Windows Vista

[Guest allcott]

>Doesn't Vista use a method similar to XP? That is, you need>to upgrade multiple components in order to trigger>re-activation? Hard drives crash all the time... I can't see>how a drive change in itself would trigger re-activation, and>even if it did you can call for an activation ## and claim>your old drive crashed and was replaced under warranty.>>I've upgraded my computer many times... had to call MS twice>since I've used up all my activations on hardware changes. >I've never even been questioned...>>Little bit of paranoia out there? :) MS is the one to be>paranoid... how many antitrust suits have they had to deal>with? The last thing MS wants to do is mess with the people>who have legally obtained a copy of Vista.>>PaulLook, how many times do we have to repeat ourselves before the message sinks in. Vista activation IS NOT THE SAME AS XP ACTIVATION.Yes, you can install several times on the same hardware, but now the definition of what constitutes `new` hardware has changed, as has the entitlement of the user to continue to use the software after a successful activation. GO READ THE EULA!http://download.microsoft.com/documents/us...53f722371fa.pdfAllcott

[deltafan 1]

I think what he was getting at was that MS would be facing a mob of angry customers, a mob they don't necessarily want to face.

[Guest Funky D]

>Yes, you can install several times on the same hardware, but>now the definition of what constitutes `new` hardware has>changed, as has the entitlement of the user to continue to use>the software after a successful activation. >>GO READ THE EULA!>>http://download.microsoft.com/documents/us...53f722371fa.pdfAllcott,I read the licensing agreement. And unless you have another source of your information besides the EULA, I respectfully disagree with many of your points. Lets look at a few things:"INSTALLATION AND USE RIGHTS. Before you use the software under a license, you must assign that license to one device (physical hardware system). That device is the "licensed device." A hardware partition or blade is considered to be a separate device.First off, as this clearly states, you can only have a Vista license assigned to ONE device. You can transfer the license ONCE, as stated below. Vista could come with a utility to transfer the license from one computer to another. Autocad licensing works like this, but you can transfer the license an infinite number of times. Or its possible that if you install Vista on your desktop, then on your laptop, you'll have the option to transfer the license during activation. If transferred, the desktop copy would deactivate. Of course its all speculation until the retail copy hits shelves.The partition clause it probably thrown in so people don't run multiple copies of Vista through virtualized hardware under Linux or OSX. This was a smart inclusion with all of the multi-core chips coming out. It would be probably be possible to set up a virtual terminal environment... 4 copies of Vista on separate partitions running simultaneously under Linux, each on a separate CPU core, with 4 users connected to the Linux box, using each copy of Vista independently of one another.15. REASSIGN TO ANOTHER DEVICE.a. Software Other than Windows Anytime Upgrade. The first user of the software may reassign the license to another device one time. If you reassign the license, that other device becomes the "licensed device."Note that this explicitly states the option to TRANSFER the license to another device. There is no mention of the consequences of hardware upgrades. In fact, "reassigning" the licenses and activation, although related, are probably independant of each other. Upgrading your computer to the point of envoking reactivation isn't necessarily the same as reassigning the license device! Of other interest:"Some changes to your computer components or the software may require you to reactivate the software."There is NO evidence in the EULA that the definition of what constitutes as `new` hardware has changed. And please tell me where it points out that reactivating the software is the same as transferring the license?I think the EULA has been clarified in order to:1. Keep people from running Vista on multiple computers at the same time. The license must now be transferred in order to run on an entirely different set of hardware.2. Keep people from running multiple copies of Vista at once on one PC.Now instead of yelling "GO READ THE EULA", maybe you should stop making baseless negative assumptions? If you got your information from a different official source, I apologize, but don't point me to a few paragraphs that you've interpreted as dreadfully as possible. People made the same assumptions about the XP activation, and it sure hasn't effected me after countless upgrades...Paul

[Guest allcott]

