Howdy, I've got a question concerning options for special procedures, such as SAR, and grid type patterns over specific waypoints. Is there a way to currently do this easily in LNM, or is it a manual method? If not, would it be possible to add this into LNM? I feel it would help with doing reconnaissance type missions, and simulating SAR missions. Thanks.

Josh

39 minutes ago, Josh M said:

Is there a way to currently do this easily in LNM, or is it a manual method?

Every procedure can be written in LNM - simply you add  to flight plan all waypoints you want and you'll get any procedure you need.
Waypoints can be chosen to get a form of grid, polygon, triangle, etc. -  whatever it's necessary.
I've used this simple method  during all online (IVAO) Special Operation Tours (and not only) that I participated in 🙂 

Regards,
Piotr

59 minutes ago, ppgas said:

Every procedure can be written in LNM - simply you add  to flight plan all waypoints you want and you'll get any procedure you need.
Waypoints can be chosen to get a form of grid, polygon, triangle, etc. -  whatever it's necessary.
I've used this simple method  during all online (IVAO) Special Operation Tours (and not only) that I participated in 🙂 

Regards,
Piotr

Oh sweet. I need to figure out how to get these grids based off of ONE waypoint made. (so have inputted a waypoint, then can select an option for a type of procedure to do there, wether a grid, arc, etc).

Josh

For drawing a grid on the map simply use measure distance tool , then choose waypoints on the drawed grid 🙂
If you want to draw an arc it's much harder to get - it's necessary approximate this via short lines, LNM hasn't got separate tool for drawing an arc.

Regards,
Piotr

Cool. I'll take a look and see how this works for me. Thanks!

Josh

There is also another option - new flight plan from description and  grid as sequences of coordinates.
It's more exactly method than drawing, although it's necessary calculate coordinates before.

Regards,
Piotr

1 hour ago, ppgas said:

There is also another option - new flight plan from description and  grid as sequences of coordinates.
It's more exactly method than drawing, although it's necessary calculate coordinates before.

Regards,
Piotr

So like if I had a route, then just input? please explain a bit more 🙂

Josh

Do you know what is mathematical  raster?
Every node in grid can be written as a pair of coordinates, so it's enough to write sequences of such coordinates as a pattern to fly.
Under LNM it's possible to enter whole sequence by menu FlightPlan/NewFlightPlanFromDescription (<ctrl><shft><N>).

If exist any flight plan, this option takes this and put into NewFlightPlanFromDescription as a sequence of points, 
then it's enough copy&paste own pattern and put it between points where it's necessary.

The main problem of this solution is that NewFlightPlanFromDescription option accepts only waypoints as 9 digits figure (4digits for latitude, 5 for longitude so only degrees and minutes),
so if your grid nodes can be average every 1NM** (because 1 minute of latitude is always 1NM, **on the other hand length of 1 minute of longitude depend on latitude), it's all you need to do. 
1NM gives about 6000ft raster grid.

If you need better precision you can manually choose  points on the map. Waypoints still are displayed under NewFlightPlanFromDescription as 9 digits figures but their coordinates are written in system/flight plane as degrees, minutes and seconds up to 1/100th of arc second. 1/100th of latitude arc second gives precision ~1ft raster grid.

My method is preparing/calculating grid in spreadsheet (using reverse Haversine and Vincenty's formulae), write this to CSV and convert to X-Plane format.
Then it's necessary to add this to the flight plan.
The main problem is you can't insert this to the new flight plan as you want, only attach operation is possible.
So I split old flight plan into two separate parts, then load first part, attach calculated grid points, attach second part and get complete flight plan with pattern/grid area.

 

That's all 🙂

 

Regards,
Piotr

[edit]
ps. don't forget to add STAY/ designator in route field and STAYINFO/ designator in section 18 (remarks) of flight plan to get real world flight plan compatible with ICAO2012 requirements.
For example, it can be: 
-route field (item 15 of FP) DDDD DCT ......... point_of_SAR_operations   STAY1/0200  point_of_SAR_operations DCT ...... AAAA
-remark field  (item 18 of FP) ..STS/SAR... STAYINFO1/Search and rescue operation

where:
DDDD - departure aerodrome, AAAA - arrive/destination aerodrome;
point_of_SAR_operations - place where we do SAR operations;
STS/SAR - SAR status of given operation;
STAY1/0200 - first place in flight plan where aircraft perform special task by 2 hours (can be also STAY2/xxyy, ...... STAYn/xxyy );
STAYINFO1/Search and rescue operation - description for the STAY1 place.

