is translated into colors on the display. 

Turbulence: Using the Doppler effect, the radar can measure the radial velocity of the precipitation, revealing information about wind speed and turbulence within the storm. 

What Pilots See

Colored Displays:

The processed data is displayed on a navigation screen, with different colors representing different intensities of precipitation. 

Green: Light precipitation. 

Yellow: Medium precipitation. 

Red: Heavy precipitation. 

Magenta/Purple: Very severe weather and significant turbulence. 

Turbulence Detection:

The radar can also highlight areas of severe turbulence, allowing pilots to steer clear. 

Pilot Adjustments

Pilots can manually adjust the radar's tilt to scan different elevations and assess the height of storms. 

They can also adjust the gain to fine-tune the system's sensitivity, helping to see different levels of weather intensity. 

Advanced systems may offer automatic features like predictive overflight that alert pilots to developing cells that could affect their flight path. 

Edited September 8, 2025Sep 8 by Ray Proudfoot
Edited to make italic text readable.