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Too Hot

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I am trying to find out if my P-4 2.2 GHz chip with 512k of L2 cache (.13 micon) is running too hot in FS2002.My idle temps (computer on but not running anything) runs around 38-42C (100.4F to 107.6F). After running FS2002 and or after system lock-ups 46-54C (114.8 to 129.2F). Intel says my 2.2GHz chip max temp should be 69C (156.2F).My case only came with 6 cooling fans and I am using the CPU fan that Intel shipped with the chip. No over clocking. The average room temp is 70-75F. Terry

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I think 6 case fans is plenty... the problem must be poor airflow from all those fans. Try tying back excess wiring to structures and framework, free up some middle area for airflow. As for the temperatures... that isn't too hot...should be about +15-20 degrees for average gaming.

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Doesn't really sound that bad.Mine (P4 1.9@2.2 with ti4600) runs idle at 40-42c.FS full force gives about 50-52c.When ambient is high it sometimes touches 56-58c.Case is always below 30-32c.A Vulcan-7 on the chip, 1 Thermaltake 80mm front-in and 1 back-out.Just make sure you stay below 60c to have a good safety margin.Most processors die at 80c core....and some go mentally insane when they come close to it :-hahAlso look for programs like MBM and Shutdown Now! for safety.Have a look at http://www.overclockers.com.Lot's of tips, tricks & links there on cooling & limits.- Gideon (EHAM)

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I think you're fine with those temps... I run a P3/800, which runs cooler than a P4. At idle, I'm around 34-35, and under load, 40. I have just one exhaust fan positioned directly over the CPU, which directs air out the back of the case. When the room temp goes above 78, I augment cooling with a desktop fan pointed at the front of the case.Have you tried the tip I suggested the other day, of cycling through your RAM chips?-John

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Terry,It sounds like you put the system together yourself, including installing the processor. Did you put Heat Sink Silicone Compound on the processor before installing it? Intel has instructions for doing so on their site and it's suppose to keep the P4 chip cooler. If not, I would recommend you do so.Jim

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Jim,No the system was built locally here in ABQ and I work closly with the tech. We definately know about the Heat Sink Silicone Compound and in fact the shop has some Extra high temp stuff they use.Terry

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John, No I have not had a chance yet to swap the memory. I wanted to wait till my tech got back from his vacation (Viet Nam). That way if something goes wrong, the shop pays for it. I did up date the bios for the motherboard today and did a quick trip from ABQ to PHX without any lock-ups. I did this after a clean reload of FS2002. I also removed my Logitec Wingman Force Feedback stick and replaced it with a old Raider Pro I had picked up at the Kirtland AFB BX a couple of years ago for $19.Terry

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It's fine Terry. I have the same CPU. With stock cooling and running the FSB at 400 with the room temp at 22 the chip is 42 at idle and 48 running full with FS2002. Anything under 60 shouldn't be a worry.TripNorthwood 2.2a at 2.72Ghz Abit TH7II-R512MB Samsung 40ns PC800Gainward GF4 64MB Ti4200 300/57030.30's DX8.1 WinXP ProInwin case / Enermax 431W PSU3DMark2001SE = 12055http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=4088814

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Gideon, Thanks for the link. Looks like I might find a tip or two there. Untill electronics gets away from convetional components on circuit cards , there will always be heat. When I worked on Air Force flight simulators, (F-4E and F-111D) we had to run our building air-conditioners year round even with snow on the ground outside. The sims would generate over 80,000 BTUs of heat per hour from all of the computers (7 on the F-111D) and the support equipment.Terry

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Eagle, My tech when he builds up a system does exactly that same thing to maximize the air flow. Thanks for the thought and hint for the rest of the forum.Terry

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Trip,My 3D mark test do not come close to yours. In fact mine are near the bottom of the chart, even behind the GF-2 cards. 3931 was all my system clocked at just now. See chart below.Something is definately wrong somewhere in my system.Terry GamersHQ

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Terry - Don't dismay on the scores. Your system is probably fine. The first time I ran it on this machine the score was also really low. What I forgot to do was disable the FSAA and anisotropic filtering. If either, or both, of those are activated it will really kill the scores. I use RivaTuner (http://www.guru3d.com/rivatuner/) to tweak the drivers and it's also an easy way to doublecheck the settings before running any tests. As a better score for comparison, I ran one test with no overclocking on either the CPU or the videocard and the score was 10319 (FSB at 400, and the 4200 clocks at 250/513). Doing a fresh install of the 30.30 drivers and turning off the FSAA and aniso filters should get the scores right up where they should be (10,000+).TripNorthwood 2.2a at 2.72Ghz Abit TH7II-R512MB Samsung 40ns PC800Gainward GF4 64MB Ti4200 300/57030.30's DX8.1 WinXP ProInwin case / Enermax 431W PSU3DMark2001SE = 12055http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=4088814

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Trip Thanks I will try it.I belive both were on. As to the drivers. are the 30.30s certified yet?Also I am not into the overclocking thing and what exactly can you tweek and be safe. Terry

