Ideas for scenery objects

[Guest R_Driscoll]

Its amazing how expectations change.When I started making scenery I was happy with a rough colour match (FIXMIP fixed that), small muddy textures, generic buildings, simplest designs. I still can't use proper 3D modelling tools (like Jon, glidernut, agtim etc), but make do with text editing.A few things have stayed constant - a belief that the default models are unrealistic and unacceptable, that "overtexturing" (my own term, meaning replacing ground textures with flat improved textures) is important when you fly low, and that for flying close to the ground "verticality" (again my own term, meaning making things LOOK 3d)is important.When I stopped working on Seattle and started on UKS, I had to make specific (i.e. not generic) models for a long time (Big Ben, Buckingham, Tower Bridge, GLA), etc etc, since no one else was making them. Some time ago Jon made the important observation that complexity of the model has little effect on framerate. I had always thought the opposite, because of the impact of adding the balloon to the McChord airforce base (the first package I made where I used tarmac textures) - Jon was right however, and I think now that I must have made some mistake in my tests - maybe because it was a moving model. Jon is always right. Grrr. Now I've started to use this, combining models into "supermodels" (my own term, although I think its been used in another context elsewhere - might have to change this one). This is a joint project with Hans Petter of course. And these models are back to being generic. This means its now possible to make villages look like villages, to do EVERY building, every tree fairly quickly and easily. Of course I've got a lot to do still - this is early days. But I've attached some pictures of a trip around Gloucester showing the more detailed modelling. Hope you enjoy. Some of these new buildings will be released in both palettes shortly.Takeoff from Gloucester airport over suburb:http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194039.jpgGloucester itself - no supermodels in foreground, compare with suburb to left of pic with supermodels.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194040.jpgComing in to Fretherne/Saul region, no supermodels, every model placed individually. Same effect, low framerates.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194041.jpgNow flying over Stroud, with extensive use of supermodels. Easy peasy, and framerates smooth. The tree sets are mainly ash, beech and chestnut, the forest sets include oak, holly and birch as well. Size of trees is meant to be realistic (from size of ground shadows and a bit of horticultural research). Many types of house-sets shown here.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194042.jpgComing to the end of the Severn river and start of estuary, bad weather closes in, rest of flight through to Cardiff in bad weather so no pics.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194043.jpgThe main point is, its not so hard to do. Ahh, with hindsight we could have developed scenery much better and faster than we did! Doesn't matter, the fun is building, not finishing. However rooftop flying is improved enormously by this simple step. In a small village, every building can be represented (but not in towns or cities. Yet.)Usual disclaimer - I'll use any models that I can get my hands on, and many of the best in these pics were built by other people. Mainly Jon.

[Guest fu3]

"Some time ago Jon made the important observation that complexity of the model has little effect on framerate."Actually, it was Andre's experiments that taught me - his combination of models around a certain Swiss strip sold me on it - too late to rebuild my entire towns though* :-grrIn any case, I'll gladly accept kudos on the models. I'm still kinda proud of them but feel free to use/edit/enhance them as you like ;)* My Pillar Point/Half Moon Bay will pull any PC down to sub-10fps - IF you don't get a CTD when panning around :-lolRegards,Jon Point

[Christopher Low 5,339]

That's a very nice bridge model, Robert.

[Guest R_Driscoll]

Thanks Jon, OK so I'll give agtim the credit. Basically bigger models rduces the labour of placing by a factor of about 10, (or more as you have done with your forests series!), ok for small towns but I need a factor of 100 to do bigger towns and forget about London.But the bigger model means more textures too - most of these are using 5 to 9 texture MIPs, and whoops I've gone overboard and the framerate starts to drop again. So still a lot of artistry and not much science in getting the most out of the engine. Thanks Chris, that of course is the Old Severn Bridge and I've also done the Wye Bridge next to it. You've probably driven over it !!??Robert.

[agtim 0]

Hi Robert,This is a wonderful work !frame rate drops at file operation. Once a file is accessed then reading the size of 1 model or 10 models takes about the same load. Also for texture opening a lot of small texture files takes more time than 1 larger file containing all the smaller texture in 1. This will help to have 3D landscape and a good frame rate :-)The real story is that the supermodel in the Swiss scenery located in the final of the St.Stephan Airbase (part of the village and a wood factory) was designed by a MSFS autogen group (Pete and Johan Bigfoot) for FS9 Switzerland professional edition. I have converted the FS9 scenery using BGL2E in 1 evening and found the large supermodel - place it and looked at the result in FU3. The expected frame rate drop didn't occur and so the idea was born :-) http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/194080.jpgThis supermodel has a size of 63kb, keep in mind the size limit at about 140kb ! 5 material GIFs of 256x256 are used for this model only.There was an autogen project to build parts of Switzerland in 3D buildings and trees like Roberts work, now it's stalled and not ported to FSX... anyway I take my Switzerland flights with FU3 only but some hints from the FS groups are useful. :-wave Andre