Eyepoint

[Guest jlwoodward]

I was wondering what experiences other people have had setting the eyepoint. I put a pilot figure in the plane and then found the coordinates of the eyepoint. After starting FS, the location did not look right, maybe too high and too far back. I experimented with the numbers until the views looked about right. Also the view looks different between the 2d cockpit and the VC cockpit. I just settled for the best compromise.Of course the numbers are far from what the actual location was in the model. I have noticed in several downloads that the views did not look right either.Maybe "eyepoint" is just a viewing position and not necessarily the location of the pilot figure's eye?John Woodward

[Guest]

Eyepoint in aircraft.cfg should be where the pilots eyes are located. Use a navigation light to visualize the excact location. What the eyepoint offset is derived _from_, I'm uncertain about.But I will give a warning between using a compromize between 2d and vc. Choose one of them. In my panel.cfg, I have set the default zoom to 1 (although I prefer 1.4 myself), but with a tilt downward, so that when I enter virtual cockpit the head is automatically tilted to I can see the top row - the view seem very belivable. However, in the 2d panel, it seems like I'm staring into the ground. So, I have chosen the VC for the perfect view. In order to "fix" the 2D view, I can always icrease the height of the 3D view [Default View] so the tilt in 2D is back to normal. But, on a complex panel, expect a "hit" in frames by doing this.For reasons I won't go deeper into (runway perception issue), I usually set all my (even downloaded) panels to a default forward zoom of 1.4. For this to "work" in virtual cockpit, I need to move the eye backwards, so the virtual panel comes back into view. The window area does become a little "distorted" and "unrealistic", but perception on runway widths seem to fit me a lot better.-Edit-For the above reasons, I really hate visual pilots and copilots in the vc. In real life it is not much "work" to bend forward to see past your passenger in the right seat, but in the sim this "head-movement" is a LOT of work (especially when things get busy on a right baseturn, and that view is critical for timing jugdements). I even prefer "downsized" vc yokes, if they are blocking the instruments. Example on this is the default C208.-End Edit-Whatever you choose to be "correct" view, state it in the readme.If going for the 2D panel to be the correct one, and you have to move the attitude indicator much left in the panel ("normally" the attitude is right in front of the pilot), you can always "fix" this also by adding a horizontal pan to the default view, so that runway centreline is aligned with the attitude indicator. Might not be a good idea on small aircraft with high crab angles and high zooms - "where did the runway go?" ;) The problem here is that it also affects the virtual cockpit "orientation".I wish we (in the future? hint hint) could add separate views for the joystick hatswitch for vc and 2d panels. If we in fact get another version with 2d panels.

[Guest]

>Eyepoint in aircraft.cfg should be where the pilots eyes are >located. Use a navigation light to visualize the excact >location. What the eyepoint offset is derived _from_, I'm >uncertain about. Don't you folks read the messages here? :) I just posted a very lengthy message on just exactly this point a couple of days ago... :)========================================There are three separate points defined in any model.1) Center Point of Model:The model's Flight Simulator center point, which is on the centerline

[Guest jlwoodward]

Karl,I need help on the tilt angle.I settled on a forward zoom of .75 for both panels. Then I moved the eyepoint around to get the best view in the VC, so that the top of the panel would not be too high or too low and the door frames did not block the side views. The view looked realistic panning around, and it was pretty close for the 2d panel too.Now, for one plane I need to pan downward to see some of the gauges. I looked for a way to permanently set this but did not find it. Other than panning down each time the view is changed, is there a command line for the panel cfg file?I also made the pilot to appear in the outside view but not in the VC.The planes are being set to fly from the VC. The 2d panel is mainly for the switches.Thanks,John Woodward

[Guest]

>======================================== >There are three separate points defined in any model. >>1) Center Point of Model: >The model's Flight Simulator center point, which is on the >centerline

[Guest]

