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Hornit

New York scenery exclude and mods question

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I have been trying to exclude the bridges and make new ones but when I compile the scenery in apt 2.6 (build148) nothing happens. Ive checked and rechecked but it seems something is different about the area surrounding New York. Im trying to replace all those crappy bridges as they really kill the realism for me. Does anyone know if there s something Im missing?Hornit

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You state an intent to "exclude and make new ones"; but "nothing happens".What doesn't happen:a) the default structures aren't being excluded?:( the new ones aren't showing?c) both of the above?

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Maybe this is the same problem that others have had, due to file paths incorrectly specified. Check the posts a few days back.Related to this, I am curious as to whether you can exclude something, and then put something new in the same place. Have not had a chance to try it yet.Mr Hornit- can you make a replacement for the Mid Hudson Bridge at Poughkeepsie, up the river? MS left it out, which disappoints me since it was my home town.John Woodward

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I've spent lots of time explaining the flexibility and effectiveness (and ease) involved in writing your own excludes directly in scasm. That's what I recommend. Each time I recommend this, other well known folks here claim I'm not being helpful to the beginners, and counter-recommend programs like airport for excludes. And the troubles keep being reported....on and on.Makes me almost just not bother.And yet my methods work...so its hard not to try to help folks.If you want to see a reliable method for excludes that works, seach this forum on my name and the word exclude.Bob Bernstein

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Ok Bob, I'll give your technique a try! Actually Im far from a beginner:) I have done numerous sceneries for The Northeast at this point but Im hesitant to download due to my poor documentation and using textures etc maybe unique to my system. So far in building many sceneries I have had zero problems using the exclude feature in airport to exclude default scenery and redo entire airports to my liking. This is the first time It doesn't work and its only doing it consistently right around New York. I was just curious if there was a specific reason...those damn bridges HAVE TO GO!!Hornit

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Give us the coordinates of the objects you want removed, and just out of curiosity, I'll see if my 'proven' method works as well!

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I forgot to add this to my last reply: I wonder if your problem stems from where your exclude file is stored. It would likely work better if placed in the same folder as the default scenery for that area is located.

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Im at work so can't find the coordinates til later, but if you want Im trying to exclude the Verrazano Narrows bridge at the mouth of the Hudson.Hornit

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>I forgot to add this to my last reply: I wonder if your >problem stems from where your exclude file is stored. It >would likely work better if placed in the same folder as the >default scenery for that area is located. I dont think thats correct, the exclude has to be placed in a directory one layer up, so it should be placed in the new folder where the new scenery will be located, otherwise if you place it in the same folder as the default you will have one file telling fs to display a bridge conflicting with another file tell FS not to display and depending on how the folder is orginized will determain what file wins.Put the exclude file in the same new folder that the new bridges will be in.

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>I've spent lots of time explaining the flexibility and >effectiveness (and ease) involved in writing your own >excludes directly in scasm. That's what I recommend. Each >time I recommend this, other well known folks here claim I'm >not being helpful to the beginners, and counter-recommend >programs like airport for excludes. And the troubles keep >being reported....on and on. >>Makes me almost just not bother. >>And yet my methods work...so its hard not to try to help >folks. >>If you want to see a reliable method for excludes that >works, seach this forum on my name and the word exclude. >>Bob Bernstein Your right Bob, it is best to learn the Code as some times the "front end" programs don't get it right and then what are you going to do?Don't give up offering the great help!Take care,

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Barney's method fixed my problems. I keep all my sceneries under My Documents for convenience: NewScenery Scenery TextureI configured Airport to put the bgl into Scenery and the exclude file into NewScenery.John Woodward

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Hornit ,I will send you a file with everything included (e-mail, how do you e-mail someone, with attachment, here). I made the exclude in AFW. Let me know if it works ok, it worked for me, I just don't know if its the correct bridge. Copy it to your scenery dir and add it, in game.Muskoka

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Hornit, heres a screenshot with the bridge gone and a wee little hanger in its place.Muskoka

