How can I add more gates to airports?

[Guest]

ya know, I do appologize for being such a pessimist... however, I've worked many long and hard hours to do what I've done and know from what I've discovered that what Lee is purposing is not only ludicrous but also impossible.first, when adding information to the default airports in scenerydb/afdfiles/scenery/*.bgl (the only way to add gates to default aircraft), MSFS2k2 can NOT be running. Lee has stated that he can do this in runtime while addressing fsuipc. I have personally changed gate coords during fs2k2 runtime and have always crashed my system in one way or another (most often, if I should ever click on 'go to airport'). it's just not possible.second, after the bgl file is edited 3 files are then reindexed by fs2k2 during startup. why? to prevent the general protection fault messages which appear otherwise.third, anyone can place static aircraft at any airport at any position. however, most times these are done in custom airports and NOT default airports, which is what this thread and many other threads addressing this topic was about. I often do not even attempt to download 3rd party airports as performance normally slows do to macros utilized at those airports.Once again, I am not taking anything away from Lee. I just find it very difficult to believe he can do this during runtime with default bgl files and miss all the GPF errors which one encounters during the game should they try. Waste my time? Never. if nothing more, at least the world knows that Lee is very close to a presumably working copy that will allow one to add gates to default airports.Hey lee, why don't you post the bgl file for KLAS you had to edit, so we can all share in your design abilities while we await your final product? (the changes to KLAX would be good too). The entire bgl file, if you don't mind.-john

[Guest]

As I said John - keep on with the development.I and others await the hard work of both Lee and yourself. I always work on the theory that time on these sorts of things is never wasted because there are thousands of people like myself without the know how to do what you are both doing who are only too willing to pat backs and thank those that do.

[Guest Leesw]

I don't know how you are doing it, but I don't get these GPF problems you are talking about. On my program (which I have renamed AFCAD), when you want to work on an airport you chose the airport either by entering the ID (e.g. KLAS) or using a tree view of all the FS2002 airports, derived from the index file. The program finds the appropriate .bgl file, reads the airport data, then closes the file. This causes no problems even while FS2002 is running. All work is done on the airport data in memory, and when you want to test your changes you just click 'save' and the program re-opens the .bgl file, inserts the changed airport data, and closes the file again (having made a backup copy first). I have done this dozens of times while FS2002 is running without any problems. In order to test your changes you just have to go back to the 'create a flight' dialog then go back to 'fly' to reload the file. I just did that a minute ago to remove one of the parking spots in the KLAS file that I noticed was too close to another one.The initial indexing FS2002 does when you start is only needed if you add a new airport.Even if you couldn't change a file while FS2002 was running for some reason it wouldn't be much of a problem, you could rework an entire airport with FS2002 running and flying and all you would have to do is save the file and restart FS2002 to bring in all the changes.As to the KLAS scenery being a 'custom airport' with static scenery. It is the KLAS that came with the game, except for the added parking, and the aircraft were all just TTools flight plans.I am not going to post the modified bgl file because it is a copyright violation and it could get this forum in trouble. If you want a copy I will email it to you (virtually_john only, I don't want to be emailing to everyone on the planet). When AFCAD is finished it will export airports in de-compiled text files, which should get around MS copyrights, and you just import it using AFCAD again.

[Guest Leesw]

You can't actually assign airlines to specific gates. I may look that way because the gates I created were all sequential, and FS2002 inserts AI aircraft at gates in the order they appear in the drop down list on the FS2002 Start Locations page. The first 'n' flight plans I created were for a NWA paint and the remainder were BA, so FS2002 loaded the first 'n' sequential gates with the NW planes. If you left the AI to come and go for a while they would randomise.You may notice that the gates are in a mixed-up order in the FS2002 drop down list (e.g. not GATE A1, A2, A3 etc.) and this is almost certainly to prevent the AI from bunching up in one area. AFCAD allows you to put the gates in any order, or mix them up, but I didn't bother when I did that quicky job on KLAS.You can, however, assign specific aircraft types to specific gates within reason. Forget the "Gate small/meduim/heavy" stuff, internally the .bgl files specify parking as radius'es (in metres) and AFCAD allows you to finely adjust those radiuses for any parking type. The AI will park at the smallest available parking space that is big enough for the aircraft (based on the wingspan of the aircraft), so by specifying a size just big enough for a 737 or MD83, only those types will park there (unless those sized parking spots are all gone in which case it will use a larger one).It may be possible to make specific airlines use specific gates by modifying the aircraft wingspans slightly so that each airline's 737 (md83, A320 etc) has a slightly different wing span, maybe 6" increments, not enough to change performance. This would mean that you would have to have different files for different livery aircraft, not just different paints, so it is probably not worth the hassle.

[Guest Leesw]

When I used Mike Stone's A320, which is in the pictures, the frame rates were terrible. When I changed them to the stock 737's the frame rates were actually reasonable. I got at worst about 11 FPS (PIII 900 with GeForce II), with the stock aircraft, and that is only when you are viewing all the aircraft at the terminal in the same frame close up (e.g. flying right over the terminal in a C182 -- keeping in mind that the KLAS scenery is very frame rate consuming in itself). The rest of the time the frame rates were in the +20's.I think we need to convince aircraft builders to make more 'frame rate friendly' aircraft specifically for AI if we want to bulk up the bigger airports. At the very least, AFCAD will allow you to put aircraft exactly where you want them and not just spread out around the tarmac.

