Miracle

No worries, i'm still in the place :) As a community leader and forum admin too (in a completly different domain), i just wanted to thanks as i'd like anyone to do with me. Cedric.

Hi, A little presentation. Like many of us, i'm a fan of all that can fly since the childhood. FS player of the early version, i play many of the jane's sim too when i was a teen. But Sim is a very demanding hobby and my job let me no time. I allways desire to fly again (virtualy and for real) so i buy FSX 3 years ago. But, again, i was too busy to open the box :) Now, i have 36 and i decide to play more seriously, so i install the the game nine month ago and begin to collect informations step after step and begin to aquire addons and hardware (a huuudge enterprise because of the pletoric offer ), progressing slowly to a better and most realistic virtual experience. I open an AVSIM account 1 week ago and was very surprised of the popularity of my very first post. Ok, I don't know about it, but it seem i touched a sensitive subject and expose my opinion so clumsy with my broken English and i want to apologyse for that. But i did not expect such an avalanche ! One member used the term "shark feeding frenzy", very well resumed ! I was a little hurt to see that most of the answers was non-constructive sarcastics hight minded comment. I did not think that flight sim was so elitist despite the abusive use of emoticons and "lol" in the answers. Spite of everything, I got answers very useful for my understanding from members who took the time to exchange information and point of view. So thanks you. Alan Bradbury Geoff Ambrose Ryan Maziarz from the PMDG support (thanks you, you give me a very valuable answer, if i had know i asked you first). Robert S. Randazzo for closing the thread at the right time;) And all the other guy that talk to me with respect. Cheer. Cedric.

Correct, I don't talk about maneuverability but "weight" or "Mass" = "inertia" or "motion change resistance" Here's the physic. Cedric.

Thanks Sandpatch for this valuable information. Happy to see that this forum is very active :) Does someone give a test to the 737 POSKY ? I will be happy to have feedback. I just test the POSKY 747-400 with the latest FDE available. Same feeling when i land the beast compare to the default 747 from fsx. Using Ezdok camera, you really feel the weight of the plane, it's very pleasant. (I don't own the PMDG 747-400 but i project to buy it soon) As an enginer, i have a lot of interrest for technics too. Does someone give a look at this ? http://www.mudpond.o...Wrench_main.htm This tool can edit the .air file that configure plane FDE and provide a lot of information and graphics on the plane performances. I compare the .air file of the default FSX 737, the POSKY and the PMDG. Most of the value of the POSKY and the PMDG are very close (Plane Specifications) Some value are very differents (ex: the POSKY gear drag is twice the value of the PMDG). Understand this file, even with this tool is very very technical and far from my humble comprehension. Maybee not the good place to talk about. Just my Tow cent again. Cedric.

Okay, Thanks for your answer. About the previous post I think you point something interresting. It's a story of "feeling" If a real 737 pilot can tell me wich flight model best reproduce the real "feeling". Does someone have try the POSKY 737 ? What do you think about the FDE and the inertia feeling it provide ? Anyway, i just do something crazy. I have replace the B737-900.air file of the PMDG with the POSKY one. It seem to work ! The plane have more inertia and react slower ! Of course doing something like this is totaly unsupported by PMDG but i'm a cowboy ! It seem to have no impact on the trust reverser but as you say, it seem that the CFM56 provide a lot of brake, so i'm ok with that. Cedric.

Thanks for this answer. Did you say the same thing about the trust reverser ?

