Making lakes/ponds

[Naji 5]

I am mapping a custom bitmap on the ground. When I paint the place of a lake black and save it as an alpha channel, save it as DXT1, I am not getting water, I only get a transparent patch that makes FS ground beneath visible.Can someone tell me what am I doing wrong? Thanks.

[arno 1]

I don't know if that is the way to make a lake. Never tried it that way.To really get nice lakes (where you also can land on in Fs2002, etc) I would recommend the method found out by Christian Stock. Look for his sceneries in the file library and you will find the sources there too. You need BGLC to compile them, but it works great (I have done some testing on it).I would also recommend this thread here, it's really interesting:http://ftp.avsim.com/dcforum/DCForumID10/309.htmlArnoMember NL2000 Teamhttp://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen

[Guest]

I haven't studied the Code Christian is using. He's the pioneer into using BGLC code. using that may be the optimum method.However, I can share the current method I understand. This means using resample.exe which was the scenery sdk tool from fs2000. In this old thread, topic 39 in the Terrabuilder forum, I outlined my method. Good luck!Bob Bhttp://ftp.avsim.com/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboa...rum=DCForumID12

[arno 1]

Does that also make the water landable Bob? With the splashing water, etc?ArnoMember NL2000 Teamhttp://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen

[Naji 5]

Hi, Arno and Bob. I downloaded the scenery of Christian. I've looked briefly through the documentation. It's gonna require more than a brief look for sure :-).I've read through the procedure set by Bob and it looks to be the faster way for me.Thank you both very much for taking the time to provide the links. Appreciate it.Two questions Bob if you will; I use MS Imagetool for DXT1 conversion. Will it do the DXT1+alpha conversion like Elrond's FS texture converter? Does this procedure work only after using TB or resample.exe on the color and alpha bmp's, or can I input directly the original bmp and its twin alpha into the conversion utility without prior slicing?Many thanks.

[Guest]

You need to use the prior slicing, because the file name is set both as the texture name and as the bgl that is created by tmf2bgl.exeImagetool may work if it allows for dxt1+alpha format. I like Elronds MUCH better, but each to their own.And to Arno: yes the water using the methods of resample.exe if Fully fs2002 water...all effects etc. No coastline effects, however.Bob B

[arno 1]

Yes, ImageTool can work with DXT1+alpha. If you save your image as a TGA image (that is a format that can include the alpha channel) you don't even need a second image for the alpha channel.ArnoMember NL2000 Teamhttp://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen

[Guest]

Here's my current project:

[Naji 5]

Very nice work you're doing there, Bob! And thanks for the clarification.All the best.

[Guest]

>I haven't studied the Code Christian is using. He's the >pioneer into using BGLC code. using that may be the optimum >method. >>However, I can share the current method I understand. This >means using resample.exe which was the scenery sdk tool from >fs2000. In this old thread, topic 39 in the Terrabuilder >forum, I outlined my method. Good luck! >There is a FSTerrainCalc utility written by Jari Kaskelin, which inputs the bitmap picture and creates all necessary textures out of it. You don't have to do the math ;-) I guess that FSTerrainCalc is here in AVSIM - if it's not you can download it from http://www.fsnordic.net file library under utilities section.

[rhumbaflappy 113]

Hi rantala and all.FSTerrainCalc looks to be a great programming tool for photoreal sceneries. However, the MASM/BGLC code Christian Stock developed is to create lakes, coastline corrections and mesh conforming polygons of the FS2002 variety, not photoreal. Sadly, the tediousness of the coding process, and the huge problems of investigating the code without a proper terrain SDK, drove Christian away from all design activity regarding FS2002. It's pretty obvious, by now, that Microsoft does not want designers to be able to code their own lakes, coastal areas, shorelines, rivers, streams, roads, or rail lines; or to be able to lay down mesh-clinging polygons. Most of this code was used in some form since CFS2.Remember, also, photoreal and landclass are not in any way supported by Microsoft... these were results of discoveries by simmers using AVSIM and other forums as a vehicle of communication. In truth, the resample program from Microsoft's FS2000 SDK does not even function as the SDK documentation states:For example... the terrain SDK gives us an example of using multiple source files ( Mt. Rainier ). But the line " NullCellValue = -9999 " is not possible with the version of resample.exe they gave us ( it's not even a valid command! ). That command alone would have allowed irregular or partial dems to be used along with "complete" dems of a different resolution to fill the terrain "gaps". Not possible with the tool they gave us, and that's just one instance why Christian decided to leave this sim. Microsoft never even gave us the tool they said they gave us. The tmf2bgl program will set incorrect bounds in the BGL header. Burkhard Renk developed a small progam to correct this, and Martin Wright incorporates the necessary correction in his FStrn program. Otherwise you need to check and correct the bgl header with a hex editor. ( Now they promise CFS3 will be designer-friendly.... LMAO ).So until someone can create a program that gives us BGLC code from a list of lat-long points, Christian's labor lies dormant. It's just too hard to hand-code. A point must be defined as 1/256th of 1/32nd of an LOD8 area. Imaginine a pixel of an LOD13 256 X 256 terrain area ( the size of a standard texture block or photoreal texture ). That's the required precision of the TMF-style lakes and coastal correction polygons of FS2002. Using CFS2 coding, I discovered a way to create mesh conforming water polygons, and now we could create wide rivers and swamps that need not be flattened. All coasts and lakes are HYP files. Their framerate "hit" is minimal, and the file sizes are tiny! That's what we can get with the proper tool. And not just water, but invisible irregular ( and precise ) flattening polygons and irregular shaped mesh-clinging textured polygons as well. Sorry for the rant. :)P.S. bob5568's project looks great!

[Guest]

>Hi rantala and all. >>FSTerrainCalc looks to be a great programming tool for >photoreal sceneries. However, the MASM/BGLC code Christian >Stock developed is to create lakes, coastline corrections >and mesh conforming polygons of the FS2002 variety, not >photoreal. Yep - I know the difference. The reason why I mentioned FSTerrainCalc was that Bob mentioned a link to another conversation in TerraBuilder forum which turned out to be a photoreal issue.- Jussi>Sorry for the rant. :) Now I got this - however I had to use finnish-english dictionary :)

[Guest]

Sorry ur upset, Rhumba, and thanks for the comp! While I agree with your points, I don't find myself upset. I guess there is lots of learning going on and that keeps me happy. Cheers,Bob B

[Guest]

Hi Friends..Very interesting thread this one...I have minimal knowledge of terrain design rules, and it seems there are things that can be done here.If someone can give me some info of what we already know, I could probably help with the tool. Of course it would be through gmax.You also mention some files and examples from Christian, a pioneer in deed. It seems I have missed that. Can you tell me where it is ? Do I understand correctly that we know how to built proper 2k2 lakes ???I have figured out the maths for scenery design and so far I can get better that +/- 0.5 m accuracy. If the same rules apply to terrain then I'll be glad to contribute.ALl the best,George

[arno 1]

At this moment one of our team members (NL2000) is rebuilding our custom tool that we use to create our scenery to work with BGLC. I think he can already almost make the new style lakes, from the data we have in that tool. I haven't heard from him the last days how must progress he made, I'll ask him.ArnoMember NL2000 Teamhttp://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen