Hi all PMDG 737ng Pilots, Can someone please tell me the minimum distance that you can intercept the Loc at, and is the rule of thumb always speed 180, 3000, flaps 5 no matter what the distance?Thanks in advance.Keith Sandford

Keith,My own personal rule of thumb(not totally perfect) is to intercept loc at around 12-14nm, at airport altitude+2000ft at around 220-230kias. Once loc captured, reduce to 180/190kias depending on a/c weight(the fmc MUST be programmed correctly) and click the app button to arm glideslope capture. When g/s becomes active, gear down reduce to about 160kias-flaps 15 or 20. Once established, go down to a speed of v-ref +10 + any wind correction and appropriate flaps (as shown on the speed strip). If it's a strong x-wind, hand fly it. Read-read-read the manuals and try the tutorial flights a few dozen times. It will soon become instinct.

Approach charts will give you the final approach fix and altitude to be at. Just press APP and the second autopilot when on your way to the FAF. No need to press LOC first- just makes more work for you. The plane will just fly straight and level until intercepting the LOC and G/S, and the second AP won't actually turn on until that happens. In the Boeing CBT, this is what they say to do. This works for me everytime, and I just stare out the wing and watch the scenery go by.

Hi Keith,There is no hard and fast rule for how far out..it is traffic dependent as well as how much fun you want to have, conditions permitting of course.The normal profile for an approach is roughly the same as I laid out for DES .. about ALTx3=NM so you want to be around 3000' AFE at 10 miles. Now for the guns that like to have a little fun we do some Outer Marker lineups.. and this has you intercepting final at about 1600' and 5 miles... but is not for teh faint hearted and it is ESSENTIAL that you are stabilised on the ILS by 1000' in landing configuration or you will have to Go Around.In normal day to day ops we usually try for a nice relaxed approach configured at Flap5 though and this helps to keep the hair from going grey :DThe more I post here the more I think we should have an online chat sometime with all those interested in real world techniques. We could use Netmeeting perhaps in conjuction with a voice client such as Teamspeak, Ventrilo or some such. I will post this idea as a separate thread as well.Rgds,

If you want good practice, fly online, find a staffed center or approach airport, and you should get very close to real life procedures (and make the people like me with virtual TRACONs very happy). VATUSA controllers do need to use FAA procedures (within the limits of the simulated world) but it'll be really close as they have to pass written, oral and over the shoulder exams. And it's free. Just took me five days to get the software working, but it's well worth it. .The first thing you need as a pilot is to get the proper approach procedure (chart) for the ILS approach you're doing, as well as the general approach charts if available as these will detail the approach and departure gates in the airspace, and also provide minimums. The crossings (height + speed) will be spelled out on the chart for the class of aircraft you have, but also keep in mind that the ATC approach controller will normally vector you to make sure you're setup correctly to intercept and keep the proper separations from other traffic. This may deviate from what you see on the chart, but not by much. The approach plates normally correspond to the standard operating procedures for that airport. That includes being on a heading less than 30 degrees so you don't overshoot (20 degree intercept course is the norm) and place you at a distance and altitude below the g/s so you can intercept. You also need to know your a/c and the turn radius for current speed/weight.When configured properly, the FMC will give you the ideal descent regime / turn and line up, but in practice, ATC throws a huge kink in the system since the FMC doesn't know about other traffic, active traffic patterns for downwind, and if the weather changes during the approach, you may get a completely different runway and poof goes the carefully planed approach. You should not touch that APP or VOR/LOC button until you get your "cleared for the ILS approach". Working both sides of the equation as a virtual pilot and controller, I found that the FMC approach doesn't work well, but the moment you get cleared for the intercept, push that APP button. However, the FMC is very handy if you have to go around because it will let you fly the proper missed approach procedure so you do want that programmed in. You should normally get the r/w to expect first thing from the approach after your initial descent, which gives you ample time to reprogram as necessary.Regards,

Airlines may have limits on how late they are able to establish if it is an ILS app..i'm not sure?..at my local (EGNT) they can be vectored onto the ILS very late 5/6 dme at 1800ft >>on average in the UK it's at about 10 miles and speed 180kts then 160kts on the glide to 4dme. Altitude depends on how far you establish, it is a good idea to establish from below not above as you could end up on a false glide.

Thankyou all very much for the valuable info. I will now get myself some charts, won't make much sense to me though. Can I just confirm that you never press APP until you have captured the LOC?Keith Sandford

Keith my understanding of Etienne's post is you never press APP until you get your clearance from ATC. If you are not flying with ATC then this will not apply.My understanding of Christian post is that there is no need to press VOR/LOC before pressing APP, as the plane will fly straight and level until established.cheers, Nick

To clarify, you only engage APP when you have clearance, the reason being that APP will change your heading to intercept based on currently computed flight conditions (including the overshot if you're not less than 30 degrees if I read the PMDG AOM correctly).If you are flying on your own, you can engage APP whenever you want provided you're headed in the general direction of the intercept (90 degree or less). If you use VNAV and LNAV mode with the proper approach / ILS programmed into the FMC, that's really all you need to do.But sometimes, I have found out though that it tends to place you too close to the runway, causing you a missed approach. I personally like to fly manually for the intercept, and use the chart as a reference.It is very important to give yourself enough distance so you can approach the vertical glideslope from below, and the chart (usually at the bottom), will give you that distance. Free and current FAA charts are available in PDF format at the NACO web site:http://www.naco.faa.gov/index.asp?xml=naco/online/d_tpp