Pilot discretion descent problem

[misgav 2]

I was flying my PSS A320 from Gatwick(EGKK) to LLBG. RC was on. FL was 290.After crossing Cyprus, Nicosia contol handed me over to Tel-aviv control.I was told to descend to 170. My next and last waypoint was SOLIN, about 80kms from LLBG. The conroller told me to be ready to cross 40mls from BGN VOR which sits smack on top of LLBG at 100/250kts.Crossing SOLIN , I started descending to 100, in time to make it 40mls from BGN as required. Here's where the contoller went ballistic. I got warning after warning to maintain 170. But there's no way I would get to BGN at 100 unless I started the descent after SOLIN.Anyways RC brought some guy from the FAA? with a severe reprimand for my bad behavior! Geez! give me a break guys.So how does one get around the above problem?Eytan

[ubersu 78]

One asks the controller for a lower altitude... basically your best strategy is to plan your own descent and to ask the controller for the appropriate altitudes at the proper distances. If you were told to descend to FS170 at pilot's discretion, and given no further instruction, you were expected to jolly well stay at that altitude.DJ

[misgav 2]

> basically>your best strategy is to plan your own descent and to ask the>controller for the appropriate altitudes at the proper>distances. >>DJSeems to me that would be like bypassing, as it were, an altitude insruction, by repeatedly asking for lower alts. Is this how it would be done in the real world? (seeing how RC is based on real world procedures).Eytan

[ubersu 78]

This is exactly how it is done in the real world - it is the pilot's job to aviate, navigate, and communicate. It is the controller's job to sequence traffic and resolve potential conflicts based on more knowledge of the overall traffic picture. They work together to keep things smooth. If you plan your descent carefully you really won't hear much from the controller except your clearance to the altitude requested (with a few programmatic twists that you'll soon recognize).DJ

[Guest mmcevilley]

>I was flying my PSS A320 from Gatwick(EGKK) to LLBG. RC was>on. FL was 290.>After crossing Cyprus, Nicosia contol handed me over to>Tel-aviv control.I was told to descend to 170. My next and>last waypoint was SOLIN, about 80kms from LLBG. The conroller>told me to be ready to cross 40mls from BGN VOR which sits>smack on top of LLBG at 100/250kts.>>Crossing SOLIN , I started descending to 100, in time to make>it 40mls from BGN as required. Here's where the contoller went>ballistic. I got warning after warning to maintain 170. But>there's no way I would get to BGN at 100 unless I started the>descent after SOLIN.>Anyways RC brought some guy from the FAA? with a severe>reprimand for my bad behavior! Geez! give me a break guys.>>So how does one get around the above problem?>>EytanEytan,If I'm following what you say correctly, this is not an issue with Pilot Discretion descent. But, something is amiss ...It is standard procedure for RC to have you level at 11000 or 12000, 40 nm from the destination. You instruction to be level at 10000/250kt 40 nm from BGN is correct. Once you are told to start down from 17000 to 10000 you *should not* be yelled at to maintain 17000.Can you refly the route and this time be sure to enable DEBUG prior to starting RC. Send the log to JD and he can check it out.-michael

[jd 57]

i'm afraid i'm confused. how can the next and last waypoint be SOLIN, AND your crossing restriction is based on BGN? where did BGN come from? it had to be in your .pln, if i used it as a reference to a crossing restriction.what was your rate of descent? greater than -100 ft/min?maybe we should look at your .plnand like michael says, a log would helplaunch rcv4click debugload the .plnclick start rcv4duplicate the problemand just for grins, save a .rcd file after you're told to descend to 170send me the .logjd