G'day GuysAfter buggering around for the last week and a half i think i finally have a 727 that is the best available from the numerous bits and pieces that are around on the net.I started with the Captain sim 727.Clearly the best 727 model and probably the best modelled aircraft ever in FS9/2002 from where i am sitting.The only problems and they are goodies are the poor flight model and in my opinion bad perspective problems which make a great panel turn pretty average after quite a bit of use.The gauges on the 2d panel are way to small for instrument flying and using zoom in the VC leads to very slow gauge refresh rates which again render it useless.So turning to the excellent panel by Richard Probst was the plan and it has worked wonderfully.By using the Probst 2D panel and pasting in the Captain Sim VC minus the gauges(more on that shortly) you get a readable and flyable 2D panel.Using the VC from Captain sim gives you a nice environment for in the circuit and looking around.I personally don't use the 3d pit much so i don't miss the great CS727VC gauges ver much at all.Simply paste in from the CS panel cfg the section on Vcockpit 01.You must disable the CS VC gauges or you will find the Probst heading selector will not work as it is overridden b the CS heading system.I also added the Civa INS to the Probst panel using info found here at AVSIM and it works fantastically. Given one of the huge problems with the CS 727 is no option is supplied for any type of long range nav system and almost all of the aircraft depicted in the textures were fitted with INS if involved in overwater ops.Now if you grab the awesome Fox airfiles for the 727-200 you are getting close.By copying the required data from the CS aircraft file(Flightsim data for each model,lights,contact points,weight and balance and electrical) to the Fox airaft cfg,it will work fine.With the air file simply rename the fox airfile to cs727200 and you are ready to rock.You canalso mod the 100 series as well by using its weight and balance info.I also played with tfe flap drag etc to give the 100 a slightly ligter feel.The best cockpit with the best model and best airfile.Take the time to do it and you will be rewarded with simply the best 727 experience for FS9.Having a ball here!!

I must agree. I did the same thing a few months back as I never liked the Captain Sim panel, but the aircraft model is excellent. I also modified Lee Hetherington's IVSI/TCAS-transponder package to match Richard's panel and my own 732 panel...so all in all I have a very good 727-200 package.A few pics below.Regards,Van LatendresseYeoDesigns/AFG GroupPanel/FDE Designer

I don't mean to sound trite, uncaring, or even cynical... but you spent an awful lot of money on just a model, it seems to me. IIRC, the Captain Sim wasn't cheap. And you have to use a freeware airfile to enjoy flying it, and a freeware panel to enjoy using it? Do you not feel you got ripped off to some degree? Maybe Captain Sim should offer a "model only" purchase at 1/3 the regular price? :-)

Thats the way it goes in this hobby...some times you win and some times you lose when one purchases a package, but if you have the ability to achieve a desired combination, then you can obtain a specific goal and mine was to have a great 727 all around package and right from the get go I was only interested in Captain Sims visual model as I already knew I would use Richard's panel and my own FDE...To each their own I always say :)Hey and just because a panel or fde is freeware it doesn't make them of lesser quality then payware. The only FDE I haven't felt the need to change is PIC767 as it's state of the art all others (Dreamfleet, Ariane, Capt Sim.. etc etc) I created my own as I had many stability issues with them and they were payware, so laying down dollars doesn't guarentee anything.Regards,Van LatendresseYeoDesigns/AFG GroupPanel/FDE Designer

Hi JorgeYou are 100% correct and thas why i will never buy another Captain sim product again.I only bought it about 2 months ago and i can't even imagine how bad the FDE must have been upon release as it is pretty poor after 5 revisions.The panel is pretty unusable from most respects with unreadable switches and unrealistic instrument sizes and perspectives.Pity as it really could have been truly an incredible addon with more thought planning and effort and most importantly support..Instead we get left to patch together a more workable addon.Most dissapointing.

Just another perspective:At 1600x1200 resolution, this is one fantastic, readable, very flyable aircraft! I would not give it up, or modify it, for anything. They had real-world pilots working with them and, to me, it's one gorgeous rendition. They were slammed pretty badly above, most undeservedly, I believe. The writing on those 2d guages, at the correct resolution, is crisp and very readable, to my very bad eyes. Every switch, also, is quite readable, even looking from a distance. For those having any difficulty reading instrument lables, I would recommend 1600x1200 resolution which I believe I read it was designed for. All this at 30FPS is one very good payware deal, imsho. Go, Captain Sim! The only not-so-great thing I would say about this plane, is that my passengers always puke when I try to capture a radial using VOR/LOC auto-pilot mode! That plane just weaves around looking for the vor radial. You almost always have to use heading mode to avoid all the after-flight, gross-out cleanup!sjKEWR

I couldn't agree more with you, I went from the 1280x960 to 1600x1200 and it really makes a huge difference. I absolutely think that this plane has the most gorgous panels on any payware plane. The only place it might lack is in the FDE area, I tried adding the Fox FDE but was not satisfied with those, I get a nose high flying and approach, app. 10 deg...I can't believe that is correct.About the VOR/LOC mode weaving. That is apparently how it worked, someone at the CS support forum mentioned that.

