Ohhh those ATR`S , they keep coming..............

[Guest Chris Wallace]

Good to know, Georg! Thanks for the feedback. I'm heading up to the cottage now but will work on finishing this next week.Chris WallaceOttawa, Canada

[Leen3131cs 107]

>I'm sure Jean will keep this in mind and minimize the impact>to repaints if possible (right Jean? :-)). If (and ONLY if)>Chris Wallace>Ottawa, CanadaWell , I am sorry to say , but changing an existing model of wich already repaints have been done is a bad thing to do.Making peoples efforts useless is to painfull .So I hope there will be NO such changes in the new V5 version.This V5 replaces V4 so it influenses existing repaints.Nevertheless there is another solution to fullfill your (our) needs.We could ask Jean to make a new acm/tif available for repainters.This sounds strange , but let me explain.When you unpod the Original Pa19 F-BOUK and compare the TIF file with the TIF file from the Pa19 Zebulon I made, you see they are totally different.The same goes for some Staggerwing liveries.Jean made them ( new acm/tif) for me on my request.Nobody noticed , because I am the only one who ever made Pa19 repaints.If someone had tried to give all wingsurfaces a different texture, on the Pa19 , he should have discovered he could not do that.The same time he would have wondered why I achieved this on my repaints.Unpodding and surveying my repaints would have solved his problem.So you see, repaintability can be improved without changing the basic model and making existing repaints useless.RegardsLeen

[Leen3131cs 107]

>>1. Use different texture space for the elevator lower surface>and the flaps; the fact that these overlap make it impossible>to paint the entire horizontal stabilizer/elevator with a>non-white colour without repainting the wing flap surfaces>too.>Chris Wallace>Ottawa, CanadaSorry Chris, that problem is not a real problem.MTHP is the answerRegardsLeenhttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/119237.jpg

[Guest rene_35]

the risk is only when you modify panels which contain active (or potential active)switches. My information post was not about external model or paint. I think the risk very low but I wanted just to inform "repainters".

[Leen3131cs 107]

>the risk is only when you modify panels which contain active>(or potential active)switches. >My information post was not about external model or paint. >I think the risk very low but I wanted just to inform>"repainters".Thanks Ren

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day Leen,I don't think repainters will be too upset if a new release of the ATR renders their repaints obsolete. If Jean and ROTW give us a better model then I'm sure repainters would be only too happy to redo their efforts. It is , after all, a hobby. :-)I personally have done a bit of beta testing for Jean (not ATR) and can attest to his dedication and pride in giving us the absolutely best models he can produce. Just as you take pride in giving us all your nice repaints. I think it is a bit unfair to ask Jean (and ROTW) to settle for second best and not improve the model just because a few repaints will require redoing. Cheers,Roger

[Leen3131cs 107]

>G'day Leen,>>I> I think it is a bit unfair to ask Jean (and ROTW) to settle>for second best and not improve the model just because a few>repaints will require redoing.>> Cheers,>>RogerHi Roger,As I explained , these improvements can be made without making the existing repaints useless.I may be a hobby , but throwing away things you made a month ago sucks. (BTW I am a meber of ROTW and did the original painting of the ATR42 Air France)So, I like to see improvements , just do not like to redo repaints , when another solution ,giving the same result without the need to redo the painting, is available.CheersLeen

[Guest Chris Wallace]

MTHP??? What's that?The problem I'm talking about is when the flaps are fully extended...doesn't your Alitalia tail colour show up on the upper inboard surface of the flaps when they are extended?Chris WallaceOttawa, Canada

[Leen3131cs 107]

>MTHP??? What's that?>>Chris Wallace>Ottawa, CanadaWell Chris.MTHP stands for Multi Tif Hocus Pocus.I already explained it at this forum (several times) , you must have missed it.There are so many things possible , of wich most people think they are not possible.Please download this repaint from the library;Beechcraft_B1900_Grand_Bahama_IslandUnpod this one and see , it has SEVEN tif files ( small or VERY small ones)It`s a system developed by Frederic Moufflin and adapted by me on a wider scale.When you unpod all my repaints you`ll find it MANY times.RegardsLeenhttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/119451.jpg

[Guest Chris Wallace]

