Gents, I went through Tim's excellent tutorial today. And I mangaged to scare the hell out of the passengers over Tennessee. Approaching 40 nm to the hold, both my engines failed. I don't know why and as I am still getting familiar with the bird, I can't give much info except... I am pretty sure I followed all Tim's instructions to this point. One thing I did notice was the center fuel tanks were dry at this point, although I don't know if they went dry well before this point or not. All my fuel pumps were on. Could it be I have to turn off the center fuel pumps once it is empty? Looking for any guesses as to why this would happen so I can execute it properly tonight. I actually did finish the flight successfully, and learned to restart engines mid-flight as well. I just turned the engine start switches to FLT, is that correct procedure? Or would I have to restart the APU in real life? I also forgot to re-arm the autothrottle after the engine failure causing some problems during descent in the form of O/S disconnect. But that too I learned to recover. Great tutorial Tim. Thanks. Mike Stinchfield

>Gents,> Approaching 40 nm to the hold, both my engines failed. I>don't know why and as I am still getting familiar with the>bird, I can't give much info except... I am pretty sure I>followed all Tim's instructions to this point. >> One thing I did notice was the center fuel tanks were dry>at this point, although I don't know if they went dry well>before this point or not. All my fuel pumps were on. Could>it be I have to turn off the center fuel pumps once it is>empty?Interesting - I think you should have still had fuel in the center tank if you fueled it in accordance with the tutorial. Also, you should have had all your fuel pumps on. What should have happened is that you should have started drawing fuel from the main (wing) tanks automatically when the center tank ran dry. This is a problem that I'm not sure is fixed yet - a search on "center tank ran dry" did not reveal any fixes - they're still working on it.> I actually did finish the flight successfully, and learned>to restart engines mid-flight as well. I just turned the>engine start switches to FLT, is that correct procedure? Or>would I have to restart the APU in real life? I also forgot>to re-arm the autothrottle after the engine failure causing>some problems during descent in the form of O/S disconnect. >But that too I learned to recover.Glad you recovered - the starter switches are used to restart ignition inflight in the FLT position. The QRH procedure for a two engine flameout is:start switches to FLT, start levers to CUTOFF for at least 3 secAfter EGT decrease, start levers to IDLE.HOWEVER, the NG is supposed to have auto relight/auto ignition from the EEC, even when the start switch is off (Bulfer cockpit companion, page 101). I think this is not simulated in the PMDG, however.

Tim,Thanks for the reply. I will fly again tonight and be extra careful in following all your instructions and I will keep a better eye on all the systems so I can give better feedback in case it happens again.Also thank you for the info on the in-flight restart. I need to get those Bulfer books eventually.Good Flying,Mike

I'll bet this tracks back to the roundoff problem I found in FS9's fuel handling. Think Mike proposed an excellent idea which was to simply lie to the system and have the Fuel warning lights come on when there is still 1000 in the center tank so people can switch the pumps off then instead of too late.It was noted that this rounding problem also happens in the default Microsoft aircraft so it will be a tough nut for PMDG to crack :(Ray

Tim, Ok, I think i have found a few reasons why this happened to me. Any comments I direct on the tutorial are meant as helpful feedback and by no means are they a criticism. PMDG-you should compensate Tim for the enhancement this makes to your product. Oh, I forgot, I guess you(Tim)do get 150K for every copy we downloaded. I just can't remember from what account I drew all that cash:|.1. On page 17 of the .pdf you tell us to set the center tank to 5760 lbs, or 20%. With this set, my center tank runs dry 44 miles short of BNA. I noticed however, in your screenshots, your center tank is sitting at 72XX when turning the corner at MYERZ? (pg-44) This might be the reason this did not happen to you?2. When the center tank runs dry, the engines do fail. This is with all my fuel pumps on. I quickly turned off the center fuel pumps (top 2 fuel pump switches, right?), switched starter switches to FLT, started left then right, and was able to start it up before any of my avionics failed. The engines then start pulling fuel from the wing tanks. But I do think this sounds like a bug like Ray was saying.Maybe this issue has been addressed elsewhere in the forum. I am sorry if I am rehashing old stuff. My Dial-up and I can only do limited forum travel :D.Best Regards.Mike

>1. On page 17 of the .pdf you tell us to set the center tank>to 5760 lbs, or 20%. With this set, my center tank runs dry>44 miles short of BNA. I noticed however, in your>screenshots, your center tank is sitting at 72XX when turning>the corner at MYERZ? (pg-44) This might be the reason this>did not happen to you?Hmm. I'll check it again - you're probably right.As for the engines flaming out, it's a bug they're trying to fix. There seems to be some consensus that it's do to the way the PMDG sim is faking out MSFS, you can run into a situation where no fuel is flowing (in the opinion of MSFS) even though it should be flowing.Tutorial Version 1.02 will mention to keep an eye on the center tank and shut the pumps down when it reaches 1000 LBS or less.Thanks for the good catch!

"HOWEVER, the NG is supposed to have auto relight/auto ignition from the EEC, even when the start switch is off (Bulfer cockpit companion, page 101)."Correct, Tim. According to the Maintenance Manual, both ignition systems will be activated if:1. The engine start lever is in the IDLE position, the engine speed decreases uncommanded or N2 is less than 57% and N2 is more than 50%. For this condition only, both ignition systems are energized for 30 seconds. (No reference is made to the position of the start switch, so I assume this means this will happen irrespective of its position)2. The engine start lever is in the IDLE position, the airplane is in flight, start switch is in the OFF position, N2 speed is less than idle, and N2 speed is more than 5% (which it should be with the engines windmilling).Cheers.IanP.S. (Edit) "OFF" is a safety position on the ground when the engines are not running ;-)