dever23b

Silly me; I didn't even realize there was a ticket system. I thought the forum was the support mechanism. My apologies! I've created a ticket as requested, 969-SQ3-2GZJ.

I'm not sure if you were referring to the first result there (which, for me, was FSX crashes every time I shutdown) or the 75,000 results from that google search... but I did read that first thread. Unfortunately, none of the solutions seemed to apply to me. Although exhausting all of the suggestions in that thread did not yield any successful results, the suggestion to change to a default aircraft prior to exiting gave me an idea. When I tried to switch aircraft, I determined that the crash actually occurs when attempting to unload the PMDG aircraft, rather than when the flight is terminated (I experienced the crash when attempting to load a default B737). Using this information, I decided to try my luck monitoring the FS process and then debugging the crash. That's when I discovered that I was mistaken when I told you I'd disabled all addons. I forgot about a custom gauge I use. For this, I'm very sorry. I believe I've discovered how you can reproduce my crash. I have an old addon called Airport Chart Gauge, developed a very long time ago by Holger Maass. The addon works by itself, as does FS2Crew in absence of the APChart gauge. When the gauge is loaded, and FS2Crew's voice feature is activated, FS crashes. I saved the last activity information from Process Monitor, and the call stack from Visual Studio, but it's a rather large text dump for a forum post; I'd be happy to upload the information somewhere if you'd like. As I mentioned, the crash only occurs once FS2Crew's voice feature has been activated. When FS2Crew is in button mode, there is no conflict. I also attempted to switch FS2Crew back to button mode, after enabling voice, prior to ending the flight; this did not work either: once voice mode has been activated, FS is doomed. Please let me know if this helps track the bug down.

Bryan: I tried your suggestion regarding the "HS" toggle, and also verified that the "LK" toggle was disengaged prior to attempting to exit FS; unfortunately, it did not resolve the issue. I haven't done any overclocking. It seems like FS hangs before it crashes... almost as if it's hanging on something (maybe its children to exit?), and then it reaches a timeout and crashes. Could there be an issue with FS2Crew unloading (or, more specifically, failing to unload)? This crash doesn't seem to occur until FS2Crew is installed and activated in the sim, so I'm really struggling to find any other causal factor. I haven't overclocked, nor done anything fancy with my fsx.cfg. The only tweaks I'm aware of to my fsx.cfg were done during my installs of a few airport sceneries (I'm not sure if I'm allowed to list other products). However, the crash started happening before I purchased those scenery products, so I doubt any fsx.cfg changes they made resulted in the crash. I also don't use any of the ENBseries hacks. Is there a debug mode I can run with FS2Crew to get you additional log details or something? I understand the difficulty of attempting to find a problem you can't reproduce, but I'd really appreciate if you could make an attempt to help me-- or at least guide me in how to get you better data --rather than simply blame my system and say the product works perfectly. I'm certainly not trying to shame your product; I think it's fantastic and I'm very grateful for you developing it, but I'm having trouble with it and just want some help. I see that there's many reasons why FS might crash, but clearly it has something to do with FS2Crew since the only crash that ever happens is once FS2Crew is loaded, and the crash occurs every single time FS2Crew is loaded and, so far, never when FS2Crew is not loaded. I am not an expert with the guts of FSX. I'm willing to experiment with things, but I don't know how to figure out what interaction FS2Crew is having with (whatever other software) that is causing the crash.

Thank you! I haven't considered de-selecting HS. And, in fact, I almost always have that selected. I'll try that next flight. Thanks for the suggestion

Okay. I just wanted you to know it wasn't working as expected. We used to be able to "finish" circuits by arming the speedbrakes (that's consistent with what the manual currently says); that doesn't seem to work anymore. Also, I don't intend to argue with you on the commonality of go-arounds, but .. wouldn't it make more sense to go straight to the landing checklist after the takeoff checklist when in a go-around? Currently, it progresses to the descent checklist, as if you're doing a normal departure climbout.

