More lame excuse

[WebbPA 0]

Having read the "lame excuse" thread I felt compelled to address another issue but did not want to go off topic in that thread. I want to address the quality of payware products vs. that of freeware, and, hence, why the substantial payware market exists. Quite simply, payware has usually been professionally designed and adequately tested, while freeware seems to suffer from a lack thereof.This post will discuss freeware authors who feel compelled to release files that have obviously withstood minimal beta testing.Please do not get me wrong. I like freeware (for obvious reasons) and I have minimal payware because I think the default MS aircraft and available quality freeware, if tweaked properly, can provide a lifetime of simming experience. I tweak most, if not all, of my freeware aircraft but I can not upload the improvements because one or another gauge or bitmap is copyrighted. I try to do my part by sharing my work privately (and I put in a substantial amount of time tweaking the work of others) and participating in this and other fora. I just uploaded a major panel improvement to a developer who will distribute it as freeware because I didn't want to be hassled with copyright issues.I keep perhaps 5-10% of the freeware I download. Why? Because it's garbage. Fortunately I know enough about programming to keep the good portions and dump the garbage.When you upload a file that contains a good graphic model and lousy flight dynamics and panel I'm only going to keep 1/3 of it. If you plan to release, for example, an F-15 (or a 747 or an Airbus - it doesn't matter), I would like you to consider a few things:1. Give me a (performance-wise) realistic visual model. Just because your AC looks great on your 3Ghz machine does not mean it will generate more than 5 FPS on my 1Ghz.2. Give me a realistic flight dynamic model. I don't want my F-15 to handle like a garbage truck at anything less than 300 KIA.3. Give me a decent panel. This is my biggest rant since I don't know how to program flight dynamics but I know how to program panels. Too many "includes panel" look like you spent 60 hours on the visual and flight model and 60 minutes on the panel. It doesn't matter how good or "photorealistic" it looks if it's missing basic components. YOU DON'T HAVE TO INCLUDE A PANEL. There are plenty of others out there. If you have a good visual and/or dynamic model don't feel compelled to include a panel.4. Include your gauges! If you're using anything other than MS default gauges. This should be obvious.I know I'm just saying "Gimmee, gimmee" and I'm going to be flamed for demanding something for nothing. So I will offer myself for beta testing of pretty much anything that can be uninstalled and won't mess with my system files. Remember, YOUR name is on those uploads.In summary, I hope to offer constructive criticism along with this rant. I appreciate the work the freeware developers have done and I know from personal experience that it is time consuming. But, please, just because you're giving it away doesn't mean you should cut corners.

[Guest danowat]

Hi,You have a choice, download it or don't, no one is forcing you to, you are asking way to much from freeware.It is dicussions like this that force freeware users to go to payware."I keep perhaps 5-10% of the freeware I download. Why? Because it's garbage", Yeah well thats your opinion, keep it to yourself.Do you know how much work people put into these creations?.If you get some freeware you dont like then delete it, it has not cost anything, why bash someones work because of your perception of a good addon.Freeware authors owe you nothing, they do not have to give anything you say, they do it for a hobby, if you want all of your points you need to buy more payware, you can expect to get what you want from them.In the time I have spent downloading freeware, I have got a feel for the developers work that suits me, and I know I will like.In the meantime stop bashing freeware, leave it alone, leave it to people who apreciate the hard work people put into making great addons to enhance our simmingDan.

[Guest]

I think he knows that freeware authors don't owe him anything, he is simply explaining his personal views/feelings. It is a free world and constructive criticism is not a crime.

[Guest pez_man]

Yep, of course we all get disappointed sometimes, but it's fairly easy to remove the freeware you don't like from the system. And if I don't like it someone else probably will!! I myself am really grateful for all the freeware stuff out there. Both for the stuff I like, and for the stuff I don't! /fredrik

[Guest danowat]

Yeah well there is constructive critism, and there is saying that 90% of freeware is crap, because he does not like its panel/model/FDE.Dan

[John_Cillis 2,406]

I think this should be posted in the MSFS forum--it would have invited more discussion. I think what I want to add is that I feel many don't understand freeware and judge it a bit too harshly.There are many professional quality freeware designers--they invite (well, some invite) comment and feedback on their work. But a large number are amateurs. They have no means of testing, no means of benchmarking their work, no means of anything other than a desire to contribute something--anything, to get attention drawn to themselves as contributors to the hobby. I feel it better to humor them, rather than make someone out there wonder whether their work is worthless, because it didn't have a top notch model, or FDE, or panel. A lot of people right now are wondering if their work falls into that 90-95 pct. category that gets trashed.Thus, I don't think it right to criticize them to such a degree, or tell them not to release a panel or FDE 'coz it doesn't meet our standards. If it meets theirs, and they are comfortable with it, then they have the right to share it. We have the right to delete it, and show the courage to swallow our ego and not trash those efforts. I qualify that by saying that incomplete packages, or packages compiled from others work as original work--those are two pet peeves I have with freeware and payware authors. But of the many packages I've downloaded here, I'd say less than five percent are incomplete--and I catch the compiled work at first glance.We all know that there is some freeware that just isn't up to par. But some are motivated out of a desire to feel like they added to the hobby. I know that's what motivates me, and I fall into the amateur category. I usually have to post several releases of my work, as I don't have the luxury of a testing team, nor the time to test something to death. A large part of my job is testing. In addition to our WAN, I manage my company's automated testing solutions, and we've deployed Winrunner, Compuware, and other testing tools--full time coding if you're familiar with such tools. But I leave my job at work, and when I am home, I'm just another amateur freeware tinkerer/programmer, trying to get something out all by myself, that will do what I expect of it.Zach is right--people have a right to share their opinions. I just shared mine, and I've tried to direct it at the theme, and not the author of the thread. Comments?-John

[Guest]

>In the meantime stop bashing freeware, leave it alone, leave>it to people who apreciate the hard work people put into>making great addons to enhance our simmingDan,John isn't "bashing freeware," so much as expressing his frustrations about stuff that's incomplete, or otherwise suffers from major flaws.As a freeware and payware developer, I put the same degree of effort into all my projects; were that not so, my payware efforts would suffer accordingly.For all those who wish to release some project or another, there's a wonderful place known as the "Aircraft and Panel Design Forum" right here at Avsim.com where that person can easily have his/her offering vetted through a peer review process. If they were to do so, the quality of all freeware that's been through this process would improve significantly.Of course, there are always those who're satisfied to have oats that've been through the horse already, but I frankly prefer fresh oats! :)BillAVSIM OmbudsmanFounder and Director,Creative Recycling of Aircraft Partshttp://catholic-hymns.com/frbill/FS2002/images/fartslogo.jpg