Mr. Rob Gainer - Everyone Please Read

[Guest deleteriousone]

I am not trying to start a flame war; I do however offer a differing point of view. Please take no offence if you disagree.I hate to be a stick in the mud and am speaking out of ignorance on the subject because I did not find the post on this site where Rob Gainer perpetrated the " slander of Justin, Dick, Holger and others

[Guest snowblind]

I cannot understand the point Mr.Gainer was trying to make. Did he expect to find some sort of flight sim mafia. It's sad really.Ray Barnesky

[flyking 0]

I too was banned from the Rob Gainer forum in minutes. I was banned before I even had a chance to say anything. O well-life goes on. I think it was for the best.flyking

[flyking 0]

I want to say that I have been using Justin's files for years and He has always been professional, helpful and supportive in all of my dealings with him. Justin has always delivered for me. Thank you Justin.flyking

[Guest fricart]

Is his site still up or have I too been banned?Fernando

[Guest deleteriousone]

The site is still up, you must have been banned.I just noticed that most of the links on Mr. Gainer

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

"All that being said, AVSIM is a privately owned property and they can set their own policies and choose what files they offer (or do not offer)."Indeed we can, and we do. When Mr. Gainer stated as a "fact" that Justin was a tax cheat, that crossed a line that we would not support, implicitely or otherwise. By hosting his files, we would be doing exactly that. By removing them, we made an unequivocal statement; people have to remember that words and deeds have consequences and that they will be held responsible for them - in so far as AVSIM has anything to say about it. If you want to be a member of this community, you don't achieve that goal by trying to destroy some of its outstanding members and contributors (commercial or otherwise). AVSIM made the simple decision to remove Mr. Gainer's files. We found his accusations and assertions to be repugnent and distortions of "fact" to be unacceptable (to put it mildly).

[Guest PhilC]

Here Here AVSIM!!! Congratulations on a very wise decision. I've heard that his mesh was crap anyway.

[bob.bernstein 0]

wow....I'd not heard of Rob Gainer or the issues before, but I just read his website. Appears to be a sad case of lawyer seeing criminal intent behind each bit of data. Then additional ideas ring criminal based on bad assumptions up front.I guess folks new to a community could be this unaware of who is who, but it a bit upsetting to see the accusations so foolishly made. Justin Tyme....I never knew if it was his real name or not...but why is this an issue? Justin released freeware for Pennsylvania, West Va, Deleware, and more for fs98 that blew me away. But what's more, he taught me selflessly many techniques for scenery design. Still today, I credit Justin with having influenced my interest in scenery design more than anyone. Folks have asked me at times why I would be willing to teach design techniques...I always refer to the hours Justin spent with me. And I firmly believe "what goes around, comes around". Holger Sandmann and Dick Ludowise...how can these people's intentions be scrutinized and conclusions of conspiracy be reached? Both of these folks teach constantly. I don't care if Gainer chose not to recognize either as a teacher to him...but to claim to be an investigator and fail to uncover the selfless hours both these people spend to teach techniques to others...well it shows the earmarks of a false "investigation", one only taken on to proove a predetermined conclusion. Witchhunt would apply. Freeware is the cause Gainer professes, yet he's attempted to smite the reputations of people who have done an amazing job to teach techniques to new freeware authors. Steve Greenwood also has gone out of his way to help me understand some fundamentals of how mesh would impact my scenery design back in the fs2000 and 2002 days. His freeware mesh for Washington is still what I fly.So...I'm just venting...thanks for all your fabulous help over the years to Justin, Steve, Holger, and Dick. I don't care if you use these names on your checks, I don't care if you make a buck selling payware, and I don't care if you have tax IDs or not. If we enjoy the flowering of artistry within the flightsim community, we must repect these folks. While Rob is likely deserving of our sympathy for his ailment, I agree with the main website's decisions. It lets us all get on with our interests without dealing with the madness of Rob's thinking.Bob Bernstein

[Holger 0]