MS security ensures that the mob they are likely to be facing are angry shareholders, when Vista turns out to be a lemon and the rights of the user mean everyone stays with XP. When the impact of that hits the bottom line, the AGM will be very interesting.MS rely on RTM to ensure the volume release of a new OS. Can you imagine the impact of every system buyer specifiying XP instead of Vista? The customers don't need to get angry, just smart. Just sit back and wait.Allcott

[Guest allcott]

Paul, Instead of so studiously ignoring the issue and concentrating on your own inappropriate and incorrect interpretation of the EULA perhaps YOU should be the one to be doing the research? You don't supply a single reference to back up your counterpoint. Its just your interpretation and unless your BG's right-hand man, who cares how you interpret the new EULA? The warnings have been posted. Its down to the individual to measure the risks and decide accordingly. Ominous interviews with MS officials have confirmed that this is no scaremonger tactic. As to the impact on FSX, as I have said on repeated occasions, there is no evidence that Vista will offer increased performance for FSX on the same hardware. Running Vista and FSX under DX9 hardware, there is very little reason for optimism. Given the cost of upgrading to Vista (and you'd better keep a wedge back for re-purchasing licences following hardware upgrades) and the absence of a DX10-ready version of FSX, there is no point in updating to to the new OS, when looked at purely from the simmers perspective. Spend the money on more RAM and a graphics card upgrade for XP in the meantime. Wait a year while the bugs get ironed out and prices for the bleeding edge DX10 hardware drops to more realistic levels and we should be laughing as the activation policy will have resolved itself.Allcott

[jfri 43]

>I thought I answered that? A new hard drive means a `new`>computer, in MS speak. A reformat doesn't.>I can hardly believe this. Recently I my HD broke down. Replacing it with an identical drive was not possible since they were not sold anymore. Does this situation mean that you need to purchase a new license and that my computer would be regarded as new?>So if you must install Vista (and I don't see why you must)Well it's going to be standard and previous OS will be very hard to use. Think for example about trying to stick to Win 98.>wait until you have assembled ALL the hardware, then install>it. DON'T try and do the hardware upgrades piecemeal, or it>will cost you dear in extra licences for Vista. >So we can only upgrade the system once?Another question. If thisapply for the retail version (very expensive) what about the OEM version?

[Guest cloud_tiger]

I've been watching this development with interest. I change the components in my PC frequently.What happens if you have a MB fail then another soon after ? Buy another copy of Vista ?This is simply madness and I can't see it ever working. Nobody has been looking forward to Vista or DX10 more than me. I have

[jfri 43]

>I've upgraded my computer many times... had to call MS twice>since I've used up all my activations on hardware changes. >I've never even been questioned...>Did that include a new mb? Was it a retail or oem version?

[Guest Funky D]

>Did that include a new mb? Was it a retail or oem version?Yes, I replaced the motherboard. This is what prompted activation to pop up. OEM version. No questions asked when I called in.

[Guest allcott]

>MS recently announced that Vista will only be able to be>transfered onto a new machine only once.>>http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/2100-...tml?tag=nl.e019>>Does this apply to:>1. Wiping a drive to clean it and reinstalling the OS?>2. Upgrading your harddrive and having to reinstall the OS?>>Will I be able to reinstall it in those cases or will I have>to buy a new copy each time?Ron, In answer to 1: - NoIn answer to 2: - YesIn the first instance its not a new DEVICE, as MS calls it, the device comprising the majot contituent parts. So that ought to be fine. But if you change any of those major parts then you are installing in a different machine and will use up your second activation. That's the change from previous Activations policies for Windows versions.Like many others I cannot see this working in practice, it just gives ammunition to thieves and hackers and I don't think MS have anything like enough competent support staff to handle the deluge that will result. They aren't handling the tech support at all well for a realtively small product like FSX, so it can only be a disaster.Allcott

[jfri 43]

>>Did that include a new mb? Was it a retail or oem version?>>Yes, I replaced the motherboard. This is what prompted>activation to pop up. OEM version. No questions asked when I>called in.I'm confused since MS has told me by phone that new mb means you must buy a new license. Is the rules different for different countries? Or has this changed recently?