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Two simple questions

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To all of you:1) can (must) i use speed brakes for long time during descent for mantaining a specific airspeed? Or maybe i have to brake from time to time?2) how can i get a reference (distance) when landing on a ILS/GS Rwy w/o DME and w/o any VOR-NDB stations around?Thanks a lotLuigi ;-)

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use throttle to control descent rate, your pitch should stay at a steady angle until thresshold when you pitch up to break contact and the yuo can use spoilerons. They are used in descent to loose hieght that is all, don't ajust pitch.Clod

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Use the GPS for distance reference when there is nothing else available.Pete

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or fly VFR until you intersect the ILS. For more of a challenge fly VFR to an airport that doesn't have ILS.David

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Airbrakes are a secondary flight control and if you plan your descents properly you should not need them. Like someone else said use power to control the descent. Pull power back keep the nose attitude the same and she will descend. The more you pull power the greater the descent rate. If you find yourself too close to the field and still high then use the airbrakes to increase descent rate until you get down where you need to be. You still don't have to change pitch while using the airbrakes unless you are in an emergency descent. Ken

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ClodHere we go again :-(In a jet you will kill yourself if you try to control descent rate with power.Pitch controls descent rate power controls speed unless you are flying a glider or underpowered aircraft where you need to subsidise your lack of power by using gravity.And no we are not going to start another 100 post thread with his oneI thought we had sorted it last time around ;-)Peter

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>Pitch controls descent rate power controls speed unless you >are flying a glider or underpowered aircraft where you need >to subsidise your lack of power by using gravity. PeterThats the way I descend because it just makes sense (not to mention it works). Why am I always hearing the opposite?David

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Yup............. After that 100+ thread, I'm going to use what ever I want! If I want to quickly dive down under the Golden Gate bridge, then I'm most likly going to use "pitch". If the speed builds too much, then I'll decrease power.On the other hand, if I'm low & slow to the airport runway & I'm running out of altitude, then "power" is what's going to save my altitude problem before dealing with elevator (pitch).Guess I'll use what ever method that fit's the application instead of some either/or rules that will be debated from here to eternity!! :)L.AdamsonP.S.--------- If you have to think about pitch/power theory before acting, you're in for a "heap" of trouble!!! :-lol :-lol :-lol

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>Thats the way I descend because it just makes sense (not to >mention it works). Why am I always hearing the opposite? >It's one of the GREAT debates......... including "what causes lift" & which comes first-------- the chicken or the egg! :)L.Adamson

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LuigiReal world speed brakes are avoided if possible because they make a noise (passengers)and are usually a reflection of poor descent speed control.In Piston aircraft speed brakes are useful descending from altitude as they allow you to carry some power with a fairly high descent rate.Throttling back would cause shock cooling of the engines.Aircraft like the Malibu Mirage benefit from speed brakes for that reason.With the majority of aircraft if you plan your descent you shouldnt need to use speed brakes.an ILS without dme will have outer and middle markers.the outer marker is located at between 4 and 7 miles from the runway end.The middle marker is located at descision height point.If you check the approach plate it will show the distance of these markers and the altitude you should cross them at.Sometimes there will be an NDB used as a marker on an ILS and these with their distances will also be shown on your approach plate.Peter

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An autopilot does a far better job than a pilot and the autopilot always uses pitch for descent rate.If I handfly an aircraft jet or multiprop down from altitide I will use trim to fine tune my descent and control speed with power.In underpowered or light aircraft you can get in a situation where drag (induced or from flaps gear etc)becomes too much for the power available and you will have use good old kinetic energy by running the ship downhill.For me Pitch controls descent rate Power controls speed. If you want to read both sides of the arguement we had a 100 post thread here a couple of months back :-)Peter

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>>Pitch controls descent rate power controls speed unless you >are flying a glider or underpowered aircraft where you need >to subsidise your lack of power by using gravity. >Don't know why I didn't think of this the last time around?:If I was in a dog-fight & my opponent was a few hundred yards ahead & then quickly dove............... would I pull back power to dive & loose altitude? Of course NOT! I would quickly push the stick forward, which in this case is "pitch for altitude (or loss of)". If at the same time, I was gaining to quickly on him & not wanting to shoot past him, then I'd pull back power which is now "power= speed". Peter---- you & I win!! No farther debate! :-lol L.Adamson ----- "no set rules"

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LarryYup :-) Power and Power always controls speed whether from the good old engine or derived from the kinetic variety.I dont care whether you have Barn door flaps GI normous induced drag an undercarriage like an elephant!enough POWER and you will blast to the heavens undercarriage, barn door flaps and all :-)Its when you dont have enough power that you have to borrow a eenzie weenie bit by rolling the ship downhill ;-)Peter (proud to be a POWER FOR SPEED GUY)

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All those power equals altitude guys/gals must be 172 drivers! :)But then there is all them California/ U.K. pilots who don't think you ever need mixture control except to "kill" the engine after landing!.... he,he :)L.Adamson

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>If I was in a dog-fight & my opponent was a few hundred >yards ahead & then quickly dove............... would I pull >back power to dive & loose altitude? Of course NOT! I would >quickly push the stick forward, which in this case is "pitch >for altitude (or loss of)". If at the same time, I was >gaining to quickly on him & not wanting to shoot past him, >then I'd pull back power which is now "power= speed". LarryIf you did that ("quickly push the stick forward") in a modern fighter it would feel like your stomach was trying to enter your mouth due to negative G's. The correct manuveur would be to roll upside down and pull back on the stick. This way you'd be pulling positive G's and would also be able to keep your opponent in sight.David

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