Hi all:during last week's vacation (computerless - bliss!) I "fantasized" a couple of times about coming home and the Rob Gainer "saga" having disappeared. Imagine my surprise to discover that just that has happened! (have to come up with a more rewarding fantasy next time ;-)Many thanks to Tom and Matt, and also the crew at flightsim.com, for their support in this matter - much appreciated! It's surely not an easy decision to issue a ban like this, as some of the more critical responses above indicate. On the other hand, I'm sure that fans of Rob's work will be able to find his files at FSPlanet or elsewhere (for that matter, anyone noticed the similarity of the read-me file of the recent firelandmesh.zip to Rob's read-me files? ;-) Actually, something positive has come out of this bizarre story, at least for me. I guess I have the dubious "honor" of being the first to end up in Rob's crosshairs (Feb 11 saw the first salvo). Initially, I was quite upset; talk about giving advice to the wrong person at the wrong time! However, as soon as other poeple realized what was going on I started receiving supportive emails, similar to Bob's message above (thank you very much, Bob!). Internet-based communication can be a pretty impersonal thing but in a situation like this it becomes obvious that we ARE a neat community with a well-working support network. Thanks again to all who offered kind words and helpful advice in the last few weeks; I hope I'll be able to provide similar support when needed.Perhaps another thing to remember is the (unintentional) comical relief provided by some of Rob's posts; for example, his brief appearance as "Lisa Kanski" in this forum was one of the funniest things I've ever seen.Cheers,Holger

[Guest Heather 636]

Good day everyone.As energy permits, as I am currently recovering from yet another mild heart attack, I am compiling a comprehensive catalog listing of freeware scenery for FS2004; which I will be uploading when it is completed.As downloading scenery is almost a hobby within itself for me, needless to say, I have quite a bit of Rob Gainer's material.Some of you may remember the scenery catlogs I put together for FS2002 specializing in the Pacific Northwest and Canada. Unlike those, I am not entering any commentary regarding the quality of one piece of work over another, to be fair to all, as this would be based solely upon personal opinion. I hardly condone Mr. Gainer's personal conduct and commend Tom for removing his material from the Avsim library. My question however, is that Mr. Gainer's material is still available, albeit not here; therefore, since I am trying to make this catalog as comprehensive as possible, should I include his work in the listings?Where the source used to show Avsim, I have replaced it with "Unknown" and the URL to his website. That leaves it up to the end-user of my work whether or not they wish to search it out and/or use it.I am still debating whether I should even include his work in my listing. I am trying not to be biased.Your opinions would be appreciated.Regards,Heather Sherman

[LuisFelizTirado 33]

Hello Heather,Your catalog of scenery is great stuff, and you are to be commended for continuing with it.The mesh files in question were systematically flawed, and the author himself advised people not to use them, so perhaps there is no point in recommending them. In any case, all the area he covered has been done by more competent people, although this was probably a learning experience for him, so he has no doubt done better work since.Really, it's up to you to choose between a comprehensive list and a quality list.Best regards.Luis

[Guest stentor]

Howdy: }( For those just coming and innocent viewers(what's going on?), like myself."Mr. Gainer" coffe shop is right therehttp://www.gainer.webhop.net/EnjoyCelso Junior

[bob.bernstein 0]

Heather, my suggestion is to avoid the work due to the author's own request that it is flawed.But my real message is one of sympathy for your heart ailment. My thoughts go out to you...hope you're feeling well very soon.B

[Guest]

WOW...I spent quite a bit of time at work downloading his files. Last count it was about 1.2Gb I believe. I had them on the drive at home but never installed them. Then I took the plunge and installed them all last weekend. Unfortunately I haven't had the time to fly in the areas where his design applies.Now that I know there are flaws with it I will be deleting it ASAP when I get home. Glad I came here to read today and found this thread. Oh well...good bye and good riddance is what I say...Shawn McCoyP3/1GHz, 512mb, Radeon 9200, WinXP Pro, FS2k4