Thanks for this fair answer :) Again, i don't doubt of the very hight quality of PMDG product (the best i ever seen). All the avionic system is reproduced with a realism level never reach. But as they say, they create a product that can be use by hardcore simmer and by newbies as simple as "push the throthle and go". My question is about the reaction of the plane. Here the FAQ from the POSKY 737 FDE designer. I think this guy is not someone who doesn't know what he talk about. I just put the point that are very different beteween the PMDG FDE (and default FSX 737) and the POSKY. Flight Dynamics, Scenario, Effects Designer Warren C. Daniel Flight model based on a full-flight training simulator used for pilots of a particular airline carrier, 737-700, -800, -900 data, as well as full-motion FAA simulator experience. Q) The FDE is much harder to fly than before. The plane is more difficult to handle. What happened? A) After spending time in DC-10, 737, 747-400, 757, 767, and 777 Level D simulators, I realized that the performance for the previous generation of FDEs was there, however, I grossly underestimated the actual “feel” of large aircraft. In large commercial airliners the control surfaces are effective, however, the sheer mass and inertia of the plane cause delays in how quickly the aircraft reacts to inputs. To date, all FDEs I have flown (including my own) have failed to capture this critical element – inertia. This new generation of FDEs is designed to show the average flight simmer exactly how difficult it is to fly a large aircraft, particularly in adverse weather or emergency conditions. I have flown small aircraft, Level D simulators, and have been designing FDEs for nearly 10 years now. I can confidently say now, THIS is how the real aircraft FEELS and PERFORMS. I feel I have captured about 95% of how the actual aircraft feels in a Commercial Level D simulator and actual flight. The remaining 5% I could not capture are things such as airframe vibration through wing flap (fueled wings which are off-center have quite a lot of inertia of their own) and control surface slip (first the control surfaces “bite” into the air, then they begin to move the aircraft after some point in time– this feeling is difficult to mimic without an actual motion sim, although I have added more “slip). The control surfaces are heavy, but effective. If you actually take the time and LOOK at a large aircraft, you will notice the control surface, say an aileron, has only a small surface area in relation to the rest of the plane. These surfaces must “push” the aircraft in the desired direction. As in the actual aircraft, you will find yourself often “overcompensating” and correcting when you fly manually until you become used to the feel. If you find the aircraft a challenge to fly, imagine an engine out emergency, landing in gusty or side wind conditions, or on wet/icy runways. My goal is to show you what an actual commercial pilot experiences. Q) But the controls are SO heavy. Are you sure this is right? A) The control surfaces require 45 – 55 lbs of force to move the yoke, control wheel and rudders. This new generation of FDEs places emphasis on both performance AND feel. I am not trying to make a video game – I’m designing flight simulator dynamics. Q) It’s hard to stop. Reverse thrust is very un-effective. How do I stop more effectively? A) The majority of stopping power when landing is from the brakes. The thrust reversers do almost nothing to stop the airplane. Set your auto brakes to position 2 on initial decent, but don’t be afraid to use position 3. On shorter fields and higher gross weights, it may be necessary to use position 4 or max braking. Q) The thrust reversers are very ineffective. I can’t stop? Is this right? A) The thrust reversers are very ineffective. 80% of the stopping power actually comes from the wheel brakes. Q) When I taxi, I can’t turn. What’s wrong? A) You must slow down to 30 knots for high speed turnoff taxiways, 8 to 12 knots for 90 degree turns, and about 3 - 5 knots for turns over 120 degrees. Basically, the maximum turn angle of the 737NG nose gear is 78 degrees. Slip causes you to only achieve 75 degrees of effective steering. Attempting to turn at higher speeds will result in tire rollover and push, resulting in the airplane still going straight ahead. ... To conclude, i'm not very satisfied with answer like. "LOL LOL LOL ... Don't say B..S.., PMDG is the best addon, nothing more to say !" I don't say that PMDG is a bad product, it's the best addon i ever buy. I just ask about the flight model that is very close of the default FSX 737. I talk to other simer and they say to me that the Wico 737 addon react the same way that the POSKY, but i don't own this addon. Cheer Cedric.

Hello, Waaa I did not expect to have many answers. I'm happy to bring some laught here even if the large part of the comments are little sarcastics and not very constructives. Anyway, it is true that my post is a bit clumsy and has a troll flavor. Compare the PMDG as a cesna is exagerated, it seem that this kind of humor is not usual among hardcore simers community :) I'm just a Sunday pilot and I never fly a real 737 (only fixed base simulator). I have no doubt that the PMDG developers know what they do. However, the fact is, there is a significant difference between the 737 POSKY and PMDG. For exemple, the POSKY is heavier to maneuver and reverse trust is less effective. In the absence of feedback from a real 737 pilot, i ask for arguments to say what is the most realistic model. From my readings, the designer of the POSKY FDE have over 10 years experience in this field. According to him, he reproduces 95% of the real 737 reaction and this FDE was validated by real pilots. If you have any real arguments I'm interested ! Cedric.

Hi, I love the PMDG 737, it's a great product. Unfortunaly, i found the flight model unrealistic. I use to fly with the POSKY 737, and the command latence is more realistic and more representative of airline weight. When you push the yoke, you have to wait some delay because of the weight of the plane. The PMDG is more close of the FSX default 737 Flight Dynamics Engine... it's like land with a Cesna :) Any way to ask developper to ehance the FDE ? Any way to modify PMDG file or to merge it with POSKY FDE ? Thanks. Ced