Hello: Firstly, thank you for the enhancements to the circuit logic (specifically, adding a valid response to the landing checklist challenge with regard to the speedbrake not being armed)! It will certainly be nice not to have to say "set and checked" now-- I always feel like such a failure when I can't remember the proper response to a challenge I was doing some touch and goes today and discovered that I'm quite rusty! In the process, I think I may have discovered two bugs. The first situation pertains to go arounds. Unfortunately, I had to execute a few. When I announce my go around, the FO handles it properly, announces positive rate, I call for gear, etc. However, and forgive me, I'm not sure of -exactly- which step triggers it, I noticed that FS2Crew consistently disregarded the fact that I was doing circuits. After I got the aircraft flying again, each time, I observed that FS2Crew had reverted to "normal flight" logic, and thusly was waiting for its trigger to execute the after-takeoff flow and then bug me about releasing the flight attendants. So, each time I executed a go around, I had to pull FS2Crew back up, skip through all of the interim phases of flight and back to Landing Checklist, then I had to go reset the approach type to "Touch And Go." This didn't seem like intended behavior. Secondly, when all was said and done, I couldn't "exit" the circuit logic. In the past, the landing logic depended on the position of the speedbrake (down detent = touch and go; armed = full stop). I'm not sure if this logic has changed, and the change didn't make it to the manual, or if this is a bug, but once I decided to finish up with my circuits, when I armed the speedbrake, it did not seem to have the same effect anymore. I played around (while on downwind) with arming it, going back to down detent, fully extending, etc, but every time I said "cleared," I got the same "no brakes, no reverse, touch and go" response. I also attempted messing with the autobrake setting to see if that would affect it, to no avail. Interestingly enough, though, once I actually touched down, the FO didn't pull the flaps on me like I was expecting. Somewhere along the line, it figured out I didn't intend to depart anymore and left the flaps out at their landing setting. I hope these descriptions give you enough to go on. Thanks again!

Hi Bryan: Thanks for 2.0! I'm looking forward to trying out all of the new features. This software really does line up in the top tier of best FS addons. Awhile back, in this thread, I reported having some issues after upgrading to 1.1. Specifically, whenever I activate FS2Crew, something happens that guarantees FS will crash when attempting to end the flight (whether it's just "End flight" back to the home screen, or attempting to exit FS altogether). Thankfully, the crash is consistent and doesn't occur during flight; however, after isolating all of my addon software, I have determined that it's definitely FS2Crew that triggers the crashes. In the last thread, you suggested my system was messed up. Well, I tried everything I could think of to clean up my system while avoiding a complete re-install, but I finally took you up on your suggestion, wiped FS, and started over. In the process of getting all of my addons installed, I discovered 2.0 (thank you!) and upgraded to that. I just want to report that I'm still having the crash in 2.0 and ask if maybe you've seen this elsewhere or discovered a fix yet. The crash appears to be the same circumstance as my last report: everything works fine, insofar as flying, but whenever I activate FS2Crew, it sets off a dead man's switch of some sort: after I activate FS2Crew (even if I just simply activate it and then immediately end a flight), FS crashes when it tried to end the flight. I know it probably seems petty to you, but it actually is fairly frustrating: any FS changes I made during flight get lost, so I have to remember to jot down the changes and commit them again and exit out of FS before my next flight so they get saved. Also, I've been having a tough time with random failures on my PMDG -- it seems like it never gets to save flight progress, since FS2Crew keeps crashing FS on exit, so my plane is always "new" next time I load it. I know you're working on a lot of things and this probably seems petty to you, but I'd really appreciate if you could give this another look. Thanks for your time

Alright, just a follow up here. I just finished another flight. This time, after engine start, I waited for awhile to see if anything would happen -- nothing. So, pursuant to the CWP, I said "leave the flaps up for taxi." This triggered the FO to start his before taxi flow, which INCLUDED the flap movement check. Interestingly, on this particular flight, he only let the flaps get to 15 before retracting ( last flight, the flaps were extended to full 40 before retraction ). In any event, after the flaps were retracted, I called for the controls check, the before taxi checklist, and then started my taxi out. When I did it this way, I was able to call for takeoff flaps later as I approached the runway (pursuant to the CWP, I called for flaps before the takeoff checklist). Another "interesting" -- I'm not 100% sure, but it seemed like the software was waiting for me to extend flaps before I got my "cabin secure" notification. It just seemed like it was taking longer than usual (it's very rare-- in the sim, at least --that I have to actually park at the runway hold short because I'm still waiting on the FA). After I got my takeoff flaps and ran the checklist, my FA eventually chimed in. Not sure if this is coincidence or intended. Notwithstanding, this procedure allowed me to depart without having to take over the FO's actions. However, after arrival, the FO pulled the flaps up to 15 as was stated earlier. After I parked, however, I couldn't get him to retract them completely. When I ran my shutdown checklist, he did note that the flaps were still extended, but refused to retract them.

Interesting! I am definitely guilty of this on my last flight. It was my first time having cold weather procedures triggered-- and I wasn't actually planning on using them this flight but they were forced on me. I didn't expect the FO to start a flap movement test (it's not even mentioned in any of the manuals that I've read so far) -- I wasn't even aware of the procedure. So, once my engines were started and stable, I called for "flaps 5." Since there's no documentation on this, I assumed that the FO's "flap movement check" announcement was the response to my "flaps 5" request; however, now it occurs to me that this could have simply been a coincidence. Was the FO just doing is flow and I simply happened to request flaps right before he announced his test or did I trigger the test by requesting flaps?