[Guest]

Thanks for the update. As Lee has done, we all need to take three deep breaths and go back to work and get these fantastic tools finished. Wouldn't it be nice if Lee and V-John could help each other? I think we would then have the best-of-the best.Good luck folks!Regards,BobIn the land of Lincoln :-wave

[Guest]

Lee, you don't get a GPF if you try to create a MSFS2k2 flight plan if you do these changes prior to the reindexing done by FS2k2?Sure would like to know how you got around that one! That's the one gpf that took me weeks to figure out how to get rid of. And yes, please do email the bgl file to me... john@stottlemire.net-j

[Guest]

Thank you for the bgl file...Now let me say this, in closing....When you sit at klas and click on flight planner, you get a GPF. I opened the file you sent and checked the hashcode within the file. You have not changed it, thus, flight planner GPF's every time if you are sitting at that airport (or any airport contained in that bgl file).It took me weeks to find the formula for the hashcode and the location in the bgl file it was placed. You, obviously have not yet found it, making the program you are writing utterly useless.Now, should I still not waste my time?-johnp.s. hate to sound so harsh, but I still don't like the fact that anyone tells me "Don't waste your time" especially when the person who told me that doesn't have the whole picture (irratates me even more now that I know lee doesn't know where the hashcode is or the formula needed to correct the GPF)

[Guest]

Instead of playing the 'I know something you don't know' game why don't you tell him where to find the 'hash code'? Perhaps Lee would then recognise your achievements in the thank yous when he releases.Just a thought - I wonder if something resident on your machine is causing the GPF's. Lee doesn't sound like the type to announce what he is up to with such conviction when what you imply is a fundamental error is in the workings of his program.I thought one of the great tenets of the Fs community was to hel one another. Must have been a dream.Anyhow - if you have all the answers how long will it be before you development is released?

[Guest]

Okay Chumley,Nice move.You got me guessing now. What is the missing letter? Is it an "L" or a "P"? In this case it almost sounds like a ? should be used along with adding a "with"?Yous said ....>I thought one of the great tenets of the Fs community was to >hel :-hmmm one another. Must have been a dream. Thanks,BobIn The Land of Lincoln

[Guest]

Hi virtually_john, you say;>fsuipc. I have personally changed gate coords during fs2k2 >runtime and have always crashed my system in one way or >another (most often, if I should ever click on 'go to >airport'). it's just not possible. So has I, using hexworkshop and no errors occur. I have changed gatesize, coords, (not adding gates) but it's no problem.It's also completely possible to make a program that reads fsuipc position, converts that to hexcode and then change this to new values when you have slewed to that position in FS. My brother has already written a program that does excactly that. The idea is actually quite intuitive, and I think many people have thought of this possibility even before Lee Swordy and yourself put this idea out in the open. Works like a dream. My brother's program even reads the exact position of your aircraft and set gate position and heading from that information. You can type in gatenumber, and choose gate-type from a pop-down menu.Here's a link to show it works:http://home.hia.no/~vhalan99/engm/What I have done here, is to change the default afd-file for ENGM Oslo, Norway so that gates and taxiways match those of the Norway Airports for FS2002. (Originally the AI-aircraft would taxi a few 100 meters out in the grass.) Moving the gates, including moving each of the 134 taxi-points took me about one hour with my brothers program.We're doing this mainly for our own fun, but maybe the program will be available to everyone if there's a need for it.I think everyone should respect the findings and efforts of anyone who spend countless hours on making freeware add-ons. :-)

[Guest]

please, allow me to rephrase...add a gate (not change an existing one) or add a point (not change an existing one) during runtime. click on "Flight Planner"everything else I stand by.I do agree that one should respect the findings and efforts of anyone who has any type of 'break through' no matter it freeware, shareware or commercial. This is the whole cause of my ranting. I've never been told "I wouldn't waste my time if I were you" and have no respect for anyone who would tell me that, and would definately refuse to provide any helpful information to anyone who treated me with such disrespect. Sorry Lee.-john

[Guest]

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[Guest]

"I wouldn't waste my time if I were you" I don't think you are prepared to help cos you don't know. As for the quote above - you ARE wasting your time keep ranting about people telling you not to waste your time.I recall your original screen shots - where is the BGL for that? For all we know it could have been doctored with a paint program. Put your money where your mouth is and send me a copy - chumley@bigpond.net.au - so I can confirm it is for real.Anyway - where on earth is Port Coloumbus.

[01pewterz28 117]

Chumley- CHM (Port Columbus) is located in Ohio (America West hub)Lee- Great work cannot wait to take the prgram for a spin. Any chance your program will allow us to add more than 1 runway for each airport.Virtual_john- I say continue your work two programs are always better than one.Lee and virtual-john- Come on guys take it to the email and not post I know this and you do not know that stuff Please. But feel free Both of you to tease us with some great screen shots.John