Ah, I see now, thanks. I was thinking that MTHP was some sort of Dutch translation of RTFM...and in a way I suppose it was! I was always under the impression that there was a limitation in Fly2 that all parts in a ACM had to use the same texture. But obviously that's not the case. When you modify the ACM, do you just change the texture filename or do you also modify texture coordinates for the vertices of the affected part?This also opens the door for original aircraft that use a much larger initial texture space than a single 1024x1024...lots of possibilities beyond just the additional flexibility in repaints. Unfortunately I don't think the Fly2 texture crammer supports creation of multiple crams for a single model, but with some creativity I'm sure it could be done.Chris WallaceOttawa, Canada

[Leen3131cs 107]

> When you modify>the ACM, do you just change the texture filename or do you>also modify texture coordinates for the vertices of the>affected part?>>>Chris Wallace>Ottawa, CanadaHi Chris,I just change the texture filename.I always make the additional tifs as small as possible.In case of the flaps you must us a 512x512 tif in order the keep the texture.When only a color is needed for i.e. a wheelstrut just a 32x32 tif in this single color will do.In theory a 8x8 tif will do, but then the render ini file must be changed.I never use smaller than 32x32 tifsWARNING: Never use a second 1024x1024 TIF ONLY smaller ones.You can make the German bird without problems now I ussume.If not , send it to me and I`ll do the Hocus Pocus.RegardsLeen

[Guest Steve Brown]

Hi Chris In the A/C's smf oops acm file you will see many ref. to different parts of the A/C body wings and so on, each pointing to the tif file it uses.When doing repaints, you would change the smf to your new repainted TIF! Similar idea.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/119473.jpg Here is a model I made with the ref to its tif. If you want it to point to another you have made give it the name of the new tif. IE GGP07.TIFYou can experiment with a colour tiff and point different parts to the new TIF to see which parts change on the AirCraft, EG Wings or Tail...Im still trying to find the tutorial made by Leen on my computer. I tried it once on a test I was doing, on one of my models and it worked :-lol I was shocked I managed it.I think thats how it works. :-) Stevehttp://www.wrexhamspace.org/bannernewsb.jpg NASA ATX Graduatehttp://www.wrexhamspace.org

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day Steve,Hope the eye is a bit better.Just pointing to a new tif is fine just for a colour change but what I don't follow is how is the new tif texture MAPPED to the model .acm. Cheers, Roger

[Guest Chris Wallace]

That's why I was asking whether any texture coordinates were changed. If the texture coordinates are not changed then the new texture is mapped to the part exactly the same as the old texture. For example, let's say a part is textured from the original 1024x1024 TIF with a region of 100x100 pixels located at offset 400,500 from the top-left corner of the TIF. This relative size and offset would be preserved in the second TIF that is used as a "replacement" texture. If the second TIF were 512x512, then the region of that TIF that would be applied to the part would be 50x50 pixels located at offset 200,250 from the top-left corner. So all of the multiple TIFs represent the same full area as the original 1024x1024 cram, but individual parts just pick and choose which TIFs they actually get their texture from by specifying the appropriate TIF filename in the part definition in the ACM. If you're only applying a single solid colour, then the TIF can be very small, say 32x32 (in this case, only a couple of pixels from the TIF would be used but that's OK because no detail is needed) and if you want to preserve texturing detail then you could go up to 512x512. As Leen mentions, you don't want to create another 1024x1024 texture, or go below 32x32, to avoid the limitations in TRI's texture manager.Hope that clarifies things...Leen you're the expert so please add whatever details I'm missing.I'm going to take this a bit further and see what else I can do by tweaking texture coordinates in the ACM particularly on the nosewheel doors.Chris WallaceOttawa, Canada

[Leen3131cs 107]

>Hope that clarifies things...Leen you're the expert so please>add whatever details I'm missing.>>I'm going to take this a bit further and see what else I can>do by tweaking texture coordinates in the ACM particularly on>the nosewheel doors.>>>Chris Wallace>Ottawa, CanadaI think you`ve hit the nail on it`s head Chris.You must be able to perform a real MTHP now!!.BUT do not waiste any time on those nose-wheel-doors.If it was possible to do something with these doors , naturally I would already have done that ;)These doors are "streched" from a few white pixels.Placing one single red pixel on this place it will turn up as a red line on the door .RegardsLeen