Coastline agony - ground2k4

[Guest Anthony_D]

Hello,My lancashire project continues. Following the release of version 1, I did some research into why the map view crashes and found out that "area fills" between the new coastline and old coastline were to blame. So as a workaround, I created a simple LVM landmask polygon that extends the default coastline out. I use the coastline with the intention of cutting the polygon down to size to follow the shape of the coastline. Unfortunately it didn't work.The LVM polygon exists in it's original shape by itself. But when it shares an LOD13 area with a coastline, the landmask fails to work.So, does anyone have any suggestions? Either to stop area fills crashing map view or to get LVM polygons to work?A second query relates to joining two separate costlines. I understand this should be done on an LOD13 border. I've tried this and the right hand coastline leaks - an entire LOD13 area turns to water.Any help much appreciated

[rhumbaflappy 113]

Hi Anthony.As is typical with coastline changes, lwm land polys often reveal square LOD13 sized water areas. That's becuase those areas have been assigned as value #100 ( water ). This makes sense as 70% oe the earth's surface is water, and if it were assigned another value, our extended views would look like land... with water suddenly popping up as we approach it.You need to change the landclass to another value, and the water squares will go away.The areafilling bug is not the fault of Ground2K. It appears to be a bug in the sim. The default MS HP9*.bgls do not display this problem. If you entirely replace an HP9*.bgl ( renaming or removing the default ) your LWM fills will show just fine in your replacement. The problem is filling over the defaults. How did MS miss this bug? Because they never have filled over a default LWM bgl! They don't rework scenery.This is one reason why I proposed designers consider replacing the default LWM's entire LOD5 area when designing terrain.Dick

[Guest Anthony_D]

>The areafilling bug is not the fault of Ground2K. Hi, since my last post I downloaded ground2k4 version 5.1 over version 5 that I previously had. The program replaces area fill with LWM polygons each of size LOD 13. Now my first problem is solved - map view doesn't crash and I can fill the land behind my coastline.The second problem remains however. I tried assigning lanclass values to the affected cells as per your suggestion. Unfortunately it didn't work. If I bring the coastline right up to an LOD 13 border or past it, the affected area fills with water. If I bring the coastline up close to the border(without touching it), the same area fills with land (as expected). The coastline on the left of the border doesn't have a problem with it's LOD 13 area but the separate coastline on theright hand area does.I'll try some more testing.Thanks for your reply

[Guest Anthony_D]

Hello,I thought I'd attach some screenshots of my problem:The first screenshot shows how the two coastlines meet on ground2k4 (each coastline is a different colour)http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/50746.jpgThe second screenshot shows it's appearance in fs2k4http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/50747.jpgIf I take the left line away from the LOD13 border, the water square disappears. I've been racking my brains on this problem all day today, nevermind. I hope the solution's easy.

[rhumbaflappy 113]

Hi Anthony.You could attach the G2k4 LWM file as a zipped file... no need to include the background bitmap.I still believe this is a landclasss issue. Land assignments must extend FAR beyond the shorelines... by FAR, I mean 2-3 LOD 13 areas into the water.This is an FS issue. A water assignment ( value #100 ) will cover 4 LOD13 areas completely, as they do not blend like ground textures.Dick

[Guest Anthony_D]

>You could attach the G2k4 LWM file as a zipped file... no need>to include the background bitmap.I've attached the lvm file to this message>I still believe this is a landclasss issue. Land assignments>must extend FAR beyond the shorelines... by FAR, I mean 2-3>LOD 13 areas into the water.I applied landclass to all LOD13 squares in the sea that were 3 tiles away from the join. Unfortunately it did not solve the problem.I appreciate your assistance in this matter dick.Thanks

[rhumbaflappy 113]

Hi Anthony.I can see 2 problems with your scenery.1) Don't use the coastline drawing routines. You have much more control filling coastal areas with land, then carving shoreless water polys, then drawing shoreline vtps. This will solve the immediate problem. It only involves drawing the shorelines over the landedge, but can save time when you become stalled fighting coastline problems.In your case, you can select the coastlines and convert them to shorelines. Then draw large detailed water polys to cut the water right up to the shore, tracing the edge of the shorelines. It actually goes pretty quickly.Coastlines are not an MS feature, but something Christian developed to satisfy requests. It is flawed in that it requires the computer to assume several things are true in order for the coasts to show properly. As you can see, it doesn't always work.The 3 steps I give in the above example ( landfill, carve water, draw shorelines ) always work.2) I have had problems with bitmaps over 8500 x 8500. This may be peculiar to my computer, but sizes over 10000 in any direction sometimes crash G2k4 for me ( as was the case with your scenery ). This happens more often when zooming out, or moving towards the edges of the background bitmap. ( So save often! )Dick

[LuisFelizTirado 33]

Hello Dick,Concerning the extending of land class assignments beyond the coast, it had been my impression that it was only necessary to complete the assignment of land class on all 4 corners of the desired tile.Therefore, it is not necessary to extend far beyond the tile, only on all its "sides".I suppose that I am wrong and that you are right, but it certainly does not seem to be logical or consistent that we should have to extend far out beyond the tile. Could you please confirm this for me?Thanks very much.Best regards.Luis

[Guest Anthony_D]

>The 3 steps I give in the above example ( landfill, carve>water, draw shorelines ) always work.Thanks for that info Dick, I'll try it tonight. Is it possible to get the shoreline to snap to the edge of the shoreless water poly? I suspect the answer's no since I haven't seen it in the manual but I've hoping to pick up some tips to improve my work methodology and productivity. The coast I'm producing around the estaury does a fractal effect with many lagoons and channels sprouting out from the main estuary.Also, can I extend LWM polys beyond the edge of each red LOD(8 or 5?) border?>2) I have had problems with bitmaps over 8500 x 8500.I've had sudden crashs of Ground2k4 with the large bitmap that I'm using. It displays an error message and then bangs out. I can live with it though. As you said - I just have to save my work frequently.Thanks for your help

[Guest Anthony_D]

Hi Dick,Problem solved! I've tried your coastline generation technique and it works a treat. Many thanks for your help, though no doubt I'll find some more stumbling blocks along the way with different problems on my projectCheers

[PanosG 2]

Hi Dick,I had the same problem as you can see in my attached screenshotsand the solution for me was to use Landclass Assistant 1.4 by John Cillis and Ground2K4.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/50840.jpghttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/50842.jpghttp://jdtllc.com/images/RCsupporter.jpgPanos Georgotas

[rhumbaflappy 113]

Hi Anthony.I'm glad you've got a workable solution. G2K4 doesn't have a "snap to" function for shorelines, but that would be handy.As Luis pointed out, I did go overboard in my suggestion for landclass assignments to override the value #100 ( water ). But it usually saves a lot of time and confusion... just go overboard with landclass assignments extending into default water, and that often solves problems ( such as Panos experienced above ).Dick

[LuisFelizTirado 33]

Thanks for confirming, Dick.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/50953.gifBest regards.Luis