More about real world flight plans you can find on Eurocontrol pages, for example here is info about STAY/STAYINFO: http://www.nm.eurocontrol.int/STATIC/docs/pdf/OI-19-123.pdf

Edited April 11, 20215 yr by ppgas

Cool. I'll try this some

6 hours ago, ppgas said:

Do you know what is mathematical  raster?
Every node in grid can be written as a pair of coordinates, so it's enough to write sequences of such coordinates as a pattern to fly.
Under LNM it's possible to enter whole sequence by menu FlightPlan/NewFlightPlanFromDescription (<ctrl><shft><N>).

If exist any flight plan, this option takes this and put into NewFlightPlanFromDescription as a sequence of points, 
then it's enough copy&paste own pattern and put it between points where it's necessary.

The main problem of this solution is that NewFlightPlanFromDescription option accepts only waypoints as 9 digits figure (4digits for latitude, 5 for longitude so only degrees and minutes),
so if your grid nodes can be average every 1NM** (because 1 minute of latitude is always 1NM, **on the other hand length of 1 minute of longitude depend on latitude), it's all you need to do. 
1NM gives about 6000ft raster grid.

If you need better precision you can manually choose  points on the map. Waypoints still are displayed under NewFlightPlanFromDescription as 9 digits figures but their coordinates are written in system/flight plane as degrees, minutes and seconds up to 1/100th of arc second. 1/100th of latitude arc second gives precision ~1ft raster grid.

My method is preparing/calculating grid in spreadsheet (using reverse Haversine and Vincenty's formulae), write this to CSV and convert to X-Plane format.
Then it's necessary to add this to the flight plan.
The main problem is you can't insert this to the new flight plan as you want, only attach operation is possible.
So I split old flight plan into two separate parts, then load first part, attach calculated grid points, attach second part and get complete flight plan with pattern/grid area.

 

That's all 🙂

 

Regards,
Piotr

[edit]
ps. don't forget to add STAY/ designator in route field and STAYINFO/ designator in section 18 (remarks) of flight plan to get real world flight plan compatible with ICAO2012 requirements.
For example, it can be: 
-route field (item 15 of FP) DDDD DCT ......... point_of_SAR_operations   STAY1/0200  point_of_SAR_operations DCT ...... AAAA
-remark field  (item 18 of FP) ..STS/SAR... STAYINFO1/Search and rescue operation

where:
DDDD - departure aerodrome, AAAA - arrive/destination aerodrome;
point_of_SAR_operations - place where we do SAR operations;
STS/SAR - SAR status of given operation;
STAY1/0200 - first place in flight plan where aircraft perform special task by 2 hours (can be also STAY2/xxyy, ...... STAYn/xxyy );
STAYINFO1/Search and rescue operation - description for the STAY1 place.

More about real world flight plans you can find on Eurocontrol pages, for example here is info about STAY/STAYINFO: http://www.nm.eurocontrol.int/STATIC/docs/pdf/OI-19-123.pdf

Another thing that would be cool is something like in firelight: in there, I can select any waypoint, then a procedure based on that waypoint (SAR grid with leg lengths and spacing, etc). This is more of what I'm hinting at being able to do. I'll look at these manual methods too for now. Thanks.

Josh

Another question...

Is there a way to duplicate waypoints selected to duplicate a waypoint pattern?

4 hours ago, Josh M said:

Is there a way to duplicate waypoints selected to duplicate a waypoint pattern?

 

Only manually.
Under LNM use <ctrl><shft><N>, then whole route should be displayed under NewFlightPlanFromDescription window, highlight&copy&paste the part you need to duplicate 🙂

Regards,
Piotr
 

Ah ok. Yeah II wanted to duplicate like 4 waypoints and move them at once vs individually for extending a grid pattern. Thanks.

Josh

Quickest way to add waypoints to a flight plan is to press Ctrl+Alt and then click into the map. Shift+Alt and click appends waypoint at the end of the plan.

Alex

4 hours ago, albar965 said:

Quickest way to add waypoints to a flight plan is to press Ctrl+Alt and then click into the map. Shift+Alt and click appends waypoint at the end of the plan.

Alex

Yeah, I got that figured out, more looking for my best method to duplicate a series of waypoints for duplicating a pattern without manually adding more one by one. Currently using that method but thee former would be really nice.

Josh