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Hee hee! Ill be home tonight so you can mail me the exclude atcampisij@bellsouth.net thanks. Now maybe you can go check out all the other crappy bridges around manhattan and do exclude files for me??? Hopefully then I can do the bridges or someone who is good at making macros can do a few for us. I need the Geo Washington and the Brooklyn bridge done as Im not good enough to model those.What do you say guys? Maybe we can form a team for this project?call it the New York Bridge crew and fix up these silly looking white stick figures?? Just a thought.Hornit

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This was a tongue-in-cheek answer to Bob who's feeling frustrated by people not accepting his manual editing of Scasm code instead of using the Apt program menu for excluding objects. No offense Bob, just having a bit of fun!The other part of "my method" concerns the separating of exclude *.bgl's from those which deal with the "new" scenery/objects being created, rather than the exclude commands being part of said scenery *.bgl(s).

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Quite correct. This is another reason I create separate folders for each scenery area and steer away from placing everythinbg in the "Add-on" folder or any of the other default folders contained in the scenerydb system. As stated earlier, this provides for ease of removal upon a later date as well as allowing for better troubleshooting should the need arise.

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OK, in the spirit of conducting some experiments, I took the coordinates for centre of the first bridge closest to the end of runway 22 at La Guardia.N40 48.2W73 49.69These became the coordinates of my scenery diagram within Apt 2.6 build 152.I used the exclude menu to draw a 'box' which centred upon the bridge (centre of diagram) and extended just short of the shorelines.I placed the *.bgl in a separate folder of my creation, enabled this new folder.... and the bridge was gone.I removed the *.bgl from that folder and placed it in the scenery folder for NY City under the scenerydb system....... and the bridge was gone.Can't be much simpler than that folks. Took less time than to write this! It also appears that either folder works although as stated in past messages, I prefer to create my own folder system.

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I have no doubt that Barney's way is good for him. The only reason I've been teaching learning the scasm (which is the output of Airport) is that its so simple to write an exclude, that it gives the user an alternative if using Airport causes anyone problems.Since post after post continues to appear from people that are having problems using Airport for Excludes, Barney's constant demonstrations that persuade folks not to learn scasm will assure that folks continue to struggle with this problem.Suits me, I really don't care. I'm only writing this because Barney has taught that using Airport is the best way to create excludes in response to each and every one of my posts. In this way, if a person is afraid of coding, he is likely to see Barney's way as path of least resistence. Thus, anytime I teach code, Barney will appear and reduce my effort to a waste of time. In truth, if people embraced a coding solution for this feature, they'd have the simplest and easiest introduction to handling code which opens doors to future expertise. Once you understand the code, you begin to understand how to interpret and fix errors yourself without asking for help.Barney, have at it. You are on your own now.I will of course help anyone who wants it, but not thru public posts, Barney will just jump in and talk about airport. Write me a note, and I'll happily explain scasm for excludes to anyone who wants it.Bob Bernstein

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Barney's constant Airport information, even though the problems people have with Airport seem endless, has worn me out on the subject. Like what's the point.If folks want to learn to use the raw code, I'd be happy to help, just write me an email using the Avsim email icon. I agree with the value of learning code directly, I guess sharing that message is not real easy.B

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I really don't understand what you guys are bickering about, ego's , pride, whos way is the best, who gives a ###T. Hornit has his exclude, thats all that matters. As we all know theres more than one way of doing these excludes, how you do it,is up to you. Find a method that works and stick with it. And do share your findings with others because as great as these programs are, there not perfect, nor are the instructions sometimes conveyed in a way that everyone will understand or that make sense. ie. You CANT do and exclude in AFW if you have your Default and File BGL path pointing to the same directory (it won't compile), even though thats the way the instructions suggest you set things up. Muskoka

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I'm not bickering, I'm pushing a river. its dumb, the only thing to do when you find urself pushing a river is just to stop.use email from now on if you want any help from me, and you'll get whatever I can give.Bob B

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I'm not sure if you get this, If you put it in the same folder and it gets out of order by windows folder properties then it wont work consistantly it may exclude untill your here or there and then it starts winking out or conflicting.Has this turned into the beginners forum? where are all the vets?

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Yeah, this forum has grown weak, seems like all the vets are over at the G-max forums.

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At times this seems like the place to be, now and then there is a flurry of interesting activity. Then it subsides. Oh wellB

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