For those of you who can get it, the History Channel Mega-Movers episode, "Extreme Aircraft Recovery", featuring the MAAM P-61 recovery operation, along with three other aircraft recovery stories, airs today, June 9 at 4:00 PM EST. Check your local listings. If you miss it today, History repeats episodes frequently and eventually will have it available on DVD through their website.This is an incredible story, and when the P-61 restoraton is finally finished, we will of course be producing a MAAM-SIM version of the only flying "Black Widow" in the world. That's about three years off, if we can raise the money. If the story inspires you, please become part of the P-61 Recovery and Restoration Team by dropping a donation in the kitty.http://www.maam.org/php/xcart/MAAM-P-61-BL...ON-p-16444.htmlThere are some cool thank-you gifts for various levels of donation. Bill RambowMAAM-SIM http://www.fssupport.com/maam/hgrsm_blkani.gif

OK, count me in, my donation has been placed. Did you know that your P-61 got a nice write-up in the Pacific Flyer, the aviation newspaper out here on SoCal? Keep up the good work. I'm hoping to visit your museum before too long, if nothing else to see where my money is going.

Hi Ken,Thanks very much! No, I didn't know about that piece. I would love to see a scan of that article, if you can manage it.Bill RambowMAAM-SIM http://www.fssupport.com/maam/hgrsm_blkani.gif

Three years! Why, the R4D6 might be back in the air by then. It would be nice to see where all the money has gone! What is the running total of the R4D-6 fund now? When does the engine arrive? When do we get to see `our` bird back in the air!Allcott

The P-61 restoration will take a total of about 2.5 million dollars to complete. We (MAAM, not MAAM-SIM) have spent about $700,000 on it so far.As for the R4D, that was all covered recently in another thread.http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...g_id=5238&page=To re-iterate - the R4D's two engines and a complete refurbishment, inside and out, have been paid for by the MAAM-SIM donations. The actual work will not be done until new hangar space is built, and that is being held up by some petty-bureaucrats at the Township level. So if you want to see our girl back in the air, move to the neighborhood of the museum and vote these mini-Napoleans out of office so we can get on with it!Bill RambowMAAM-SIM http://www.fssupport.com/maam/hgrsm_blkani.gif

Thanks for the reply, but that just makes things even more confusing. You say that `we` have cumulatively paid for the engines and that the only thing holding work up is hangar space, but when I go to the MAAM site and click on the `wants and needs` section I still see listed: 1 x Pratt & Whitney R1830-94 enginePerhaps you could explain?Then, when I go to the `Donation` page I find a live link for the R4D engine fund, and on the page for engine donations for the plane there is not a single mention of your statement that the motors have been acquired. Why are donations still being sought when both engines have now been acquired? And why has the R4D-6 seemingly been forgotten in the list of Current Aircraft Restoration Projects? I'm not being difficult, but like many others my introduction to this project was to raise the money to put the R4D-6 back in the air. It's been long enough to be due a full & frank statement as to the current position, or else we muight start thinking that 50819 has been forgotten. I'm sure the Black Widow is a worthy project, but not ahead of getting the R4D-6 back in the air. Perhaps we might see a defnitive statement from the museum on their own website as to the current state of play? And a couple of photos of the engines, boxed, sitting in the corner of whatever hangar or storeroom they are in? And the removal of the donation page for a project for which sufficient money has already been raised? And some kind of timeline as to when we might expect the R4D-6 to fly again? Indeed, any acknowledgement of the current status of 50819 would be nice - it still shows as available for airshow work, which would presumably make for an interesting glide landing? Given the enduring popularity of the Dak/DC-3 it must surely make a better contribution to the museums upkeep in the air, than engine-less on the ground as a cash cow into which the funds get poured, seemingly without result - or limit?I am sure these are just oversights by the musuem, but when the website is the only source of information on `our` plane, and many of the contributors are thousands of miles away, they really should rise up to the obligation of keeping donaters better informed.I'm happy to make further purchases from MAAM-Sim and contribute further to projects, but no way do I think Jaap was being argumentative when he insisted that it is high time for a statement from the museum. Perhaps if the museum is busy building something else we could just see the part of the oversight report on the R4D-6 from the charity commissioner or whatever organisation or body oversees the operation of charitable institutions like MAAM? I'm sure that would reassure a lot of folks that 50819 isn't being used as some kind of reservoir from which to draw funds for other projects.Allcott

