Hi there !Just a happy keen flightsimmer (and real world pilot) who wants to figure out something about the ATC system in FS9.It is no doubt that the ATC system introduced in FS9, was greatly improved in many ways! It's really cool to request VOR approaches,NDB approaches and get valid clearances as well. Still, I think Microsoft has a VERY long way to go before (in my opinion) it can be referred to "As real as it gets". Now, I know, that MSFS is strictly for entertainment, but nevertheless, it should not be too hard to implement such things as..- Say you are at the holding point, with another aircraft in front of you. You tune in on the tower frequency to let'em know you are ready to go. Then you hear the other aircraft in front of you getting its takeoff clearance from the tower. As you see the aircraft start it's takeoff roll down the runway, you hear ATC say "Taxi into position and hold". Now, that's really cool! Good work! But something else dissapointed me. And that is :The next time I was out to get a virtual flying experience, I filed an IFR plan, jumped into the cockpit, cranked up the engine, and got my clearances and instructions from ATC. As I was approaching the active, I spotted a B757 on a long final. I tuned the tower frequency and I heard "Finnair three four six, cleared to land runway three three left".You could then hear the pilot dutifully read the landing clearance back to the tower. OK, so I held short of the runway (as I was told to by the ground controller in the first place), and called the tower to let them now that I was ready to go. The controller responded, "Cessna Oscar Hotel Echo Foxtrot Lima, hold short runway three three left, traffic is Boeing seven fify seven on final". No problem (who would stand in the way of 100 tonnes of metal anyway?)The B757 passed the runway threshold and landed gently (and there was NO ONE on final behind him!). Hmmmm.....as a real world pilot (and I've flown in the US as well!), I would really expect ATC to line me up as soon as the 757 had touched down! Instead, you would hear the tower repeateadly bug the airplane with "Exit runway when able", "turn next taxiway" "Exit runway when able" over and over again, until suddenly saying "Finnair 346, contact ground on 121.8". That's of course the ATC phrase triggered the moment the airplane crosses the boundary line between the runway and the taxiway. Now that's NOT very realistic, in fact it's annoying! When they implemented the "Taxi into position and hold" feature, it's dissapointing that it only applies when another AI aircraft takes off in front off you. Now, you have to wait for maybe centuries all the way until the other airplane is CLEAR of the runway. And why does the tower repeateadly bug the pilot of an aircraft just landed, with the words "Exit runway when able" and "turn next taxiway" ??? You don't even have the chance to respond to such harrasment! One single message(enough), where you could have the opportunity to readback as well would have been nice. And then, the moment you cleared the runway, you could have been told to contact ground control. In the FS9 learing center, there is a paragraph under "Other ATC services", again sorted under the ATC section.It says :Speed Adjustments to accomodate trafficControllers may also ask you to adjust your speed to accommodate aircaft ahead or behind you that are slower or faster than your aircraft.Now, I've been using the PMDG 737 for a while (great addon).Assuming this is an FS9 ATC recognized aircraft, the speed adjustment feature (claimed to exist in FS9 by Microsoft) should work.I've been stacked up behind 172's, Cherokee's and other slow flying airplanes when doing approaches (IFR). I'm doing about 150 knots on final (and a 172's doing about 70). Not ONE single time have I been told to reduce speed by ATC (or get vectored around for another approach). Instead, I've ended up plunging into the other aircraft from behind several times (but now I got TCAS....thank god!!)I guess it's just another proof that the ATC system in FS9 is really a joke (and does not provide airborne separation at all!).Dissapointed desktop pilot who really expected more froma product priced around $70!!

"Dissapointed desktop pilot who really expected more froma product priced around $70!!"If you're not just trolling, what ELSE do you expect for $70?

Greetings!All things considered, though, I'd still say that FS9 is a step above FS2002, which was a step above FS2000, etc... I can't say the same for CFS3 when it comes to being better than its predecessors. As far as your complaints about ATC, just remember that up until FS2002, Microsoft had no ATC at all - just ATIS. If you wanted ATC, you had to buy "Proflight" or some other add-on, so every step up is a good one.As I see it, Microsoft's Flight Simulator's main selling points throughout the ages have always been:1.Having the whole world to fly in.2.Developer SDK's that allow users from all over the world to develop add-ons that enhance the experience.3.Having the whole world to fly in.On a base level, I always thought Microsoft's Sims were vastly inferior to competing titles like Pro Pilot, Flight Unlimited, and Fly!, in terms of visual quality, flight physics, weather, and ATC interaction. But all of those other titles effectively excluded a good portion of the globe and the flight-simming community in general. Because Microsoft didn't, they developed a world-wide following of simmers and talented folks who's add-ons have really MADE the sim.The problem now, is that with most of the competition squashed, if you don't like Microsoft's version, you really have only one other choice - X-Plane. X-plane has its own advantages in terms of flight physics, but, to my knowledge, does not have better ATC.I'm sure with the next version of Flight Simulator (there IS going to be a next version, right?), efforts will be made to make ATC more realistic. There's a whole thread already in this forum for what we'd like to see fixed in FS2006, so you should really post this there. Maybe someone from Microsoft is watching....- Matt D.

You can always fly in one of the virtual air traffic networks, with all live controllers and pilots :)

Then purchase the Radar Contact add-on.If you are a real life pilot then you should know how complicated and multi-faceted a true rendition of ATC would be. It is another form of artificial intelligence. Frankly there could be a huge seperate program just for ATC simulation and this is what Radar Contact provides (with its own limitations). Don't expect to get everything "included" for a mere $70. There was no ATC in MSFS just a few years ago.Michael J.http://www.reality-xp.com/community/nr/rsc/rxp-higher.jpg