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I don't think so. It looks like the last set certified were the 29.80's. But anything from 29.42 on up will do as there is very little speed differences that I can see. As far as the OC'ing goes you might want to boost up the CPU a bit. I wouldn't fool with the video card as the gains to be made relative to the FS2002 framerate aren't much to write home about (but it'll really help with some other games). The only thing you can do with the CPU is change the FSB frequency. If you increase it from 100 to 114 and leave the core voltage at 1.5v you'll boost up to slightly over 2.5Ghz (114 times the locked multiplier of 22) with about a 3 degree rise using the stock Intel cooling. You can't (as in shouldn't be able to) cook the CPU. It will throttle back the speed at 69 degrees to start cooling and shutdown completely before it fries itself. Not a worry as it sounds like you have a pretty well bolted together cooling arrangement. With the Intel heatsink and fan I can boost the FSB to 123 (2.72Ghz) and up the core voltage from the standard 1.5 to 1.625 and it'll run stable for hours at 55-56 degrees with 100% CPU utilization (room temp at 25). How well a particular CPU does is really just the luck of the draw, but my results seem typical of what most folks are seeing with the 2.2's. OC'ing the CPU ranges from impossible on some motherboards (Intel, et al) to really easy on others (Abit, et al) so check with the tech that plugged it in as he should know exactly what's workable.TripNorthwood 2.2a at 2.72Ghz Abit TH7II-R512MB Samsung 40ns PC800Gainward GF4 64MB Ti4200 300/57030.30's DX8.1 WinXP ProInwin case / Enermax 431W PSU3DMark2001SE = 12055http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=4088814

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Below is a schematic of my attempt at a truly cool running system using stock retail HSF on a P4 2.x system. The system also employs an external Cheetah X15 SCSI 160 drive system that is housed remote from the main PC case, and so does not contribute heat or noise in the main box. The diagram shows a kind of shoe that the very thermally efficient Lian Li PC-68 all aluminum case sits on that conducts air into the fully speed controlled intake fans. This air comes from the crawlspace under my PC room, which ranges in temp from wintertime at about 40F at the lowest to 68F absolute tops in the hottest part of the summer, the case is assured of getting a precooled air yearround, sometimes VERY precooled. I would say the average temp is around 55F is just a guess. The "shoe" is just a conduit that communicates via an interior room wall into the crawlspace. By having the dual super quiet Whisper fan Enermax powersuppy controlled with its own rheostat, and each of 4 built in cooling fans (two intake fans down low in the front, and one blowhole in the top center, and the 4th in the top back panel, all controlled with their own rheostat (via the very nicely constructed RheoBus 2.0, one can have all fans moving at a slow pace, which is generally much quieter than having fewer fans at full tilt.The Lian Li cases are good for about 5-7 degrees C temp drop over comparable sized steel cases. A very attractive feature in this case is that there are very few leaks and will therefore work well with this application where I am trying to use cool air from down under. The ambient room temp in this room in peak summer is about 82-84F.I just completed the shoe tonight, and it fits perf! I have the Lian Li, powersupply and RheoBus 2 so far. Still waiting for a 2.8GHz P4 if I can make it that far . . . Can't wait to test the sucker's cooliing potential. My goal was for quiet, cool and fast in all departments, file system notwithstanding. After all the research and queries, I am convinced the Cheetah X15 SCSI drive system will be a very nice asset to complement the rest of the system. I'm still not sure on which OS to use--Win2K Pro or XP Pro. I plan on using 1 GB of PC1066 RDRAM.The other pics are of the RheoBus 2.0. It fits into a free 5 1/4" bay faceplate. I chose the blue LEDs and anodozed silver knurled knobs to compliment the aluminum caseNoel

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Noel, Your case looks very similar to mine with the four drive bays at the top (CD-RW)& DVD) followed by the 3 3.5s (nothing installed there)Then just below those are my two intake fans with washable filter and at the bottom the USB/firewire/headset jacks. Maybe moving the cpu off the desk and down to the floor will pick up a little cooler air. Here in NM we have so much dust that I hate to do that as my only room cooling is via a swamp (evaporative) cooler.Terry

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Trip, I turned off the AA and the test went from 3931 to 8135. Better but not great. At least it is in the ballpark for that particular card . I just tried to fly a flight in the default 747-400 from Frankfurt Germany to Honalulu HI (10hrs 14 min) and the sim locked uped after the second freq change less than 10 miles from the airport. I was flying through clouds at the time and only was uing the AA 2X quince setting instead of the normal X4 mode. This FS2002 is getting old pretty fast. I think I might load a older version just for fun to see if it is indeed the program and or hardware problems.Terry

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Terry - Are you using a Ti4600? I just reread the thread and it looks like I assumed that was it. Also, what motherboard and what type of memory? The lockups are a system-related issue for sure. There's nothing in the default FS2002 that's causing it. - Trip

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I dont know if I can help but just for reference my AMD Althon XP 1700+(1.47Ghz) with Fan that came in retail packege runs at 43C.I've overclocked it to 1964+(1646Ghz) and runs at 49C now.When I used to have AMD Alston 1.2Ghz it run at 50C. I used it overclocked at 1.37Ghz and it run at 54C.

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