Hi Alcott,>when I go to the MAAM site and click on the `wants>and needs` section I still see listed: 1 x Pratt & Whitney>R1830-94 engine>>Perhaps you could explain?Yes, I can. That was a very old list that needed updating. The fact that is does not say 2 x P&W is an indication of just how old. Blame the webmaster, me. If you check now you will find it stricken from the list.>>Then, when I go to the `Donation` page I find a live link for>the R4D engine fund, Another oversight on my part, also now fixed. You will now find only the P-61 and General Fund donation categories on the store pages.>>And why has the R4D-6 seemingly been forgotten in the list of>Current Aircraft Restoration Projects? Gotcha! Not me, this time. Because it is not a current Aircraft Restoration Project. Like many other planes on our collection, it is awaiting its turn, and for reasons already explained.>>I'm not being difficult, but like many others my introduction>to this project was to raise the money to put the R4D-6 back>in the air. It's been long enough to be due a full & frank>statement as to the current position, or else we muight start>thinking that 50819 has been forgotten. >I'm sure the Black>Widow is a worthy project, but not ahead of getting the R4D-6>back in the air. Perhaps we might see a defnitive statement>from the museum on their own website as to the current state>of play? OK. Give me a little time to attend to some other items of business (I have just returned from the U.S. Grand Prix and have a bit of a backlog) and I will post such a statement on the MAAM pages. But do you seriously think getting a DC-3 back in the skies, of which there are many hundreds still airworthy, is a higher priority than what will be the only flying example of the P-61 in the world? >And a couple of photos of the engines, boxed, sitting in the>corner of whatever hangar or storeroom they are in? I said they were paid for, not delivered and gathering dust in a corner, of which we have none to spare. Let's use a little common sense, shall we? Why would we want $100k+ worth of P&W's taking up space and deteriorating, awaiting a project that requires a yet-to-be approved building program be completed before it can even be started? I'll tell you what I will do - I'll take some shots of the R4D's current condition, which stems from the aforementioned lack of hangar space, and post them in the statement. Then perhaps to will see why it makes no sense to hang new engines on the faded, tattered, bird-crap covered old plane. She was so sad looking that Russ hid her on the other side of the field during WWII Weekend!BTW, the R4D is not the only plane in our collection that is in the same sort of condition due to years of residence on the ramp in all weathers. They include the Martin 4-0-4, Vickers Viscount, P2V Neptune, and C-119 Flying Boxcar, to name just the big ones. All of them need to come under cover before it makes any sense to pour money into their restoration. But of all of them, the R4D will be the first of the "ramp queens" to be renovated, let alone re-engined.>I am sure these are just oversights by the musuem, but when>the website is the only source of information on `our` plane,>and many of the contributors are thousands of miles away, they>really should rise up to the obligation of keeping donaters>better informed.>>I'm happy to make further purchases from MAAM-Sim and>contribute further to projects, but no way do I think Jaap was>being argumentative when he insisted that it is high time for>a statement from the museum. Perhaps if the museum is busy>building something else we could just see the part of the>oversight report on the R4D-6 from the charity commissioner or>whatever organisation or body oversees the operation of>charitable institutions like MAAM? OK, this is getting a bit over-the-top, to put it politely. Since I have, even in the days before the new store software was implemented last winter, always processed the on-line donations, I can tell you from personal knowledge that the sum total of all R4D donations, aside from sales of the MAAM-SIM R4D aircraft packages themselves, has amounted to less than $1000 since the year 1999. That is the year when I began my association with the museum and came up with the idea of selling our freeware plane to get the real R4D airborne again. So, unless it is your contention that you did not get your money's worth and the R4D package is overpriced for what you received, then it is mine that the true donation is really in the many thousands of hours of development and the associated costs that I and my partners expend, year after year, for no monetary return. This is accomplished at considerable personal sacrifice by all of us. So if anyone is owed any sort of full and frank explanation of where the money is going, it is my MAAM-SIM partners, only one of whom has ever visited the museum. Well, guess what? I contend that if we, having forgone several hundred thousand dollars in profits for our products, are satisfied that we have not been led down the garden path, then perhaps so should you. We certainly do value our customers, though, and always thank them for supporting the museum with their purchases. Further, I defy you to name any FS team or company that has done more to continue giving value for money with further development of an old product at no additional cost. Just take a look at the Free Stuff page. No one wants the R4D to fly again, and as soon as possible, more than Russ Strine, MAAM's president. The Douglas was the first plane purchased by him and donated to the museum. She was MAAM's very first award-winner, too, and is still very dear to Russ, personally. The second-most eager person looking forward to that day is me, because Russ promised me yoke-time in the co-pilot's seat back in 1999, if I came through on my crazy idea. Well, with the help of my partners and our customers, I have. So, now I have made the overlooked and overdue changes to the website and store about the R4D fund. Mea culpa. If those provided you with circumstantial evidence of some foul conspiracy by the powers-that-be at MAAM to bilk you of your money under false pretenses, than I'm sorry to tell you it was all the fault of a 60-year old volunteer, self-taught webmaster/store manager/flightsim team leader/grandfather with too many irons on the fire to keep track of everything. Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most. ;-)Furthermore, unasked, I will put on my pith helmet and try to track down any other lurking old references to the R4D fund from the hinterlands of MAAM and expunge them, one by one, so as not to mislead anyone else. You will have to make pen and ink changes to your already purchased or freely downloaded files, though. I have enough to do already!As I promised, I will eventually post an official statement (that only two people have ever asked for) on the official MAAM website that the R4D restoration has been paid for by MAAM-SIM purchases and donations. But the time frame for the beginning, let alone the end of that project is currently beyond our control. But when there is progress on that front, I will certainly be delighted to report it, you can be sure! MAAM does not fly crappy looking aircraft, we do our own restoration work, and we don't do things by halves. So it is Mr. Strine's stated intention that when #50819 returns to the sky, she will again be in the condition which garnered her "Best Transport" at Oshkosh in 1982 and "Grand Champion Warbird" the following year. That must and will be done under cover. The official statement on the website will re-iterate what I have already said in these two, long threads.Everything on the MAAM website, including the MAAM-SIM section, is approved by the president and can be considered official.Finally, to all those who purchased our products or donated to the R4D cause to help get her aloft again, thanks again on behalf of all of us at MAAM and MAAM-SIM. This is especially so for those who never thought to question our integrity, despite the long delay. Your mission and ours has been accomplished. The museum's restoration specialists have been given the means to accomplish theirs, and we all look forward to the day when we see R4D-6 #50819 cleared for takeoff. If I'm not driven crazy before then, I hope to be aboard, sitting in the right seat -well, not during takeoff, but for a little while!Now, can I please go back to work on the TBM so we can help pay for the P-61, as well? I want a ride in the gunner's seat. :-)Bill RambowMAAM-SIM http://www.fssupport.com/maam/hgrsm_blkani.gif