Bill, off course I'm reading ;) Just felt that your post only contained info on _how_ the eyepoint position related to the other points. Personally, I'm only doing the panel, and have no control of "feel" on those other points. Eyepoint is all I've got :D Also, I was under the impresssion that the question wasn't answered by this.John, have you ever noticed how bad the C182 "behaves" in regards of the viewpoint. On this one there must be a fault in the design (although I can't pinpoint what it is - it _looks_ correct). Whereever the eyepoint is set, you cannot have both a view over instrument panel (in vc), _AND_ be able to se under the wings at the same time when panning around. The solution for me was to "move the head down" when looking left with hatswitch, to be able to orient myself in the traffic pattern.The panels SDK (or container SDK, not sure) says there are some functions:VIEW_XX_ZOOM, VIEW_XX_DIR, and VIEW_XX_EYE for all directions, but no info on how to actually use it. I struggeled for days figuring out which direction did what, changing several directions for each reload also contributed in the confusion. Here is a full [views] section (including comments on reasoning, although they may be heavily outdated) I use in my panel.[VIEWS]//View directions are Pitch, Bank, and Heading.//View eye are Lateral, Vertical, and Longitudinal.//Change of view position in aircraft.cfg will affect all eye positions set below.VIEW_FORWARD_ZOOM=1.0 //Personal preference is 1.4VIEW_FORWARD_DIR=6.8, 0.0, 0.0 //H=4.5 for alignment to 2D attitude indicator, but distorts virtual cockpit.VIEW_FORWARD_EYE=0.0, 0.05, -0.01 //Use -0.35 as longitudinal offset whenever using zoom factor 1.4, else 0.0//Delete rest of [VIEWS] section to restore to (crappy) default.VIEW_FORWARD_RIGHT_ZOOM=1.0VIEW_FORWARD_RIGHT_DIR=5.0, 0.0, 45.0 //Pitch down 10 to be able to see the instruments.VIEW_FORWARD_RIGHT_EYE=0.0, 0.05, -0.25 //Use -0.35 as longitudinal offset whenever using zoom factor 1.4, else 0.0VIEW_FORWARD_LEFT_ZOOM=0.7 //Designed view for ice checkVIEW_FORWARD_LEFT_DIR=28.0, 0.0, -82.0 //Pitch down 10 to give the same downward angle as RIGHT_DIRVIEW_FORWARD_LEFT_EYE=-0.28, 0.15, 0.25 //Use -0.35 as longitudinal offset whenever using zoom factor 1.4, else 0.0VIEW_LEFT_ZOOM=1.0 //Personal preference is 1.4VIEW_LEFT_DIR=-9.0, 0.0, -90.0 //Pitch up, for better views during left base turns.VIEW_LEFT_EYE=0.0, 0.0, 0.0VIEW_RIGHT_ZOOM=1.0 //Personal preference is 1.4VIEW_RIGHT_DIR=-2.5, 0.0, 90.0 //Medium pitch up 5.VIEW_RIGHT_EYE=0.0, 0.0, 0.25 //and move forward slightly for better right baseturns.VIEW_REAR_LEFT_ZOOM=1.0VIEW_REAR_LEFT_DIR=10.0, 10.0, -135.0 //Look back, down and leftVIEW_REAR_LEFT_EYE=-0.3, 0.0, 0.3 //by leaning forward and closer to the window. Great in the pattern.VIEW_REAR_RIGHT_ZOOM=1.0VIEW_REAR_RIGHT_DIR=-13.0, 0.0, 115.0 //Some pitch up is required sinceVIEW_REAR_RIGHT_EYE=0.68, -0.2, 0.35 //you are leaning forward and closer to copilot for a better view.//Rest of normal views as default.//special kinds of views, since standard will have no real purpose.VIEW_FORWARD_UP_ZOOM=0.35 //A very wide zoom for a better view of the whole picture, not realistic.VIEW_FORWARD_UP_DIR=-55.0, 0.0, 0.0 //Look up, but do so by a head tiltVIEW_FORWARD_UP_EYE=0.0, -0.15, 0.45 //and by leaning forward.VIEW_DOWN_DIR=3.9, 0.0, 0.0 //copilot's view, use num 5 then switch off numlock to lock to this view.VIEW_DOWN_EYE=0.9, 0.05, -0.35 //adjust when panel layout complete. Works correctly only in vc, a bug?VIEW_REAR_DIR=3.0 8.0, 180.0 //cabin view backward with tilted head, which a 180 degree rotation require.VIEW_REAR_EYE=0.35, -0.25, 0.2[Default View]X=0Y=0SIZE_X=8191SIZE_Y=4600 //2700 makes better 3D strip in 2D-panel, but gets distorted by the down direction.Note that you can also make a gauge click that takes you from 2D to VC cockpit. Here is one I have on my "brow" (xml-code for click only):0 (>K:VIEW_MODE) 120 (>K:PANEL_ID_OPEN)In panel.cfg, let the 120 panel contain a gauge which has this gauge click code:0 (>K:VIEW_MODE_REV) 120 (>K:PANEL_ID_CLOSE)Now, here is the clue. You can add frequently used functions to this gauge, such as OBS setting, or radio standby toggling, and you have a VC with clickable areas (although limited to a small strip on top).Hope it was of any use.

[Guest Ron Freimuth]

>======================================== >There are three separate points defined in any model. >============================================= > ..........>Now, more to the point... the eyepoint is set relative to >either the Reference Datum Position or the model's >Center Point. All of these values are set and controlled >via the entries in the aircraft.cfg file, something >you have full control over. If the pilot's station_load is set correctly, the eyepoint will be at the same x and y location, but about 2 ft higher. Since one's head is above his CG. Often the front seats slide for/aft a bit and setting the stations to the most rear location can help. Also, in the VC seat, so the back is not in the 3D view when you move back. However, one might move the eyepoint a bit in aircraft.cfg or in the panel.cfg file to get a better perspective. The pilot station_load and eyepoint correspond regardless of the reference datum. However, setting that forward of 0, 0, 0, requires all longitudinal distance to be moved back the same amount. Ron

[Guest]

Karl,you probably know this, but my HAT switch is setup to provide a continuous pan of the VC view. I only use fixed views when not using the Yoke. I have an older CH Yoke with two hat buttons. It seems fairly weird in that each can only control four axes.Anyway, I have the right hat setup to provide the VC pan. In FS, in Assignments, View, I set Event: Pan a view to Joystick: POV 0There is not much documented on this and I picked it up from the groups. I had previusly tried to assign individual fixed views to each hat direction. Was not very satisfying. Now I can roll my view around 360 in any direction in VC.That is an interesting idea. I did discover that you can display panels in the VC, like the GPS as seperate windows, so you're right, you can make utility panels for use in the VC. Perhaps to mimic the function of having active controls there.Steve

[Guest]

Ok, on my system the hat works as a pan while in vc, and a fixed direction when in 2d-view. My cockpit (Cessna 421B) is a really busy one, so being able to do quick-checks to the left or right or check for ice is a quite useful one. 2D is for administration, VC is used after passing the marker or abeam. Not a typical VFR aircraft :) I can do a quick 2d-like direction toggle in vc while I hold the keypad numbers (numlock on).I've rebuilt that VC gauge slightly, so that I can click the most needed things while in virtual cockpit. Radio swap buttons, heading bug changes, change the altitude hold and vertical speed settings and so forth - my "personal needs". Click on a 2D-labelled button and I'm right back in the 2d cockpit again. Kinda neat. The one things that puzzles me, is that even such a simple gauge with one graphical image and a few click areas actually costs a few frames :