Basler BT67 Starting Problem

[RKillins 1]

I am finding it difficult to start both engines of the Basler BT67 (by Fuernkaess, Jahn, Metzger and Naegele).

 

I have followed the documentation, and am able to only ever get one of two engines started. I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

 

Engine start procedure:

• Set parking brakes

• Battery ON

• Ground Power disconnect

• NAV lights ON

• Beacon ON

• Passenger signs ON

• Check area clear

• Fuel pumps ON – check green light ON

• Ignition START

• Starting engine

• Condition lever FUEL CUTOFF
  
• Prop max RPM
  
• Push START button and hold
  
• When Ng above 10% set Condition Lever to LOW IDLE
  
• Check oil pressure rise and annunciator light extinguishing
  
• Check ITT not exceeding 800 °C
  

• Generator ON

• Avionics ON

After the engine has started, stabilize the RPM at about 1000 for warming up by pushing the condition

lever to maximum idle. Once warmed up, pull it back to low idle which should give you about 800 RPM.

 

I'm not sure if the line highlighted in blue from the documentation is a typo or not, but I have to have the condition on (opposite fuel cutoff)

 

With left engine started,

 

- right hand main pump on,

- right hand ignition start

- power lever at low idle

- press and hold the start button

 

.... just turns over and over .... Engine #2 PSI maxes at 53, and RPM 19. (Note: I understand this release features "tips" when you hover the mouse over areas in the control panel. This does not, and never has, worked for me.)

[CoolP 283]

To receive the tips, the FSX tooltip feature must be enabled.

 

As for the cutoff position, that's correct as it aims for having the levers at cutoff before starting the engine. You are looking for 10% rotation of the turbine parts before advancing the lever to allow the fuel to flow. Note that this is a FSX engine model based setup. There's no PT6A FCU in between to handle some more details.

 

By this, the method is to

set it (condition lever) to cutoff,

engage the starter and wait for 10% rotation,

then allow the fuel flow with setting the lever to low idle. Same for the other engine. I don't know why only the left one works for you though. :unsure:

 

Side note. I think the model features consequences to some extent. So setting the condition lever to low idle or higher too soon should lead to a hot start.

 

I've just checked if I could trigger the situation described by you. With only the left engine starting and the right one just turning. Nope. They both come up and the tooltips just offered the normal tips like 'check fuel' or 'open condition lever' and things. My guess is that getting those tooltips to work may help you then.

[RKillins 1]

Thanks CoolP for your reply. I'm not all up yet on the jargon ... so excuse my ignorance if I seem to be seeking further explanation of the obvious.

 

I use the Saitek Pro Yoke system with the three levers, black, blue and red from left to right. The controls operate both L & R engines simulatenously, so I wonder if I need to operate the L & R controls independent of each other, one at a time rather than together with the Saitek controls?

 

So, to recap ...

 

Condition lever (red ... right) in cutoff position.

Wait for 10% rotation ... which is indicated by torque? (gauge and control panel indicator)

Fuel Flow setting (black lever ... left) to idle. Does the condition lever remain in the cutoff position at that point still, or is it advanced?

[CoolP 283]

No problem with the jargon. My fault actually since one can get really used to using some 'common' phrases and acronyms. :blush:

 

so I wonder if I need to operate the L & R controls independent of each other

At least for the startup phase, I'd say so. Actually, that's how I use my controls. So while in that startup phase, incorporating the fact that you start one engine after the other, you should operate the condition lever (the rightmost set) one by one.

 

Regarding the levers, I think there's some mixup. Since we are on a turbine plane, you have a set of power levers (yellow), prop (blue) and condition (red).

The power lever is self-explanatory I think (it has a few specials though, e.g. for beta range), the prop lever sets the prop rpm and enables the feathering and the condition lever handles the fuel flow. The latter being a rough description and shouldn't be mixed up with the mixture lever from piston engined planes. It does not set a mixture on those turbine engines.

 

Side note. If you read things like low and hi idle, this mainly refers to what that lever commands to the fuel control unit (FCU) on a real engine like the PT6A (which is the one on the Basler). The result will be a different value for the idle rpm. For us simmers, this comes into play when taxiing for example. Set the condition to low and she will barely move. Set it to high and you can taxi without even touching the power lever. It should also affect the way you can establish reverse thrust after landing.

 

The 10% value you are looking for is the Ng part, the percentage for the rpm of the gas turbine. I've highlighted the gauges in this shot. Note. The shot was taken with both engines already running stable.

If the starter has established 10% Ng (the pointer will be at the '1' then), you can move the condition lever to the low idle state. The fuel flow will be allowed and the engine will start as ignition sets in with all the consequences on the sound and e.g. the prop rpm now rising.

 

You can leave all the other levers as they were before. The prop should be full forward and the power lever at idle. So that's were the VC operation of the levers comes in since one condition lever now is at low idle while the second one, from the engine not running, still resides at cutoff.

 

After having started both engines, you can use your hardware levers again unless you wanted to achieve asymmetrical thrust for taxi or crosswind ops. Then you would need two 'throttles'.

[RKillins 1]

Awesome reply CoolP. Thanks for taking the time to explain and demonstrate with the pics. Very much appreciated. Happy to say I got flying, and with two engines! The trick was using the condition levers independently.

[CoolP 283]

:dance: Good news!

[RKillins 1]

Still struggling with starting this bird.

My biggest issue is getting fuel to the engines. Both left and right main pumps are on, the two standby pumps are auto. The two standby pump lamps are illuminated green ... but I am unable to get green lights for the fuel supply to the left and right engines. Condition levers are at 2%, left throttle is at low idle, 2% also. Propeller is 100%.

 

I have lots of fuel.

 

Engine will not start with the starter engaged.

 

Obviously I am missing a critical step.