I agree fully that freeware does not mean lesser quality. Some of the finest products I have ever used in FS are freeware and better than some payware. I don't think the LAGO Twotter can hold a candle to the freeware Eric Dantes Twotter with Marcelo Canovas's texture updates. To their credit, LAGO and Mathjis have been constantly updating it to give their customers their moneys worth and try and improve it. Kudos to LAGO for their always stellar customer support.Regarding the panel being much better at a specified resolution, etc. This is a commercial product, which did not restrict its sales to folks with that resolution only. I never recall them mentioning that when it was first released. Imagine a car dealer telling you AFTER you have bought the car... "This is a fantastic car, one of the best cars int he world and ever made. BUT, only if you drive it on the Autobahn in Germany at 7:00AM in the morning on Tuesdays." Well, that really doesn't do you much good if you live in Ohio and have to be at work at 6:00AM on Tuesdays, does it?

Weird because I also use 1600x1200 resolution with a 19" monitor and still I could barely read the gauges and my eyes are fine. I also was disappointed that Capt Sim did not model TCAS as all 727's flying today must have TCAS installed.Like I said previously...to each their own.On another note, Dreamfleets 727 package looks like it will be excellent when released, with great gauge readabilty and a fully modelled TCAS system. DF's 727 will also have every system modelled that Capt Sim's 727 has, with a model that looks just as good. A package I'm definately looking forward to.Oh and this is not a slam fest, but rather peoples personal opinions, which everyone is entitled to :)Regards,Van LatendresseYeoDesigns/AFG GroupPanel/FDE Designer

Hello All, Ya know, I keep hearing about DF's working on the '27' however, I have yet to see any progress on it . . .am I missing something? Is there a link to the new info on it?Best to all,Clay

Clay , Look hereOriginal Announcement http://www.dreamfleet2000.com/Previews/727/727_Intro.htmalsohttp://www.flightsimnetwork.com/dcforum/DC...mID3/10712.htmlhttp://www.flightsimnetwork.com/dcforum/DC...mID3/10682.htmlhttp://www.flightsimnetwork.com/dcforum/DC...mID3/10662.htmlhttp://www.flightsimnetwork.com/dcforum/DC...mID3/10635.htmlandhttp://www.flightsimnetwork.com/dcforum/DC...mID3/10612.htmlregarding FS2004-FS2002 compatibilitySamuel KalachorasAthensGreece

What do you think ???Landinghttp://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=vie...t&file_id=43266Wide view (RP left, CS de-energized at FO side to save fps)http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=vie...t&file_id=43273Samuel Kalachoras :-waveAthensGreece

H'day SJGlad you are enjoying the CS 727 but i am not.I do not run at 1600 as most panels i use are unhappy at the higher res.At 1200 i cannot read any of the labels on any of the gauges on the overhead panels which are more than half way across.I don't think i can read any of the stuff on the engineers panel at all.In sim perspective the engineers panel seems miles away yet in the aircraft i can read everything from the captain seat.Having spent a bit of time sitting in the front of a real 72 it is way out of perspective.As i said in a post at the capt sim forum you sit about the same distance from your monitor as your head is from the overhead panel.Therefor gauges should be life size and real size readable.Instead i have to rely on the tooltips to see what i am switching and those on the far side of the overhead are almost flat.In real life you can rock back to read anything something impossible in the fixed perspective of FS9 so we are stuck unable to read most of the panels.The same can be said for the front panel the adi is ridiculously small and its refresh rate and size make it impossible to accurately fly correct attitudes down to 1 degree like the real aircraft.Again you sit a bit further away than the distance to your monitor so the adi should be a solid 2 inch's across on your screen.Its under 1 inch.As i said bad perspective that many have complained about with numerous people talking of eye strain from flying this model.You can fix up fox's cfg file by reducing the lift scalar down to around 0.5 in the flap section of the cfg.This will give you good body angles on approach in FS9 and realistic performance.Then we could go into the dancing EPR readings!The cs72 is in many respects one of the best addons out there but in others it lets you down big time and after 5 patches you would of thought someone could do a good fde( still pretty average afetr 5 patch's) for the best looking model i have seen( best vc as well).A great product almost.

Since you have been flying the 727 in real life, maybe you can answer my question, I haven't been able to find it in the manual. When is the correct time to switch on the wing, engine anti-ice, and when do I switch on the window heat? Also do you think that the Fox FDE is better than the original one?

Hello. I am very jealous of all of you that can sit back in their chair and still be able to read this stuff. I find myself right on top of the screen to be read any of the guages and switches. The labelling looks clear to me at that very tight distance, 1600x1200, adn a 21" crt monitor. Since I haven't the foggiest idea of what a real 727 cockpit looks like in any detail, I want to apologize for saying that the cs727's guages and switches are perfectly readable at the intended resolution. Other here have much more knowledge than I as to what it should be looking like. I enjoyed flying the plane and sitting right up next to the monitor, like I do in most of the a/c when I'm not just sight-seeing, I can read everything, except for the trim setting. The tutorial says set trim at 5.25 for takeoff. I needed a bleedin' electron microscope to read that setting on the flaps/trim panel! Should we be moving the captainsim forum?Regards,sjKEWR