Hi Bryan: Just wanted to follow up with this. Thanks for all your help thus far and sorry I haven't replied in awhile: holiday season. Hope yours was enjoyable. I made the config file change you provided me to change the saved state to "voice control" and that worked insofar as getting FS2Crew to load in voice control rather than button control. However, FSX still crashes when (and only when) FS2Crew is in voice control. The results from the config change seem to indicate that the conflict isn't triggered by the actual changing of the FS2Crew voice/button mode, but rather voice mode simply being enabled at all. I hope this information helps lead you somewhere. To recap: After upgrading to 1.1, a regression was observed with the voice control mode of FS2Crew. Now, whenever voice control is loaded, any subsequent ending of a flight in FSX results in FSX crashing. This crash occurs whether selecting "end flight" or simply closing the sim: once the sim attempts to terminate the flight, FSX crashes with an NTDLL error. After extensive testing and selective disabling of all third party software, this crash is only encountered if FS2Crew is loaded in voice control mode (button control does not produce the crash).

I just want to add that I had this problem too on my last flight. I departed with a temperature of M14. After pushback and engine start, I requested flaps 5. The FO announces flap movement test, extends flaps 40, then back full up. After this, no amount of persuasion was able to convince him to extend the flaps again. I searched the Main Ops and SOP 2 manual/tutorials and there's no reference to this procedure. I tried to follow the "leave the flaps up for taxi" instructions under Cold Weather Procedures, but apparently I wasn't in that "flow" on the program: the FO simply refused to extend the flaps for takeoff. At this time, the "mode selector" was reading "before takeoff checklist" (which I had not called for yet, pursuant to the SOP 2 tutorial). After extending the flaps myself and doing the takeoff, I later landed with a temperature of M13. After exiting the runway, the FO cleans up the airplane but only retracts the flaps to 15. No amount of persuasion could convince him to raise the flaps any further. Had to do that myself as well. I am using ASN SP4. It stated, for both airports, that no precipitation was reported. This was supported by fairly clear skies and no visible precipitation in the sim during the flight.

Oh. Well, this problem only started after I upgraded to 1.1. I was hoping to "reset" and restore my FS environment to how it was pre-1.1. Are saying the 1.1 upgrade is permanent? Please forgive me if I'm completely misunderstanding you. Thanks for continuing to look into this. Bryan, I found this after Googling as you recommended. Is this what you were referring to? If I'm understanding this properly, it sounds like FSX got put into some type of supersensitive maximum security cyberjail on my computer. So, if my upgrade to 1.1 triggered this, downgrading wouldn't give FS a "get out of jail free" pass? If that's the case, how do I post bail for FSX? Or am I still not understanding what's happening. I'm sorry, please handle me with kid gloves.

Bryan: Thanks for the manual workaround and tip. I'll try updating my video card drivers and see if that helps at all. Do you have any idea why FS2Crew would be triggering a video card error? Is there anything you know of that FS2Crew would do when enabling voice that would cause this? Also, I'm going to try to uninstall 1.1 and go back to 1.0 to try that out. Are there any special steps you'd recommend I take or will a simple uninstall and re-install be sufficient for testing? Thanks again for your time

Bryan, Is there a config file or registry setting I can edit outside of FS so FS2Crew loads initially with my preferred settings? I was thinking two things: 1) It'd allow me to isolate whether the crashing is triggered by FS2Crew switching modes or if it's caused by the voice control itself 2) If #1 is the former, it'd serve as a workaround until you can resolve the root problem

I do use a USB headset as recommended in the manual. I don't have HS selected, though: it isn't selected by default, and since all I'm doing is starting FS2Crew and then exiting my sim, I hadn't thought to turn it on. I just went to my FS config and gutted all the settings: Scenery global set to Minimal Weather global set to Very Low Traffic global set to Custom, with all sliders moved to 0%/None Then I tried a few new experiments, restarting FSX between each attempt: Enable the HS feature, then disable it again Loaded PMDG Selected random airport (KCID) Activated FS2Crew Changed config to Voice Selected the HS button Deselected the HS button Ended flight Result: crash Via the Windows Playback Devices dialog, select the Headphones as both "Default Device" and "Default Communications Device" Executed steps from #1 above Random airport: KBOI Result: crash Tried disabling the "LK" feature, and closing the FS2Crew window(s) prior to ending flight: crash This one was interesting: I loaded FS2Crew without changing it to Voice mode (random airport: KEWR), and I was able to end flight successfully. Based on 4, I tried enabling Voice mode, but changing to SOP (#1) (same airport, KEWR). Result: crash